Carbon Neutral?

[griz]

In my home state of Virginia, they're building a new Lego factory.  First one in this country if I understand it correctly, so I like that.  But what caught my attention was their claim that they will be "carbon neutral".  Google says they've been carbon neutral since 2007, and I find that easier to believe than an actual factory making the claim.  They supposedly will have solar panels that will provide enough electricity to power them at full capacity.

Whether they are or not, my question is what does the term carbon neutral really mean?  Are there any standards on how you compute such a thing?  In the case of this factory, do they count the construction of a big factory, the hundreds of acres of trees they will cut down, or the 1800 employees driving cars to work every day?  Or is it one of those meaningless phrases like "organic" or natural"?  Anybody know?

[dogmush]

It depends on who's doing the Carbon Neutral certification.

I don't think the US has a gov agency doing it, so something like the non-profit certification outlined here: https://www.climateneutral.org/how-it-works is probably what Lego is doing.  There's several companies that will do that certification with varying levels of scaminess.

Some countries have .gov run boards that do it.  Australia's looks like this:  https://www.nabers.gov.au/ratings/our-ratings/climate-active-carbon-neutral-certification

But in general, yes they try and capture all the carbon emissions from building the factory, employees coming to work, upstream supplies, everything they can think of, and then they will buy carbon credits, plant trees, engineer controls, or whatever to get their little badge.

[WLJ]

And make the Chinese firm making the solar panels happy.

[K Frame]

AFAIK, Legos are injection molded, and it takes a LOT of electric to run the molders because of the amount of heat that is needed to bring the plastics to the correct temperatures. Not to mention all of the other electrical requirements of a modern factory.

That's one hell of a lot of solar.

Plus you need to take into account that Virginia weather can be less than solar friendly...

I just read a news article on it, and it appears that the buildings will have solar on the roofs and there were also be a separate solar park...

Still, I'm having trouble buying it.

Carbon neutral is like assault weapon. Everyone has a pet definition that they can twist and bend and torture so that it meets their needs at their particular time.

The best example of that I ever saw was a dry cleaner claiming to be "organic."

By strict definition of the term, sure, they were organic because their cleaning solvents have carbon in them... But still, that's a huge stretch.

[griz]

It depends on who's doing the Carbon Neutral certification.

I don't think the US has a gov agency doing it, so something like the non-profit certification outlined here: https://www.climateneutral.org/how-it-works is probably what Lego is doing.  There's several companies that will do that certification with varying levels of scaminess.

Some countries have .gov run boards that do it.  Australia's looks like this:  https://www.nabers.gov.au/ratings/our-ratings/climate-active-carbon-neutral-certification

But in general, yes they try and capture all the carbon emissions from building the factory, employees coming to work, upstream supplies, everything they can think of, and then they will buy carbon credits, plant trees, engineer controls, or whatever to get their little badge.

OK, a little more defined than I suspected but still fairly ambiguous.  So by the cost of carbon credits link the typical car owner could claim to be carbon neutral if they paid the right people between $40 and $100 per year. 

[griz]

AFAIK, Legos are injection molded, and it takes a LOT of electric to run the molders because of the amount of heat that is needed to bring the plastics to the correct temperatures. Not to mention all of the other electrical requirements of a modern factory.

That's one hell of a lot of solar.

Plus you need to take into account that Virginia weather can be less than solar friendly...

I just read a news article on it, and it appears that the buildings will have solar on the roofs and there were also be a separate solar park...

Still, I'm having trouble buying it.

That was my impression too.  The links Dogmush provided seem to favor businesses like hotels or offices, for obvious reasons.  Once you start using electricity to do real work, be it running big machines or melting tons of plastic, it seems that's a lot to ask of a solar panel.  Even on a sunny day.

[230RN]

AFAIK, Legos are injection molded, and it takes a LOT of electric to run the molders because of the amount of heat that is needed to bring the plastics to the correct temperatures. Not to mention all of the other electrical requirements of a modern factory.

That's one hell of a lot of solar.

Plus you need to take into account that Virginia weather can be less than solar friendly...

I just read a news article on it, and it appears that the buildings will have solar on the roofs and there were also be a separate solar park...

Still, I'm having trouble buying it.

Carbon neutral is like assault weapon. Everyone has a pet definition that they can twist and bend and torture so that it meets their needs at their particular time.

The best example of that I ever saw was a dry cleaner claiming to be "organic."

By strict definition of the term, sure, they were organic because their cleaning solvents have carbon in them... But still, that's a huge stretch.

Thanks.  I could have written that, especially WRT the quantity of energy involved in the production of plastic parts.

Completely solar?  I was gong to wisecrack "Maybe on a clear day at noon on the equator."

But I didn't manufacture the numbers.

Terry "Don't ever, ever, ever believe press releases, ever," 230RN