Post by: Rocketman56 on April 06, 2008, 05:09:23 PM
I'm not a big McCain fan.. but with Condi Rice as VP,
I might have to rethink my vote in November..
(Among other things, she's very pro-2A!! Interesting..)
More background: http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/04/dan-senor-condo.html
Thoughts?
Night,
Steve
Post by: Manedwolf on April 06, 2008, 05:13:05 PM
All the opponent has to do is play her soundbite that "We never could have anticipated 9/11" at a time when it was in fact her job to do so, and such things had been part of scenarios and even popular fiction for years.
Post by: Dntsycnt on April 06, 2008, 05:19:51 PM
Post by: nico on April 06, 2008, 05:29:04 PM
Post by: Fjolnirsson on April 06, 2008, 08:30:10 PM
she has way too much baggage as a part of the Bush administration to be a viable candidate for any elected position at the national level
Which means she'll probably be the one picked for McCain's running mate....
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 06, 2008, 08:32:51 PM
Post by: wmenorr67 on April 06, 2008, 08:36:53 PM
Too much baggage from Bush and in my opinion she isn't Presidential material. Gotta remember that the VP is only one heart beat or one bullet away from being President.
Post by: seeker_two on April 07, 2008, 01:32:24 AM
McCain/Rice will lose even faster....
Best bet for VP would be either Kay Bailey Hutchison (TX) or Sara Palin (AK)....female, conservative, and popular with the GOP base.
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 07, 2008, 02:34:45 AM
Who is putting this out there?
Oh.
http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/04/dan-senor-condo.html
Post by: RocketMan on April 07, 2008, 04:59:27 AM
Post by: The Annoyed Man on April 07, 2008, 05:03:03 AM
Quote
McCain will lose.....
McCain/Rice will lose even faster....
McCain/Rice will lose even faster....
Exactly right because nobody wants a Bush third term. 80% of the country thinks we're going in the wrong direction.
Post by: Manedwolf on April 07, 2008, 05:36:27 AM
Quote
McCain will lose.....
McCain/Rice will lose even faster....
McCain/Rice will lose even faster....
Exactly right because nobody wants a Bush third term. 80% of the country thinks we're going in the wrong direction.
You misinterpret that, or are falling for the liberal media's misinterpretation of that.
That can ALSO mean that people feel we're going away from morality, all sorts of things. It is in no way an endorsement of Hilbama's liberal agenda.
People are not saying "Yeah! We need weak defense and higher taxes!".
Post by: roo_ster on April 07, 2008, 06:14:53 AM
Post by: Jamisjockey on April 07, 2008, 06:30:43 AM
Quote
McCain will lose.....
McCain/Rice will lose even faster....
McCain/Rice will lose even faster....
Exactly right because nobody wants a Bush third term. 80% of the country thinks we're going in the wrong direction.
80% of what sampling in what district? And define "wrong direction"! 100% of Muslim Extrimists polled think this country is going in the wrong direction.
Polls and statistics are the tools of liars. You're smart enough not to be a puppet for the liberal media.
Post by: The Annoyed Man on April 07, 2008, 06:40:01 AM
Unemployment is up. Everything that should be up is down. Everything that should be down is up.
Yeah, that's the wrong direction.
Post by: Jamisjockey on April 07, 2008, 06:45:59 AM
The dollar's at an all time low. Gas is at an all time high. The American people have had enough of the Iraq occupation. Bush's approval ratings continue to drop. http://www.hist.umn.edu/~ruggles/Approval.htm
Unemployment is up. Everything that should be up is down. Everything that should be down is up.
Yeah, that's the wrong direction.
Unemployment is up. Everything that should be up is down. Everything that should be down is up.
Yeah, that's the wrong direction.
While your points are all correct, if you're referring to the same poll I heard on the News.....it said none of those things. It only said 80% of Americans think we're heading in the wrong direction.
Again, I'd think that taking a poll that doesn't define which direction is the wrong direction, and using it to back up your own position, is the wrong direction for you......
