Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: Ron on March 10, 2019, 06:50:56 PM
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Trump will lose me in a heartbeat if he goes this route.
I voted to get out of the Middle East, period.
So far we have a lot of talk but we’re still there.
Good read:
https://www.traditionalright.com/the-view-from-olympus-the-next-stupid-neocon-war/
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Yeah that's a deal killer for me too.
The problem, with regards to the last election was elect Trump and (allegedly) get out of the Mideast, or let Hilary cheat her way in and immediately throw down with the Russians.
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Sounds more like a translation error. I highly doubtful Israel wants another war.
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IMO, we need to stay out of the middle east, but I'd be OK with another Sunni/Shia war. Especially one where it drew Jihadis back from Europe.
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War with Iran? NO.
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The fact that the U.S. was manipulated by unregistered Israeli agents into the war in Iraq is not widely known, at least to the public.
What exactly is a "unregistered agent"?
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What exactly is a "unregistered agent"?
Something that has no meaning but sounds scary.
That whole paragraph (hell, the whole article) sounds like a rehash of the tired Worldwide Jewish Conspiracy(tm) codswallop.
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Something that has no meaning but sounds scary.
That whole paragraph (hell, the whole article) sounds like a rehash of the tired Worldwide Jewish Conspiracy(tm) codswallop.
Along the lines of what I was thinking
Article strikes me as something written decades ago that they dust off once in a while and insert whoever is president at the time.
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Was Israel in favor of, or pushing us towards the Iraq invasion?
Weren’t the staff of most neo-con “conservative” publications pushing the Iraq fiasco in fact Jewish and in most cases dual citizens?
Isn’t Israel in favor of us, the USA, doing something about Iran?
That doesn’t mean Israel isnt an ally, an important ally.
That doesn’t mean that there aren’t in fact Jewish conservatives and MAGA Jews, our allies.
Are you so conditioned that any questioning of Israeli motives, Jewish neocon motives or questioning whether Israel’s interests are in our best interests, that the questioner automatically becomes suspect?
Pointing out that a nation pushing the old “hey, why don’t you and him fight” line on us isn’t anti Semitic.
This why we are f’d. The folks on the right cannot even stand for their own self interest. Stupid party indeed.
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Just to clarify, I’m not saying you guys are stupid.
Knee jerk racism and irrational discrimination doesn’t do a cause any good.
Swinging the other direction and giving groups, nations or particular people the special privilage of being above criticism doesn’t do a cause any good either.
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Does Israel do things in it's own self interest?: Yes
Does Israel have influence in the US?: Yes
Does Israel influence US foreign policy?: Yes
Does Israel control US foreign policy? : No and that's where I and the article part ways
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Does Israel do things in it's own self interest?: Yes
Does Israel have influence in the US?: Yes
Does Israel influence US foreign policy?: Yes
Does Israel control US foreign policy? : No and that's where I and the article part ways
The article doesn’t say Israel controls US policy.
He makes the obvious point that the country was manipulated into the Iraq war, by what we fondly call neo-cons.
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The article doesn’t say Israel controls US policy.
He makes the obvious point that the country was manipulated into the Iraq war.
Doesn't come out and say it but it gives me that impression.
Besides, I don't think Bush Jr. needed any manipulation, he needed an excuse.
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Here is an article from 2015 laying out the neo-con agenda.
It was pretty prescient.
I suspect the unregistered agents are the folks mentioned in the article.
Maybe they are all good guys and have your best interest at heart. I’m doubtful.
Reading past all the rhetoric in the article there are still some things that make you go “hmmm”.
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-07-26/meet-kagans-seeking-war-end-world
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The "Manipultion"to get us into Ira was done by the CIA and their sources that turned out to be Anti-Saddam activists (n unreliable sources such as Ahmad Chalabi and Rafid Ahmed Alwan al-Janabi) that weren't in Iraq, but thought that they would gain power/become rich if they could get the USA to overthrow Saddam and "put them on the throne" so to speak.
Getting back to the OP and the article in question. I will repeat that the writer took the bad translation in a tweet and ran with to make up a "US to go to war with Iran" article, out of whole cloth.
It's complete and utter bush-wa.
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....Getting back to the OP and the article in question. I will repeat that the writer took the bad translation in a tweet and ran with to make up a "US to go to war with Iran" article, out of whole cloth.
It's complete and utter bush-wa.
Except for the part where Israel wants us to do something about Iran.
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We, the Saudis, the Israelis, and just about everyone else in the Mid-East want us to "do something about Iran". Which we have by withdrawing from the Iran deal and reimposing sanctions.
But there has been no other movement on doing anything about Iran from the Trump administration. But again, the entire premise of the article is based on a bad translation (war vs combating) to create a boogyman. To clarify, it's utter bullshit.
