Big explosion in west texas, anyone there?

[Hawkmoon]

No reason for gov't to step in here.  I would bet dollars to donuts the plant predates the surrounding structures.  Property owners knew of it and were OK with the risk.  And most will end up OK.  Some, not so much. 

An article I saw said that the plant owners were asked about the possibility of an explosion during the planning process and they stated flat out that it "could not" explode. Based on that, I would have to conclude that the property owners did not know of it and were not okay with the risk.

[Brad Johnson]

Slow-mo of a phone vid.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVzz8NylTwM

From the frame or two prior to the full explosion it looks like the ignition point was slightly away from the main fire, somewhere in the combustion gas column.  I wonder if there was a chlorine source somewhere in the immediate vicinity.  When ammonia gas is exposed to chlorine in high enough concentrations you get nitrogen trichloride, which is some pretty nasty stuff.

Brad

[Tallpine]

Slow-mo of a phone vid.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVzz8NylTwM

From the frame or two prior to the full explosion it looks like the ignition point was slightly away from the main fire, somewhere in the combustion gas column.  I wonder if there was a chlorine source somewhere in the immediate vicinity.  When ammonia gas is exposed to chlorine in high enough concentrations you get nitrogen trichloride, which is some pretty nasty stuff.

Brad

Some folks are claiming it was an incoming missle   

[Brad Johnson]

Some folks are claiming it was an incoming missle   

Yeah, saw that.  I'm sure the conspiracy theorists will latch onto like like a tick to a dog.  Sometimes you have to wonder how some people can remember to breath.  The gross ignorance on display when it comes to basic science is stunning.

Brad

[seeker_two]

 

Some folks are claiming it was an incoming missle   

Maybe the Norks were aiming for Washington DC with their usual stellar accuracy....

[Tallpine]

Yeah, saw that.  I'm sure the conspiracy theorists will latch onto like like a tick to a dog.  Sometimes you have to wonder how some people can remember to breath.  The gross ignorance some people display when it comes to basic science is stunning.

Brad

I thought perhaps that it was some sort of effect with the video, sort of a digital version of a lens flare  

[Azrael256]

In one of the post-explosion cellphone videos, residents speculated that it was a plane crash.  Seems like a reasonable assumption, given the information they had at the time.  I suspect plane crashes account for a large percentage of cornfield-based fiery explosions.  I think I might have made a similar guess with limited information.

Missile strike would have rated a bit lower on the probability scale, but I did turn the shiny side inward by accident.   

[MillCreek]

In one of the post-explosion cellphone videos, residents speculated that it was a plane crash.  Seems like a reasonable assumption, given the information they had at the time.  I suspect plane crashes account for a large percentage of cornfield-based fiery explosions.  I think I might have made a similar guess with limited information.

Or Klingon spacecraft crashes:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broken_Bow_%28Star_Trek:_Enterprise%29

In 2151, a Klingon named Klaang crashes his Klingon K'toch-class scoutship in Broken Bow, Oklahoma. He dispatches his two Suliban pursuers inside a silo, but is then shot unconscious by a corn farmer.

[geronimotwo]

reminded me of a flashover from unburned gases finding an ignition source outside the primary burn zone.

[Stand_watie]

In Texas, they scream "Armadillos !!!"   

Horny Toads

[Fly320s]

Horny Toads

Best keep your back against the wall and don't drop the soap.

[Tallpine]

Best keep your back against the wall and don't drop the soap.

Nah, they were my little buddies in the back yard when we lived in Austin.   

[KD5NRH]

Horny Toads

Yes, we are.

[Stand_watie]

I think they're kinda cute (the reptile, not neccessarily the students).

[seeker_two]

Horny Toads

Only the Texans on the Coast say that....

[p12]

Last I heard was the firefighters putting water on the fire may have triggered the explosion.

[Tallpine]

11 of the 14 dead were volunteer emergency responders.

They need to build statues or name high schools after them.

If they hadn't got the area mostly evacuated, the death toll would likely have been in the triple digits.

[Brad Johnson]

Last I heard was the firefighters putting water on the fire may have triggered the explosion.

You fight anhydrous fires with water just like any other fire.  Who is saying it may have triggered the explosion, and why?

Does anyone know if they had a pile of AN laying around?  Even forty or fifty tons of that laying around during a fire would be... bad.

Brad

[SADShooter]

my organization works very closely with Dallas Fire & Rescue. I never met him, but office-mates worked with Kenny Harris, the Captain who lived nearby and went to assist.