Post by: HankB on April 07, 2008, 06:50:09 AM
The dollar's at an all time low. Gas is at an all time high. The American people have had enough of the Iraq occupation. Bush's approval ratings continue to drop. http://www.hist.umn.edu/~ruggles/Approval.htm
Unemployment is up. Everything that should be up is down. Everything that should be down is up.
Yeah, that's the wrong direction.
Most indicators (dollar value, gold price, gas prices, unemployment, etc.) headed south after the 2006 elections . . . when Democrats took both houses of Congress.Unemployment is up. Everything that should be up is down. Everything that should be down is up.
Yeah, that's the wrong direction.
Obviously, it's all Bush's fault.
Seriously, the biggest, most major mistake the GOP has done on domestic issues is spend money like drunken sailors in a bordello after two years at sea; for this they were spanked in 2006. (To paraphrase Alan Greenspan, they deserved to lose.)
They haven't learned their lessons, and are still behaving like "Democrat Party Lite" . . . hence their nickname, The Stupid Party.
Personally, even with a few stains on his reputation, I wouldn't mind seeing Newt Gingrich as VP . . . the GOP could do a lot worse . . . and probably will.
Post by: Sergeant Bob on April 07, 2008, 07:02:52 AM
Post by: The Annoyed Man on April 07, 2008, 07:03:16 AM
Quote
While your points are all correct, if you're referring to the same poll I heard on the News.....it said none of those things. It only said 80% of Americans think we're heading in the wrong direction.
Again, I'd think that taking a poll that doesn't define which direction is the wrong direction, and using it to back up your own position, is the wrong direction for you......
Again, I'd think that taking a poll that doesn't define which direction is the wrong direction, and using it to back up your own position, is the wrong direction for you......
Well, JJ, since I'm with the 80%, and we're the Deciders, it's you 20 percenters who are going in the wrong direction.
Post by: Jamisjockey on April 07, 2008, 07:24:18 AM
Quote
While your points are all correct, if you're referring to the same poll I heard on the News.....it said none of those things. It only said 80% of Americans think we're heading in the wrong direction.
Again, I'd think that taking a poll that doesn't define which direction is the wrong direction, and using it to back up your own position, is the wrong direction for you......
Again, I'd think that taking a poll that doesn't define which direction is the wrong direction, and using it to back up your own position, is the wrong direction for you......
Well, JJ, since I'm with the 80%, and we're the Deciders, it's you 20 percenters who are going in the wrong direction.
So, they polled the entire nation, right? Every swinging dick and jane got a phone call from this polling agency?
You're taking a page from Feinstien/Kennedy/Obama/Clinton, et al when you cite a vague poll from a limited sampling and use it to support your position.
But I'm sure Obama will deliver us from all that is evil. Or Comrade Hillary.
Post by: The Annoyed Man on April 07, 2008, 07:42:38 AM
Now if you want to (try to) defend the Bush presidency, go ahead. But don't make believe the American people are actually happy with him and anything to the contrary is just a liberal plot.
Post by: Manedwolf on April 07, 2008, 07:44:18 AM
BLARG HATE BUSH HATE BUSH *foam*
Post by: The Annoyed Man on April 07, 2008, 07:54:45 AM
BLARG HATE LIBERALS HATE SOCIALISTS HATE STATISTS HATE CALIFORNIANS HATE HILLARY HATE OBAMA HATE *foam*
Post by: Jamisjockey on April 07, 2008, 09:07:12 AM
You can sputter and fume and blame all you want JJ. But that doesn't change the fact that the majority of voters are unhappy with the Bush administration and welcome its end. They're also damned unhappy with Congress, BOTH Republicans and Democrats. That means that change is likely ie., get rid of a Republican president and elect a Democrat. We've got three, soon to be two, crappy candidates. However, many people see a McCain presidency as a third Bush term, and nobody wants that. You can bet the Dem candidate will make that crystal clear as McCain huffs and puffs in a frantic attempt to distance himself from Bush.
