Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: GigaBuist on April 24, 2010, 10:59:17 PM
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It's a question that's been bugging me for a few years. 'Cuz that's how long I've owned my house.
It seems to me that the original builders of this house (around 1999) must have had to bring in a really large amount of fill to get it high enough to build on. And, like most decisions made regarding cost, they probably went with the absolute cheapest thing possible if it didn't impact their lives. Kudos to them for that, they were very practical. Or maybe this is just the natural soil in the area. But if that's the case I have no idea how the 60 acre field behind me can grow corn. Whatever.
Basically, you get 3" down in my yard and you hit clay. Took me 30 minutes (at least) to dig a 20" deep 12" wide hole today with a shovel.
When I dropped a bunch of trees in my front yard I got a tractor out here with a 150lb-ish post hole digger hooked up to the PTO for the job. In some areas I had to have my 200lb brother stand on the thing and bounce up and down to get a foot into the ground.
Any ideas? One of my brothers suggested a pick-ax to break the stuff up before digging. Perhaps not a bad idea.
Is there anything I can do to soften this stuff up? Like maybe drop 100lbs of earthworms on the yard and let them do their thing for a couple of years? I'm not looking forward to this every time I want to stick something in my yard.
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Shovel? No.
Pick ax? Yes.
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I buy a 12 pack and make sure the is no one around to hear me cuss the ground as I dig.
I hear gypsum will help break it down but I haven't tried it. If I have much to dig in the clay parts here it is done by machine.
jim
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Detcord.
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Ampho.
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Ampho.
Seriously.
It's what the pros use.
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You could find out if the local university or college has an agricultural extension office.
They'll tell you stuff about soil conditions, if the clay is local to the area. Even come out and take a sample, or let you send them one. Doing that stuff for the community is part of their mission etc.
Although, I think they'd probably only be able to tell you what to do if you want to roto-till the whole yard, rip out all the grass and plant xyz weed which is good for the soil or whatever.
I'd suggest a 2-4 man gas powered auger.
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Detcord.
And...
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.revdisk.net%2Fgal%2FKosovo%2FC4.jpg&hash=e0f501ea61cd81b5a1dd2415897312aea7e50a69)
Does the job quite nicely.
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.revdisk.net%2Fgal%2FKosovo%2FCrater.jpg&hash=259ef96b1b2a56f82d98913511d606829a7d5f74)
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I was just perpetuating an APS meme. I figured the accessories could be inferred. =D
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Detcord in any kind of destructive means is akin to water in cooking--necessary, but not stand-alone. =D
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Detcord in any kind of destructive means is akin to water in cooking--necessary, but not stand-alone. =D
Untrue.
I believe marital issues could be solved by Detcord alone. :angel:
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How about a Claymore?
Or less.
I'm not signing this one so nobody will know who posted it.
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Without heavy machinery? Napalm-B. Tannerite. Rifle.
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Detcord in any kind of destructive means is akin to water in cooking--necessary, but not stand-alone. =D
Unless there's a door you need open, then it works pretty well by itself =D
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Mattocks are for digging; shovels are just for scooping the dirt out after you dig.
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I've fought clay for far too many years. My conclusion is you won't make it easier to remove; all you can do is remove only what is necessary to complete your job.
If I dig a hole I use a post hole digger. Often even that bounces so I use a mattock to bust it up then use the post hole digger to remove only what is necessary. There are times when I fill up a pilot hole with water and leave it for a while. Planting trees and shrubs runs the risk of root bind if the hole is not big enough, therefore the hole is bigger than instructions say. A tiller is a waste of time and money when the ground is as hard as I've seen it. A two man auger is good for lots of plants. A professional with some sort of mechanical power is best to use if you've a larger area to dig up such as a garden.
There ain't no easy way out of it.
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https://www.asseenontvadvisor.com/awesomeauger/index.asp?did=978&refcode=aga5
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Uh... Where do you live?
And I'm guessing that the corn field wasn't processed and scraped and graded for a subdivision.
