Author Topic: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine  (Read 8955 times)

Manedwolf

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #25 on: February 11, 2009, 04:21:39 PM »
Because our Government produced the most epic intelligence failure EVER IN HISTORY.

"Bin Laden Determined to Strike America."

Can TATP be made in England, and somehow teleported to a NYC bridge or tunnel? Or would a human have to bring it? Have the terrorists recruited Hiro Nakamura!?!?!?!

You don't even know what TATP is.  :lol:  ;/

Balog

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #26 on: February 11, 2009, 04:23:43 PM »
Quote from: French G.
I was always pleasant, friendly and within arm's reach of a gun.

Quote from: Standing Wolf
If government is the answer, it must have been a really, really, really stupid question.

Seenterman

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #27 on: February 11, 2009, 04:38:26 PM »
 =|

Quote
Can TATP be made in England, and somehow teleported to a NYC bridge or tunnel? Or would a human have to bring it? Have the terrorists recruited Hiro Nakamura!?!?!?!

Its an explosive, did I miss something. My questions still valid can it be made in England and transported here without detection?

Or would someone have to PHYSICALLY MAKE IT HERE.

Or is it some super kool new terrorist weapon that spontaneously appears and bombs key locations picked by Osama Bin Ladens brain waves?

Sorry you had such a hard time understanding that but I bolded the important part for you hope that helps!
« Last Edit: February 11, 2009, 05:10:32 PM by Seenterman »

jackdanson

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #28 on: February 11, 2009, 05:52:00 PM »
Quote
Nobody's dismissing them, but the threat of a few homegrown nutcase white supremacists is admittedly far less than that of massive international networks of Islamist extremists funded by oil money. That's all.

Backwoods bomb makers do not have the backing of Saudi oil sheiks, or the entire state of Iran...

Agreed.

I was just irked a bit when you seemed dismissive of the homegrown terrorism.  One guy with a truckload of explosives could easily kill 1000+ people with correct placement.  Not every threat to the US comes in an islamic form.

Leatherneck

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #29 on: February 11, 2009, 07:16:11 PM »
This thread is turning into a big "Mine is bigger than yours." Stop, please.

This obviously was a serious threat, but the good news is that the wacko's wife offed him before he could turn his trust fund into real damage.

Anybody who doesn't think Jihad warriors are a real threat here in America, despite the blocking of any serious activity by the Bush administration is either smoking something bad, or truly ignorant.

TC
TC
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MicroBalrog

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #30 on: February 11, 2009, 07:17:41 PM »
A real threat? Sure.

There's a difference, again, between believing that something isn't a threat and differing in the estimation of whether the threat justifies all the resources - human, political, and economic - spent on combating it.
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Manedwolf

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #31 on: February 11, 2009, 10:29:39 PM »
A real threat? Sure.

There's a difference, again, between believing that something isn't a threat and differing in the estimation of whether the threat justifies all the resources - human, political, and economic - spent on combating it.

Like Israel said "no" to efficient truck-mounted lasers that were proven to shoot down everything from Katyushas to even mortar shells in flight, so gets hit every day with the rockets instead?

MicroBalrog

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #32 on: February 11, 2009, 10:30:52 PM »
Like Israel said "no" to efficient truck-mounted lasers that were proven to shoot down everything from Katyushas to even mortar shells in flight, so gets hit every day with the rockets instead?

Israel does not get hit every day with rockets.

Second, we said "Yes" to Nautilus. Namely, "yes" to throwing more money on local contractors to "develop and test it" for a few more years.
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PTK

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #33 on: February 11, 2009, 10:34:52 PM »
Quote
Its an explosive, did I miss something. My questions still valid can it be made in England and transported here without detection?

Or would someone have to PHYSICALLY MAKE IT HERE.

Or is it some super kool new terrorist weapon that spontaneously appears and bombs key locations picked by Osama Bin Ladens brain waves?

You're serious. Really. Okay, then...