Now if you want to (try to) defend the Bush presidency, go ahead. But don't make believe the American people are actually happy with him and anything to the contrary is just a liberal plot.
Now if you want to (try to) defend the Bush presidency, go ahead. But don't make believe the American people are actually happy with him and anything to the contrary is just a liberal plot.
Apples and oranges. I never once disagreed with your views on any of the idiots with an (R) or (D) after thier name. However, I wholly disagree with how you're using an ambiguous poll of a limited sampling group to back up your views, and moreso, that you're using the same flawed poll to insist that 80% of people in this country agree with you. Define the wrong direction? The damn poll doesn't define it, so it could mean any number of things. Maybe they sampled the members of the Westboro Baptist Church for all you know.
Post by: Sergeant Bob on April 07, 2008, 10:15:55 AM
PRESIDENT BUSH Overall Job Rating in national polls
See also: Complete trend
Survey
Approve Disap-
prove Unsure Approve
minus
Dates % % % Disapprove
ll
ll
. \ ll /
V
CBS/New York Times 3/28 - 4/2/08 28 64 8 -36
.
Diageo/Hotline RV 3/28-31/08 35 62 2 -27
.
Pew 3/19-22/08 28 63 9 -35
.
FOX/Opinion Dynamics RV 3/18-19/08 30 60 10 -30
.
CBS 3/15-18/08 29 64 7 -35
.
CNN/Opinion Research 3/14-16/08 31 67 1 -36
.
USA Today/Gallup 3/14-16/08 32 64 4 -32
.
NBC/Wall Street Journal RV
3/7-10/08 32 63 5 -31
.
Gallup 3/6-9/08 32 64 4 -32
.
Newsweek 3/5-6/08 30 61 9 -31
.
AP-Ipsos 3/3-5/08 30 66 * -36
.
ABC/Washington Post 2/28 - 3/2/08 32 66 2 -34
.
L.A. Times/Bloomberg 2/21-25/08 34 62 4 -28
.
USA Today/Gallup 2/21-24/08 32 62 5 -30
.
CBS/New York Times 2/20-24/08 30 64 6 -34
.
Pew 2/20-24/08 33 59 8 -26
.
FOX/Opinion Dynamics RV 2/19-20/08 32 59 9 -27
.
Diageo/Hotline RV 2/14-17/08 39 57 4 -18
.
Gallup 2/11-14/08 31 65 4 -34
.
USA Today/Gallup 2/8-10/08 33 61 5 -28
.
Newsweek 2/6-7/08 30 60 10 -30
.
AP-Ipsos 2/4-6/08 30 66 * -36
.
CNN/Opinion Research 2/1-3/08 32 67 1 -35
.
CBS 1/30 - 2/2/08 27 65 8 -38
.
Pew 1/30 - 2/2/08 31 62 7 -31
.
USA Today/Gallup 1/30 - 2/2/08 34 61 5 -27
.
ABC/Washington Post 1/30 - 2/1/08 33 65 2 -32
.
FOX/Opinion Dynamics RV 1/30-31/08 33 60 7 -27
.
NPR LV 1/29-31/08 38 56 6 -18
.
NBC/Wall Street Journal
1/20-22/08 31 63 6 -32
.
L.A. Times/Bloomberg RV 1/18-22/08 34 62 4 -28
.
CNN/Opinion Research 1/14-17/08 34 63 2 -29
.
USA Today/Gallup 1/10-13/08 34 60 6 -26
.
Pew 1/9-13/08 31 59 10 -28
.
Diageo/Hotline RV 1/10-12/08 36 61 3 -25
.
ABC/Washington Post 1/9-12/08 32 66 2 -34
.
CBS/New York Times 1/9-12/08 29 62 9 -33
.
CNN/Opinion Research 1/9-10/08 32 66 2 -34
.
