Environutjobs Want to Ban my Soft & Fluffy Toilet Paper

[Stand_watie]

You can add  Blandin Paper in northern MN to that list too. They plant Norway Pines in nice neat rows, clear out about half of them when the trunks are 4-6" in diameter and harvest the rest when they are 8-10", leaving a couple per acre of the biggest trees still standing and start the process all over.

     Yeah, I figured it was the case all over the U.S., but didn't want to overextend my veritas[/i/] with too much speculation. Now that you mentioned Minnesota, it spurred my recollection that west Michigan softwood forests are also Pine, all planted in neat rows except for the Christmas tree farms which are neat rows of blue spruce. They probably do more than just "leave a couple per acre"... probably plow, and fertilize the soil, and then plant rows of seedlings. My first guess regarding those couple biggest trees you see left standing is they are left for sentimental value, or are in a spot that is more difficult to harvest (and as such are economically less viable). Wind and bird pooping pine cones is less reliable than planting. The biggest trees being left standing is an argument against their being more valuable to harvest than young trees.

[seeker_two]

This is my favoritist part.  

Toilet paper...together with facial tissue...accounts for 5 percent of the U.S. forest-products industry, according to industry figures. Newspapers account for 3 percent.

...at least toilet paper is useful.....and at least crap-free in the beginning.... 

[bedlamite]

     Yeah, I figured it was the case all over the U.S., but didn't want to overextend my veritas[/i/] with too much speculation. Now that you mentioned Minnesota, it spurred my recollection that west Michigan softwood forests are also Pine, all planted in neat rows except for the Christmas tree farms which are neat rows of blue spruce. They probably do more than just "leave a couple per acre"... probably plow, and fertilize the soil, and then plant rows of seedlings. My first guess regarding those couple biggest trees you see left standing is they are left for sentimental value, or are in a spot that is more difficult to harvest (and as such are economically less viable). Wind and bird pooping pine cones is less reliable than planting. The biggest trees being left standing is an argument against their being more valuable to harvest than young trees.

I was told they leave a few big trees for the shade, because if trees are in the shade, they grow up making nice straight long trunks, but if they are in the sun they grow out making them a PITA to harvest along with a lower yield. Some of those big trees are 3-4 feet in diameter and over a hundred feet high. They also don't leave it to nature to replant, they come in with thousands of 2-3 foot high seedlings.

[Boomhauer]

I was told they leave a few big trees for the shade, because if trees are in the shade, they grow up making nice straight long trunks, but if they are in the sun they grow out making them a PITA to harvest along with a lower yield. Some of those big trees are 3-4 feet in diameter and over a hundred feet high. They also don't leave it to nature to replant, they come in with thousands of 2-3 foot high seedlings.

Down here, reseeding with helicopters is not unknown.

[Balog]

I hope they do ban it, and soon. Ban good toilet paper, ban bright light bulbs, confiscate 401ks etc etc. The effing frog needs to get out of the pot.

[Wildalaska]

Ive gotten booted off of more than one Board for unleashing on the revolution/black helicopter loons....

My fav was always the whats your line in the sand threads.....

Screw the JBTs seizing guns, my line in the sand has been reached,,,

Ban the soft and fluffy bingo tickets and Im voting from the rooftops.....me, the Blaser and the hemmies flapping in the breeze...

Its TP that separates the man from the animals...I'm not using my hand and a bucket of water like I did in wierd asian venues...

On a related note, I stayed in a $400 per night hotel in Tokyo with one of those robotoilets...I literally spent two hours on one, just spritzing myself, and drying and heating and cooling...the best was when I got up and it said in a schoolgirl voice..."domo arigato"

WildpreservingmysigAlaska TM

[KD5NRH]

If they're so concerned for the trees, why are they trying to smother out plant life by reducing CO2?

[BMacklem]

What you all may not know...and I can't confirm this at the moment, is here in Wisconsin, there's a counter-advocacy group calling themselves.....(prepare yourselves)
Wisconsinites for
Intenstinal
Production and
Equality.

Or W.I.P.E

They seem to argue that changing to one-ply only will just make people use more sheets to clean themselves, and I think they're right.
They want us to have the liberty of using one, two, three, or four-ply paper to err...wipe.

[RevDisk]

Ive gotten booted off of more than one Board for unleashing on the revolution/black helicopter loons....

Sigh.  They're dark green.  Not black.  Welcome to my world.  Try explaining IR properties of aviation paint to tin foil nutjobs.

I hope they do ban it, and soon. Ban good toilet paper, ban bright light bulbs, confiscate 401ks etc etc. The effing frog needs to get out of the pot.

We both know most people would give up all of those and not even think twice. 

[BridgeRunner]

See, the only way to be *really* environmentally friendly is to reuse the stuff.  Which my family does.  Well, when we have a kiddo in diapers anyway.  In for a penny, in for a pound, and why should I spent money on TP when I'm washing diapers every other day anyway. 

I would like to point out however, that I refuse to recycle anything that I am not going to get the immediate benefit of recycling.  It's about the cash, not the pseudo-environmentalist policy crap.

[Perd Hapley]

Sigh.  They're dark green.  Not black.  Welcome to my world.  Try explaining IR properties of aviation paint to tin foil nutjobs.

Let it go, man.   

[Scout26]

Sigh.  They're dark green.  Not black.  

They spray paint 'em black after they your factory to give you "plausible deniability."  Either that or your one of "Them".

[adds another layer of tinfoil, causing my spine to compress from all the weight.....]