Tri-acetone tri-peroxide is VERY old in terms of organic explosives. It is made with HCl, H2O2, and acetone. It is unstable, relatively shock sensitive and not easily transported.

Luckily, it's so easy that 10 year olds have no problem making the stuff in huge quantities. In so many words, it's so cheap/easy to make that it isn't worth making in a central location to transport.

Other explosives in this category (organic peroxides, easily made) are HMTD and MEKP. TATP, HMTD, and MEKP are all able to be made in a few hours in large amounts from supplies you get in any decent hardware store, and with chemistry that children have no problem mastering.
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Bigjake

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #34 on: February 11, 2009, 11:11:59 PM »
Agreed.

I was just irked a bit when you seemed dismissive of the homegrown terrorism.  One guy with a truckload of explosives could easily kill 1000+ people with correct placement.  Not every threat to the US comes in an islamic form.

By that logic, I'M ON ALL OF THOSE LISTS, just from the amount of fertilizer and diesel  I buy for the farm every year.   ;/

Evil people will find a way to pull evil *expletive deleted*it off, no matter how vigilant we are.

You just have to prioritize which evil folks you spend time keeping track off.


Perd Hapley

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #35 on: February 11, 2009, 11:27:26 PM »
Last I heard I though the CIA was saying that Al-Queda in Iraq was damn near crippled, they are still launching disorganized attacks again our troops, and bombings but is no where near pre 9/11 levels of orginization.

If you're talking about AQ in Iraq, that would be only one part of Al Qaeda.  Or is it a separate group altogether?  I disremember.
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Ryan in Maine

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #36 on: February 12, 2009, 01:41:03 AM »
Cabin fever.  ;/

Bogie

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #37 on: February 12, 2009, 09:13:08 AM »
I don't understand some of this - you say that because you haven't seen something happen, that it won't happen... That is NOT logical. Think like a terrorist. What would you do? I'd be getting as many deep cover folks into the US as possible, with minimal connectivity, so that if one gets busted, he won't take the whole network.
 
In addition, and compounding/confounding this, a lot of our law enforcement people WANT the problems to be "homegrown." They don't get budget for overseas stuff. Which is why they didn't pay attention prior to 9/11... We probably have more FBI in the AB and various bohunk "militias" than actual members... Remember how they spent more on surveillance of that klucker Randy Weaver's than we did on recon for the invasion of Grenada?
 
Add in the "conspiracy theory" stuff about extra conspirators for OK City, etc., and things become weirder and weirderer...
 
« Last Edit: February 12, 2009, 09:30:31 AM by Bogie »
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #38 on: February 13, 2009, 01:29:47 PM »
Good going there, Master Race.  You got owned by the little woman.  The Fuhrer is not proud of you today, son. 
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Seenterman

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #39 on: February 13, 2009, 01:53:42 PM »
Quote
You're serious. Really. Okay, then...

Tri-acetone tri-peroxide is VERY old in terms of organic explosives. It is made with HCl, H2O2, and acetone. It is unstable, relatively shock sensitive and not easily transported.

Luckily, it's so easy that 10 year olds have no problem making the stuff in huge quantities. In so many words, it's so cheap/easy to make that it isn't worth making in a central location to transport.

Other explosives in this category (organic peroxides, easily made) are HMTD and MEKP. TATP, HMTD, and MEKP are all able to be made in a few hours in large amounts from supplies you get in any decent hardware store, and with chemistry that children have no problem mastering.

Ok your must not have read my other posts. Im trying to clarify that IMO domestic terrorist are a greater threat and AQ in Iraq. Why? I've stated in my other posts that a domestic terrorist would already be here, more likely be a "lone wolf" which is much harder for intelligence agencies to detect, and probably look like a caucasian american. I think your post actually proves me right, because Hey if all the componds are found in a hardware store, then all Joe Iwanablowsomenup just goes down to his local ACE hardware purchase said materials, assemble them in garage, and then picks a spot to go boom.