AP-Ipsos 1/7-9/08 34 63 * -29
.
Gallup 1/4-6/08 32 64 4 -32
.
http://www.pollingreport.com/BushJob.htm
Post by: Werewolf on April 07, 2008, 10:21:00 AM
The dollar's at an all time low. Gas is at an all time high. The American people have had enough of the Iraq occupation. Bush's approval ratings continue to drop. http://www.hist.umn.edu/~ruggles/Approval.htm
Unemployment is up. Everything that should be up is down. Everything that should be down is up.
Yeah, that's the wrong direction.
Most of what you describe is a direct result of oil prices. They rise the price of everything goes up. Businesses struggle to move goods at the higher costs for transport, energy, materials etc and people get laid off.Unemployment is up. Everything that should be up is down. Everything that should be down is up.
Yeah, that's the wrong direction.
Why are oil prices up? Well there's increased demand by emerging economies like India and China to be sure but a sizable factor is the Dems and their eco allies refusal to allow off shore drilling, the opening up of fields like Anwar and silly restrictions that make it almost impossible to build new refineries and nuclear power plants.
With the exception of the Iraq war everything you've mentioned above that's wrong with the US today is the fault of the Democrats.
Post by: Werewolf on April 07, 2008, 10:46:56 AM
Seriously:
Being black? Hardly. She's a conservative black and that won't set particularly well with the perceived black demographic.
Being a woman? Maybe? My gut says no.
Pro 2nd Amendment - plus with us but with mainstream America?
She's never held an elected office.
She's a college professor and your every day average 100 IQ type out there doesn't have a lot of use for eggheads.
At best she's performed no better than average as the Sec of State and IMO far worse than many. The best that can be said about her and I am not even sure about this is that she hasn't made us any more enemies. Has she made us any more friends? Done a good job mediating between countries where it is in our interest to do so? What exactly has she done at state that would be a plus for her as Veep?
In short she won't bring anything to the ticket and may hurt it.
Post by: The Annoyed Man on April 07, 2008, 02:09:20 PM
Quote
I never once disagreed with your views on any of the idiots with an (R) or (D) after thier name. However, I wholly disagree with how you're using an ambiguous poll of a limited sampling group to back up your views, and moreso, that you're using the same flawed poll to insist that 80% of people in this country agree with you.
You don't disagree with my views, but you disagree with the flawed data I use to back them up my views, which you agree with? Then what is the basis for your agreement with my views? WTF??? Talk about circular...............
Post by: seeker_two on April 08, 2008, 01:14:29 AM
Post by: Jamisjockey on April 08, 2008, 03:13:50 AM
It's not 80%, his disapproval rating is only about 60%.
PRESIDENT BUSH Overall Job Rating in national polls
See also: Complete trend
http://www.pollingreport.com/BushJob.htm
PRESIDENT BUSH Overall Job Rating in national polls
See also: Complete trend
http://www.pollingreport.com/BushJob.htm
It wasn't a Bush job approval poll, but some ambiguous "do you think the country is heading in the wrong direction" piece of crap.
Post by: Jamisjockey on April 08, 2008, 03:18:05 AM
Quote
I never once disagreed with your views on any of the idiots with an (R) or (D) after thier name. However, I wholly disagree with how you're using an ambiguous poll of a limited sampling group to back up your views, and moreso, that you're using the same flawed poll to insist that 80% of people in this country agree with you.
You don't disagree with my views, but you disagree with the flawed data I use to back them up my views, which you agree with? Then what is the basis for your agreement with my views? WTF??? Talk about circular...............
I never agreed with it, either. My point is simply that you're citing this poll that has a wide, ambiguous statement, to back up your view of what the "wrong direction" is. Thats all.
Post by: wmenorr67 on April 08, 2008, 04:57:05 AM
It's not 80%, his disapproval rating is only about 60%.