Corded power drill and long augur bits. Drill every few inches. Then dig...
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How about a Claymore?
I'm confused.
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.a2armory.com%2Fimages%2Fclaymores%2Fclaymore-silver-armoury.jpg&hash=ff93b3fdd82bb8088a44f43fcda81c7efb1b1246)
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(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2Fc%2Fc1%2FUS_M18a1_claymore_mine.jpg&hash=fd484ef04226f0b4b43012cafc762c3a029fbf8b)
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shaped charge first then drop a cratering charge in the hole it makes. >:D
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Corded power drill and long augur bits. Drill every few inches. Then dig...
Exactly my thoughts with the Billy Mays auger thingy. If it holds up to the punishment of using a corded drill it might just do the trick. Gauranteed that "powerful drill" they include is a POS.
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i real powerful drill can be a handful if the auger binds somethings gotta give and i've seen the something be the guy holding it.
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Rent a backhoe and have good dirt delivered.
TC
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i real powerful drill can be a handful if the auger binds somethings gotta give and i've seen the something be the guy holding it.
I've been the something. =D
A friend of mine broke his wrist drilling concrete with a hole hawg. The bit caught a piece of rebar and off to the hospital he went.
Smartest thing I ever saw was the South American (probably Mexican but who knows) kid drilling big holes through plywood with a hole saw and a cordless drill. The drill had a clutch that could be set to release so everytime the saw jammed the clutch slipped instead of the dude getting twisted up. 30 years in the biz and that particular method never occured to me, some foreign kid had to wise me up. ;/ :lol:
I like the rent an excavator idea too though. Those teeny ones are cool. I got the one I used from Home Cheapo.
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i've been the something too on a metal roof thankfully the pile of manure i landed in was nice and soft. sadly it was summer and very ripe
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Hydro-pic &/or electric jackhammer with a spade bit.
A hrydor-pic is just a piece of 3/8 or 1/2 inch about 4 feet long. put a cap on one end & drill an 1/8" hole in it. You can smash the end down so there's just a little hole in the end. set up the other end so you can hook it up to a garden hose. Spray/ drill & work the clay loose. Works great for pre drilling holes for T-posts for fence. You'll need to be within hose distance to a household pressure water supply. That limits things, sometimes.
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It was so much easier when you could go down to the hardware store and walk out with a case or two of dynamite. =D
jim
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Mattocks are for digging; shovels are just for scooping the dirt out after you dig.
This.
Plus diging a "pilot hole" and letting the hose soak the ground fofr 10 minutes helps when it is dry.
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Pickaxe, shovel and/or posthole diggers. And lots of patience.
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Uh... Where do you live?
Out in a rural area of West Michigan. Township consists of 2600ish people.
And I'm guessing that the corn field wasn't processed and scraped and graded for a subdivision.
True, but neither was my house. I live in El Tejon's personal Hell where my neighbors are not only free to, but actually do, have goats and chickens running around in their yard. Dogs barking at all hours in the distance, wood burning boilers billowing smoke, and a very active gun range just down the road. OK, he might like the gun range. :)
Basically I'm right next to a creek and I figure a good amount of fill had to be brought in to make the house work. I'd be happy to PM you the address if you want to look it up on Bing Maps or something. It's a fun spot to live in. Last time I checked Bing out there was an aerial shot of my neighbor burning leaves on my property. I pretty much just treat the 20 yards between our lawns as a DMZ. I own it but he can do whatever he wants there unless it actually impacts my life.
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I like the suggestions of drilling down and using water to soften the clay. Tried that once when digging a 3' wide hole with my brothers and it seemed to work, but I thought maybe we were complicating the matter.
Now, I might be planting a number of evergreens in the front yard soon that will require a 3' wide hole for each one. I'll probably call up the local excavator if that happens and just pay the guy $200 to dig the holes for me.
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Homeless Depot, buy shovel, hire "Day Laborer" standing by the contractor area >:D
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Here you go:
http://www.armedpolitesociety.com/index.php?topic=24099.0
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Rent a backhoe and have good dirt delivered.