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^^^^^
What she said
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I hope you are right.
I doubt you are though.
They even floated a bs story about Hamas in South America recently :facepalm:
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What exactly is a "unregistered agent"?
Agents working on behalf of foreign sovereigns are required to register with the U. S. Government. This allows them to operate legally if they follow the rules.
It does not include agencies like the KGB, RVs, Smersh, Thrush, or the United Network Command for Law Enforcement. Those are secret intelligence agencies. Or fake tv show spy agencies. [tinfoil]
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You forgot SPECTRE.
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You forgot SPECTRE.
Nobody's perfect. =D
Ooops, ALSO forgot CONTROL and KAOS.
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Nobody's perfect. =D
Ooops, ALSO forgot CONTROL and KAOS.
Beat me to it.
Also
SHIELD & Hydra
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Bibi has been beating the war drums against Iran for a long time.
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After sleeping on it I’ve also come to the conclusion that it wasn’t an unintentional mistranslation.
It could have been but I doubt a blunder that huge just happens and gets published without somebody pointing out the enormity of such a comment.
The odds are better than 50/50 it was on purpose. It was a message, maybe not to us but a message nonetheless.
This one thing we can all agree on though.
The people of the USA were not in favor of a land invasion of Iraq and had to be lied to, misled and subjected to months of propaganda before the government felt they had enough support to go forward.
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Bibi has been beating the war drums against Iran for a long time.
Weren't the Israelis threatening an air strike on Iranian nuke sites a few years back. I believe Obama pulled out the stops to keep them from doing it. I did hear they flew air missions deep into Syria as a demonstration to show they could get strike aircraft far enough and through Syrian air defenses.
I agree with Ms Shumer. Pretty much every strategic enemy of Iran is pushing for us to take more action against Iran. I am sure there are war hawks in the govt who would love to see it happen.
What I don't see is why anyone would look at this as some sort of conspiracy. IMO, it is just politics. My impression is that Trump is not a war hawk President. I get the impression he would rather pull troops out of Iraq and Afghanistan both if it was a simple solution. My concern (if any) would not be for the Trump Admin, but the next administration after this one and who might be in charge then. I am not going to worry about that now.
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If Israel and Saudi Arabia want to invade Iran, let them do it.
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Israel has spoken before about going alone to possible preventative nuke strikes on Iran if necessary. I believe it was phrased along the lines of they are not going to wait until a mushroom cloud goes up over Tel Aviv.
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Israel has spoken before about going alone to possible preventative nuke strikes on Iran if necessary. I believe it was phrased along the lines of they are not going to wait until a mushroom cloud goes up over Tel Aviv.
This. Just like they did to Iraq, ten years before Desert Storm.
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I started my current job in 2013, and a co-worker started telling me we were going to be at war with Iran pretty soon. He kept predicting it for months. Now he keeps expecting we'll send troops to Venezuela.
A lot of people spend an inordinate amount of time worrying about Joos.
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This. Just like they did to Iraq, ten years before Desert Storm.
So Israel kept making war mongering noises towards Iraq.
Then we invaded Iraq.
Not sure how that helps your argument.
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So Israel kept making war mongering noises towards Iraq.
Then we invaded Iraq...twice.
Not sure how that helps your argument.
Just try to make sure no more Bush's run for President. That seems to be another common thread.
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So Israel kept making war mongering noises towards Iraq.
Then we invaded Iraq.
Not sure how that helps your argument.
Nope, Israel did a one and done air raid on Iraq's nuclearreactor. They weren't pushing us into a war with Iraq. Remember that Iraq invaded Kuwait, so it was the Kuwaitis and Saudis who were screaming for American troops, not Israel. Also, if you recall Iraq was trying to drag Israel into the war by launching SCUDs at them. Otherwise, Israel was pretty content to sit it out. Nor did they "push" us to go to war.
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Our Middle East policy sure doesn’t seem to be based upon the will of the American people nor what is best for our nation.
The Iraq invasions and 9/11 were used to manipulate us into the tar baby of making the Middle East “safe” for Democracy.
The USA is less safe now.
The USA is less free now.
Who does our failed policy benefit, by design or accident? Certainly not you or me.
Israel and Saudi Arabia are certainly in a better place without Saddam, with us “policing” Afghanistan, without Gaddafi, with a weaker Syria, (even though they failed to bring down Assad).
I don’t care if our failed policies were a conspiracy or if it was just hubris that drove our government to try and impose its will, or a USA/Israeli/SA vision on the region by military force.
Trump was elected in part to get us out of the quagmire. So far his grade is a D-
Trumps stance against Iran might be opening bid bluster, we’ll see.
He wasn’t elected to start another war where we are a proxy for other regional powers.
He was elected to stop that *expletive deleted*it.