Rest in peace, Captain, with the other brave souls who went after the fire that day.

[p12]

You fight anhydrous fires with water just like any other fire.  Who is saying it may have triggered the explosion, and why?

Does anyone know if they had a pile of AN laying around?  Even forty or fifty tons of that laying around during a fire would be... bad.

Brad

Not really sure what the reported issue is but have heard more than once about water mixing with something at the plant makes a violent gas. Some of the locals are kinda pissed about these statements. They were doing the best that they could. You would think that if they were doing something wrong the firefighter from Dallas that was on the scene and died could have stopped or redirected the efforts. Just keep in mind that this is not an official report via the news. Just things heard from those that know people in the area.

[Boomhauer]

It is very possible that there was another chemical there that mixed with the water and created an explosion. We don't know everything about a scene while we are on it, especially something that you might never even see until you find out later about it.

Also this could have happened:

Never apply water to a large pool of liquid ammonia. Pools of ammonia will autorefrigerate to 28 degrees below 0. Applying relatively warm water will increase the vaporization of ammonia by raising its temperature.

http://www.mda.state.mn.us/chemicals/spills/ammoniaspills/fdresponse.aspx

Water Use

Applying water is the most effective tool to fight an anhydrous ammonia release. Before the decision is made to aggressively attach the release many factors must be reasoned through.

Staging water upwind of a potential ammonia releaseVehicles must approach carefully from up wind or from the side. It is difficult if not impossible to drive across a freshly plowed or muddy field with fire truck apparatus not to mention hauling water out to the site of an ammonia release.

Having enough water is vital. As a rule of thumb, 100 gallons of water is needed for every gallon of product released. A 500-gallon apparatus will only allow a few minutes of support. A long-term sustained attack will require lots of water and in rural locations this means shuttle operations.

If a fire is impinging on the ammonia tank the pressure relief valves must be working properly. Keep the tank cool by applying water on its shell.

Never apply water to a large pool of liquid ammonia. Pools of ammonia will autorefrigerate to 28 degrees below 0. Applying relatively warm water will increase the vaporization of ammonia by raising its temperature.

Before applying water, work with the managers to determine where runoff will flow or pond. A simple earthen dike will contain the ammonia contaminated water for later recovery and disposal.

Using Water to Approach and Secure the Source of an Ammonia Release

    Fog streams provide a protective curtain for a safe approach to the source.
    Attack using 2, 1½ inch lines. Consider additional lines if available.
    Both lines should apply 95 gallons per minute with 100 psi at each nozzle end. (? minutes * 2 lines * 95 gallons = amount of water needed)
    Attack crew should consist of 5 members. A crew leader flanked by a nozzle person and hose handler on each of the leader's sides. All on supplied air.
    The crew leader should be wearing ammonia rated gloves. All must be on supplied air (SCBAs) and enough air must be available.
    Rotate nozzles applying maximum flow with the widest fog pattern.
    Angle your approach to avoid high downwind concentrations.
    A rapid high and wide rotation is more effective for ammonia absorption.
    Nozzle end holders should rotate in unison like the wheels on a bike.
    If a line fails or crew member develops skin irritation evacuate immediately and reassess.
    Narrow sweep when closing in on source.
    Avoid pools of ammonia.
    Force vapors down to the ground
    Narrow fog sweep significantly as you close in on source.
    Crew leader reaches to valve and tightens it stopping flow.
    Decontaminate crew members with water prior to leaving scene. k

[p12]

Heard on the news this am that there was 54k lbs of ammonium nitrate on site. Also heard that if they had more than 400 lbs requires reporting to the feds. If the reports are true that the volume had not been reported, plant owner is toast.

[Tallpine]

Both lines should apply 95 gallons per minute with 100 psi at each nozzle end.

We have one truck that can put out that kind of flow.  Trouble is that is so slow that it might be next Tuesday before it gets there.  Better give us 24 hours notice before you're planning to have an incident.

I think those guidelines are for a leaking tank, not an entire plant on fire.   

I'm not sure if anybody even uses ammonia around here.  Pretty much just hay and livestock.

[Tallpine]

Montana native died in the blast:

http://billingsgazette.com/news/local/family-calls-former-laurel-man-killed-in-texas-explosion-a/article_f3de604f-dac0-5a6d-9e9c-432c9449ffb4.html

[RocketMan]

Watched one news report with before and after aerial video.  Before shot showed covered, open front structure with many ton piles of AN inside.  After shot showed structure was gone, large crater in its place.  Hmmm...