TC
Yes, it is better to rent.
Backhoe rentals (https://www.rent1usa.com/equipment/backhoes/)
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Methinks Giga got all of the answers he needed almost 7 years ago.
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How about a Claymore?
Or less.
I'm not signing this one so nobody will know who posted it.
Will a claymore actually make a hole or just embed ball bearings in the clay and make it worse?
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Will a claymore actually make a hole or just embed ball bearings in the clay and make it worse?
M18A1 won't make a very big hole. A Cratering Charge (basically a shaped charged pointed down) does a pretty good job.
Looks like they moved a lot of clay in this picture...
(https://www.army.mil/e2/c/images/2014/07/24/355415/size0.jpg)
Caption:
Engineer Officer Basic students examine an approximately 30-by-20-foot deep crater that was created as part of their first demolition project. A 15-pound shape charge bore a hole into the ground, and a cratering charge was lowered into that hole and detonated. (Photo Credit: Mrs. Melissa Buckley (Leonard Wood))
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And then they were told to put the dirt back in the hole......
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Will a claymore actually make a hole or just embed ball bearings in the clay and make it worse?
Oh, I was just throwing out 'splodey military things when I mentioned Claymores. I think I had in the back of my mind (six years ago) that the projectiles would break up hard clay. Lotsa little shock waves, I guess I was thinking.
Don't hold me accountable for something I said six or seven years ago. :old:
Or yesterday. =D
It was so much easier when you could go down to the hardware store and walk out with a case or two of dynamite. =D
jim
And the only question was "Do you want 'lectric or fused caps with that?"
I don't know that much about explosives, but I knew a guy up in Boulder, Colorado who had a blasting license and we chatted a bit about that. He did a lot of work up in the Pinebrook Hills Subdivision, up in the foothillls, where homeowners wanted boulders broken up and tree stumps removed. He said that a certain hardware store would sell two or three sticks of low-percentage dynamite and fuses sub rosa to individuals who had the balls to DIY it. Except he didn't use the term sub rosa.
He said that was a hangover from the days when lots of mining went on up there in the hills and the claimholders would come in and buy the stuff and it was no big deal back in the day. That hardware store moved out east of town, perhaps just out of the city limits.
I found it amusing that the old retail space of that hardware store was replaced by some kind of pastry-and-coffee shop. Not unlike today's Starbucks. If they had only known that dynamite was stored in their basement at one time, heh.
But that was all long before Boulder turned all snowflakey and hand-wringey and scared of anything that happened with suddenness, whereupon young ladies and effete men are expected to retire toward the fainting couch. :D
He mentioned that there was also a store in Nederland CO which did about the same thing.
Terry, Master Rambler, Living Historian, 230RN
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It's funny, because at the time, this thread would not interest me in the least as we were living in a third floor condo.
Now, having a massive yard that is mostly clay, let me say: Pickaxe. Definitely use a pickaxe. (I've planted four fruit trees and hopefully two more this year. Pickaxe every time.)
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And then they were told to put the dirt back in the hole......
D9's and Grizzly's.... ;)
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Now, having a massive yard that is mostly clay, let me say: Pickaxe. Definitely use a pickaxe. (I've planted four fruit trees and hopefully two more this year. Pickaxe every time.)
You know, renting a skid steer and a large auger might not be as expensive as you think. If you've got some redneck nearby that already owns that combo, you can probably get single holes done for pizza and beer.
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Now, I might be planting a number of evergreens in the front yard soon that will require a 3' wide hole for each one. I'll probably call up the local excavator if that happens and just pay the guy $200 to dig the holes for me.
Any big equipment rental places in your area? A motorized tool carrier with a large auger attachment sounds like what you need.
Brad
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(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.schnadt-usg.com%2Fuploads%2F8%2F8%2F5%2F3%2F88538224%2Ftesmec2_orig.jpg&hash=12681b2500dafa5c965b722e9e722a7ee1a8219b)