 

[BridgeRunner]

A friend on mine refers to his dark green Saturn's color as "black helicopter green."

The man is *seriously* invested in tinfoil, btw.

[Lee]

If they really cared, they would volunteer to recycle the used cushy TP.

[Perd Hapley]

You can tell the ones that don't wear their tin foil.  The mind control rays make 'em think black is green! 

[French G.]

Mark my words, Odin as my witness. If my soft and fluffy toilet paper goes away, I'm gonna start wiping with hippies. On second thought, that wouldn't be very sanitary. I'll go over to the CEO of the tp company, and use his tablecloth, instead.

I was thinking hippie dreadlocks myself, but then I said. "Self, the object is to get cleaner, not dirtier." So, I switched to the ultra-soft environmentally friendly alternative. Baby seal fur.

[White Horseradish]

I wish them people worried about trees would fight the giant piles of paper in my maibox. Useless advertising for crap I will never buy...

[Balog]

Sigh.  They're dark green.  Not black.  Welcome to my world.  Try explaining IR properties of aviation paint to tin foil nutjobs.


We both know most people would give up all of those and not even think twice. 

I've been wondering about it, actually. I'm starting to think removing creature comforts is about the only thing that actually would get people to care. Let's ban beer and cigarettes and "unhealthy" food too. Have temperature police making sure you aren't wastefully keeping your house over 45* in the winter. Maybe people would care then. Maybe.

No, I'm being more misanthropic than usual now. People are stupid, apathetic, and don't really care about freedom but they can be driven to do the right thing eventually.

[MicroBalrog]

No, people wouldn't.

Because they won't ban cigarettes overnight.

THey'll whittle away at the percentage of smokers in society with taxes and regulations and propaganda - today, only about 21% of adult Americans smoke. In 1949, the number was 44%.

Nobody will be willing to stand up and oppose cigarette excise taxes and regulations as a violation of rights and liberties. By the 2010 election, the percentage of smokers in society is expected (by the NIH) to hit 15-19%. Unless a massive shift in the political landscape occurs, smoking will eventually decrease to the point where banning tobacco will become feasible. Only when it has decreased until smokers have become politically irrelevant will they ban tobacco.

[Balog]

Hence my wishing they'd ban it nao. That was actually kinda the point I was making.

[MicroBalrog]

People believe themselves generally free because most of the things they personally want to do, or are used to doing in their personal life, are either legal or restricted in ways they find tolerable. That other people - who want to do things they don't particularly want to do - are restrained is of very little relevance to them - so as far as they are concerned, they already live in a semi-libertarian society.

The fact that other people are being trampled upon - and that they themselves would have far more options and wealth if they were free - is of very little relevance to most people.

After all, we're not being oppressed, are we?

[French G.]

No, people wouldn't.

Because they won't ban cigarettes overnight.

THey'll whittle away at the percentage of smokers in society with taxes and regulations and propaganda - today, only about 21% of adult Americans smoke. In 1949, the number was 44%.

Nobody will be willing to stand up and oppose cigarette excise taxes and regulations as a violation of rights and liberties. By the 2010 election, the percentage of smokers in society is expected (by the NIH) to hit 15-19%. Unless a massive shift in the political landscape occurs, smoking will eventually decrease to the point where banning tobacco will become feasible. Only when it has decreased until smokers have become politically irrelevant will they ban tobacco.

Good analysis, I get Balog's point though. It's why I think every man, woman, and child of every color and religion should be issued an AR-15 here in America. Make it as commonplace, accepted, and expected as possible. I rarely ever smoke, but despise the anti-smoke nazis.

[Balog]

Micro, I once again find myself wondering why you are so antagonistically agreeing with me. You keep "refuting" my argument, by making the same damned point I am. Are you even reading what I'm writing?

[MicroBalrog]

Micro, I once again find myself wondering why you are so antagonistically agreeing with me. You keep "refuting" my argument, by making the same damned point I am. Are you even reading what I'm writing?

What I'm getting it is that the time to become outraged, to 'revolt', to do all of those things you're talking about, has not merely 'come', it has not merely 'passed', it has probably passed YEARS ago. We are supposed to be outraged now. We were supposed to be outraged yesterday.

Modern society as it stands today has been shaped, to a vast extent, by dead guys like Thorstein Weblein, and Maynard Keynes, and Lester Ward. They have created ideas that had later led other people - like Brandeis, and Holmes, and FDR, and Ben-Gurion, and legions of others, not just in America, but throughout Western Civilization to create social and cultural institutions which are incredibly, mindblowingly, Cthulhuistically evil, and they are already here. And even though these guys are dead, they are still in charge, far more in charge than people like you and me, even though they're dead and we're alive, and that outrages me as a person to a deep visceral level.

What gets me, really, that you seem to share my evaluation of the basic facts of this, but you don't seem to share my emotional evaluation about it.

[Balog]

What gets me, really, that you seem to share my evaluation of the basic facts of this, but you don't seem to share my emotional evaluation about it.

/facepalm


I'm discussing ways to get people outraged, dude. I agree wes. civ. has gone to a bad place, but what counts isn't how I feel. It's how the majority of people who vote feel. And massive emotional responses to things that are beyond my control are not healthy. Just because I'm not frothing at the mouth on teh intarwebz doesn't mean I'm happy about it. But frothing at the mouth attracts other mouth frothers. And yes yes yes I know your feelings about suits, wookiee vs 3 piece. We disagree on tactics, ok? No need to attack me when we agree alright? I like arguing on the internet as much as the next guy, but it gets annoying to have to fight the people who agree with you.