Author Topic: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?  (Read 7496 times)

thebucket

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #25 on: January 09, 2009, 12:54:11 AM »
Honestly, I doubt that mom and pops have much to fear from CPSC.  It's a tiny agency -  about 400 people and a budget of ~$156 million (yes, with an m.)  It regulates about 15,000 types of products ("toys" is just one type).

Compare that to other regulatory agencies.

For example, FDA -- $2.4 billion (with a b).  10,000+ employees.  Six product types (pharmaceuticals, medical devices, foods, cosmetics, veterinary medicine, biologics)

CPSC just doesn't have the resources.

The CPSC may not have the resources but imagine what may happen if Mom buys a used toy for her kid at a used toy store, discovers it contains lead then goes after the reseller. The CPSC doesn't have to go after the retailers directly. Or if Mom does research to find out what toys contain lead, goes shopping around the local used toy stores, finds a lead-containing toy then sues store for selling lead toys. Again, any parent with a lawyer becomes the CPSC's enforcer.

Waitone

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #26 on: January 09, 2009, 12:59:40 AM »
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Again, any parent with a lawyer becomes the CPSC's enforcer.
Ding, ding, ding, ding!  We have a winner.  We don't need an agency with funds.  All we need is a hungry Tort Terrorist. 
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Owens

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #27 on: January 09, 2009, 08:13:20 AM »
Don't know the details, but supposedly there is an exemption being allowed for second hand and thrift stores. At least that is according to the news report I saw last night.
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cuchulainn

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #28 on: January 09, 2009, 09:38:03 AM »
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The CPSC may not have the resources but imagine what may happen if Mom buys a used toy for her kid at a used toy store, discovers it contains lead then goes after the reseller. The CPSC doesn't have to go after the retailers directly. Or if Mom does research to find out what toys contain lead, goes shopping around the local used toy stores, finds a lead-containing toy then sues store for selling lead toys. Again, any parent with a lawyer becomes the CPSC's enforcer.
You're confusing product liability law with product safety law.  She can do that regardless of this law under existing product liability law -- but only if she can show damages (which she can't simply by buying the product).  This law doesn't affect that.

The store could get fined if she turns them in to the feds, but those fines aren't of the devastating level of product liability cases.  And we're back to the issue of a small agency with few resources having bigger fish to fry.

State AGs have some powers (http://www.cpsc.gov/about/cpsia/summaries/218brief.html) to enforce this law, but those apply more to stopping the sale of violative products -- as in stopping people who willfully refuse to stop selling them ... and even in such limited cases the AGs are bound by running the cases by the feds.


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Don't know the details, but supposedly there is an exemption being allowed for second hand and thrift stores. At least that is according to the news report I saw last night.
It's not an "exemption."  This broohaha simply is a misunderstanding of the law.  See my originial post in which CPSC clarified that the testing requirements do not apply to resellers -- they never did despite all the news reports to the contrary (Imagine that, a media frenzy over an inaccurate story).

Desertdog

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #29 on: January 09, 2009, 10:22:46 AM »
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(Imagine that, a media frenzy over an inaccurate story).
It seems to me that almost every story is embelished in some way to get more interest.  Some, especially from some MSM, are just propaganda.

coppertales

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #30 on: January 09, 2009, 02:36:06 PM »
Sounds like something the gun banners have up their sleeve.....It would wipe out legal guns with the stroke of a pen......chris3

Tallpine

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #31 on: January 09, 2009, 04:55:46 PM »
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CPSC clarified that the testing requirements do not apply to resellers -- they never did despite all the news reports to the contrary

Darn, and I was so looking forward to selling used copies of Charlotte's Web on the black market ...  =(
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MechAg94

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #32 on: January 09, 2009, 08:25:30 PM »
Even if you are making homemade toys, surely you know what your raw materials are right?  Are you using lead paint?  Are you using banned types of plastic?  You might have to maintain paperwork on the materials you buy though.
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Firethorn

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #33 on: January 09, 2009, 08:43:40 PM »
Even if you are making homemade toys, surely you know what your raw materials are right?  Are you using lead paint?  Are you using banned types of plastic?  You might have to maintain paperwork on the materials you buy though.

About what I was thinking.  If you're making kids toys, it's going to pay to purchase quality goods - avoid paints and such from china.  Maybe get into the commercial side rather than consumer and specify lead-free stuff.

cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #34 on: January 09, 2009, 10:22:22 PM »
Some, especially from some MSM, are just propaganda.


not like wnd and newsmax...
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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Desertdog

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #35 on: January 09, 2009, 10:39:22 PM »
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not like wnd and newsmax...
Your right; that makes 2 papers against how many hundreds of  newspapers, magazines  and how many TV and radio stations/programs?

drewtam

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #36 on: January 09, 2009, 11:30:05 PM »
About what I was thinking.  If you're making kids toys, it's going to pay to purchase quality goods - avoid paints and such from china.  Maybe get into the commercial side rather than consumer and specify lead-free stuff.

But if you're making anything, then you're a manufacturer. The law requires manufacturers of kid's items to test and maintain compliance paperwork on all products. That is a burden on all small businesses, especially home based crafts businesses.
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Desertdog

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #37 on: January 10, 2009, 12:09:35 PM »
Is there any lead based paints manufactured in the USA?  I don't think so.  So if you stick to American paint manufacturers there should be no problem.

cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #38 on: January 10, 2009, 06:19:42 PM »
you can download msd sheets on most paints
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I

drewtam

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Re: Is Feb. 10 financial doomsday for thousands?
« Reply #39 on: January 10, 2009, 08:59:58 PM »
Have you guys ever dealt with gov't regulations as a manufacturer????

Because you're still missing the point. As a design engineer of diesel engines, I've often dealt with the EPA, EU, China, India etc regulations. You're posts keep assuming regulating agencies work on reason and common sense, but they don't. You keep assuming that agencies know what they are doing, but they don't - and since they don't, they make the rules up on the fly.

The point: Even if your raw materials are provably safe, this kind of law requires a manufacturer to still go after testing and documentation for the regulating agency. It may be a burden too great to bear for a small business. It is going to depend on the whim of the authority of how they will enforce and what they might exempt.
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