PRESIDENT BUSH Overall Job Rating in national polls
See also: Complete trend
http://www.pollingreport.com/BushJob.htm
PRESIDENT BUSH Overall Job Rating in national polls
See also: Complete trend
http://www.pollingreport.com/BushJob.htm
It wasn't a Bush job approval poll, but some ambiguous "do you think the country is heading in the wrong direction" piece of crap.
Plus if you really want to put the blame on the government put it on Congress. It has an approval rating lower than the President's. And who is it again in control of Congress........That is right it is the Democrats.
Post by: The Annoyed Man on April 08, 2008, 06:09:48 AM
Post by: wmenorr67 on April 08, 2008, 06:57:23 AM
Post by: The Annoyed Man on April 08, 2008, 08:15:21 AM
Post by: Matthew Carberry on April 08, 2008, 09:56:08 AM
If you mean me, you're wrong. I've never (yet) voted for a Democrat.
Patiently waiting for the day the Whigs rise again? Me too.
Our day shall come, oh yes, our day shall come...
Post by: grampster on April 08, 2008, 02:21:51 PM
"With the exception of the Iraq war everything you've mentioned above that's wrong with the US today is the fault of the Democrats."
Uhh, actually they are to blame for that too. If the liberal wing of the D's hadn't been totally obstructionist in getting America on a path to energy independence starting in the mid 70's, 911 and much of what occurred prior to that ascribed to Wahbbist Islam would never have happened.
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 08, 2008, 07:34:19 PM
Whyizzit that any criticism of Bush and Republicans is never defended, but met with 'but the Democrats are worse.........' yada yackety quack. The Democrats have never pretended to be the party of smaller, less intrusive, low spending government. That claim always comes from Republicans. A look at their record makes them the hypocrites and makes a mockery of those who have supported them.
Your first bit is obvious baloney. Bush and the GOP are criticized for anything you could possibly imagine a few thousand things you're not looney enough to conceive of. Eg: Blowing up the Towers, creating AIDS, starting a senseless war in Iraq, stealing the Florida 2000 election, and on and on it goes. You'd have to be blind and deaf not to hear Repubs refuting these things right and left. Well, OK, mainly right. but anyway...
Are there a few dozen issues where "the Democrats are worse" is the only real response? Of course. We say that a lot, too.
And as for mockery, well, when a laughingstock laughs at others, it doesn't mean much.
Post by: don on April 08, 2008, 07:50:08 PM
Post by: taurusowner on April 08, 2008, 07:51:58 PM
Quote
"With the exception of the Iraq war everything you've mentioned above that's wrong with the US today is the fault of the Democrats."
Uhh, actually they are to blame for that too. If the liberal wing of the D's hadn't been totally obstructionist in getting America on a path to energy independence starting in the mid 70's, 911 and much of what occurred prior to that ascribed to Wahbbist Islam would never have happened.
Uhh, actually they are to blame for that too. If the liberal wing of the D's hadn't been totally obstructionist in getting America on a path to energy independence starting in the mid 70's, 911 and much of what occurred prior to that ascribed to Wahbbist Islam would never have happened.
Lets not forget who holds the purse strings: Congress. If they wanted the war stopped tomorrow, it would be stopped tomorrow. But they don't.
Post by: gunsmith on April 10, 2008, 04:30:52 AM
enthusiastic about voting for that ticket, right now I may not even vote because things are so FUBAR.
Post by: Jamisjockey on April 10, 2008, 06:44:16 AM
Sound crazy? Consider the black reaction to the O.J. trial.
Yes, it does sound crazy. By your reasoning, Black voters should have come out of the woodwork when Alan Keyes ran for the (R) nomination a few years back (against Dole, or maybe Bush II's first run, can't remember). Again when Sharpton ran for the (D) nomination not too long ago. But they didn't. They won't vote for McCain/Rice. They will support the (D) ticket regardless of who wins.
Post by: Werewolf on April 10, 2008, 06:45:26 AM
I like Condi a whole lot more then McCain...
As veep she could conceivably become president. McCain is 71 and the presidency is a job that is extremely stressful.
Heck - almost anybody can can serve successfully as the veep but what makes Ms Rice qualified to be the President of the United States of America?
Post by: The Annoyed Man on April 10, 2008, 12:02:00 PM
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 10, 2008, 12:36:16 PM
a doddering old fool with a short fuse. He's unpredictable and unreliable. He's actually worse than Bush. He's a fool...
Must resist urge to point out the obvious.
Post by: The Annoyed Man on April 10, 2008, 01:48:53 PM
Quote
Must resist urge to point out the obvious.
That the Republican party is circling the drain?
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 10, 2008, 05:15:35 PM
Post by: taurusowner on April 10, 2008, 07:58:29 PM
Obama promises to withdraw from Iraq ASAP. That alone will win him the Whitehouse.
And doom hundreds of thousands of Iraqis depending on us in the process. And show the rest of the world the US is the paper tiger they think we are. And make a mockery of the office of the President.
But you're fine with all that as long as Obama promises to rob rich people and hand out socialized goodies.
Post by: Jamisjockey on April 11, 2008, 12:42:57 AM
Obama promises to withdraw from Iraq ASAP. That alone will win him the Whitehouse.
And doom hundreds of thousands of Iraqis depending on us in the process. And show the rest of the world the US is the paper tiger they think we are. And make a mockery of the office of the President.
But you're fine with all that as long as Obama promises to rob rich people and hand out socialized goodies.
Best thing I've read in this whole thread.
Post by: The Annoyed Man on April 11, 2008, 06:31:56 AM
Quote
And doom hundreds of thousands of Iraqis depending on us in the process. And show the rest of the world the US is the paper tiger they think we are.
Nobody (except Hannity's audience) is buying this phony 'patriotic' fearmongering any longer. It worked for awhile, but now the majority of the country is sick of it. Give it up.
Quote
And make a mockery of the office of the President.
That's already be thoroughly accomplished by this administration. It may take a long time to restore faith in and respect for that office.
Quote
But you're fine with all that as long as Obama promises to rob rich people and hand out socialized goodies.
I'm not an Obama supporter. I won't be voting for him and doubt he has what it takes to end corporate ownership of our government and restore the middle class, like the two Roosevelts did. If all he's gonna do is raise a few taxes on the wealthy, that won't get the job done. Besides, POTUS doesn't make tax aws. Congress will have to do that.
Post by: MechAg94 on April 11, 2008, 08:07:34 AM
Post by: Manedwolf on April 11, 2008, 08:30:10 AM
I think some of Rummy's decisions made after the invasion were beyond asinine. But we NEED to finish up there, or it'll become just like Afghanistan.
Post by: Perd Hapley on April 11, 2008, 08:39:39 AM
Quote
And make a mockery of the office of the President.
That's already be thoroughly accomplished by Fixed that for you. No need to thank me.
Post by: The Annoyed Man on April 11, 2008, 10:53:12 AM
Quote
Paddy, a whole lot of people might not like the way the war is going, but that doesn't mean they want to pull out.
Doesn't matter what the minority 'want'. The reality is that the
Post by: gunsmith on April 12, 2008, 09:32:09 AM
I really like her
Quote
We don't have the resources, militarily or financially to maintain it indefinitely, like McCain (Bush III) wants.
I bet if we pulled out of the Dem's war in Japan and Germany (the Dems never had an exit strategy for those places) we would have plenty of resources.
Post by: The Annoyed Man on April 12, 2008, 12:57:30 PM
Are we still talking about Condi?
I really like her
I really like her
Quote
We don't have the resources, militarily or financially to maintain it indefinitely, like McCain (Bush III) wants.
I bet if we pulled out of the Dem's war in Japan and Germany (the Dems never had an exit strategy for those places) we would have plenty of resources.If the dog hadn't stopped to pee, he'd have caught the rabbit. If GWB had competent military advice early on, we'd be done with this by now.