My responce was to a poster who stated

Quote
Ever hear of recruitment and brainwashing? Going on in the UK especially, radical imams recruiting youth.

and then brought up TATP. My responce was basically, that their in England. If there radicalized over their most likely they will eathier travel to Iraq, or Iran to fight with the insurgency, or bomb something in England. If they are radicalized in England and decied they want to do something evil in America, they would have to get a greencard, travel over here, set up a residence, scout a location, buy his supplies, assemble his supplies, and then execute an attack. During that process hopefully he would be picked up on the radar of some intelligence agency before he could succeed.

No where did I try and say that AQ, and Islamic terrorists are no longer a threat, but their more of a threat to our soliders in Iraq and Afganistan than to civilians in the U.S. Most of the arrests I belive that have taken place in the U.S. in relation to Terrorism have been domestic terrorists that have radicalized by extremist islamic views but have no direct connection to AQ.





makattak

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #40 on: February 13, 2009, 02:25:49 PM »
Quote
My responce was basically, that their in England. If there radicalized over their most likely they will eathier travel to Iraq, or Iran to fight with the insurgency, or bomb something in England.

I have nothing to add to this debate, I simply could not let these sentences pass where the words "they're, there, and their" had been so confused.

Please:

they're= they are (as in, they're in England)
their= possesive of they (as in their radicalized tendencies)
there= place (over there).



Grammar police out.  :police:
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Seenterman

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #41 on: February 13, 2009, 02:48:06 PM »
LoL Im posting from work as my home comp is broken. Looking back now yes my grammer sucked, but if thats the only thing you can find a flaw in with my arguement maybe you should try to find something more substantive to post about.

 ;/

Manedwolf

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #42 on: February 13, 2009, 02:59:36 PM »
LoL Im posting from work as my home comp is broken. Looking back now yes my grammer sucked, but if thats the only thing you can find a flaw in with my arguement maybe you should try to find something more substantive to post about.

 ;/

It's an issue of presentation.

In a text-based medium, sloppy typing, sloppy spelling, and broken grammar come across as being dressed poorly. To me, it's always given the impression of someone who is slurring.

Just advice. Slow down, edit, and then post. It gets your points across a bit better, and people will take what you're saying a bit more seriously. You don't need to blame the hardware. Half of my posts are from an iPod Touch.

Viking

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #43 on: February 13, 2009, 03:18:30 PM »
It's an issue of presentation.

In a text-based medium, sloppy typing, sloppy spelling, and broken grammar come across as being dressed poorly. To me, it's always given the impression of someone who is slurring.

Just advice. Slow down, edit, and then post. It gets your points across a bit better, and people will take what you're saying a bit more seriously. You don't need to blame the hardware. Half of my posts are from an iPod Touch.
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RocketMan

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #44 on: February 13, 2009, 03:27:32 PM »
Viking, it is generally a pleasure to read your posts.  Your English is quite good, very readable, and easily understood.
There are some native English speakers (on this board, even) that are not half as proficient as you in the language.
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Viking

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #45 on: February 13, 2009, 03:30:20 PM »
Viking, it is generally a pleasure to read your posts.  Your English is quite good, very readable, and easily understood.
There are some native English speakers (on this board, even) that are not half as proficient as you in the language.
Thanks for the kind words. =)
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jamz

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #46 on: February 13, 2009, 05:17:59 PM »
Half of my posts are from an iPod Touch.

I used to like you, Maned.   

 :lol:
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Antibubba

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #47 on: February 14, 2009, 12:58:36 AM »
Quote
Tri-acetone tri-peroxide is VERY old in terms of organic explosives. It is made with HCl, H2O2, and acetone. It is unstable, relatively shock sensitive and not easily transported.

Luckily, it's so easy that 10 year olds have no problem making the stuff in huge quantities. In so many words, it's so cheap/easy to make that it isn't worth making in a central location to transport.
 

Given it's instability, though, you'd better have a reliable supply of 10 year olds.
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PTK

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #48 on: February 14, 2009, 02:05:58 AM »
It's not that unstable except when stored improperly or for long periods of time. It's just way too unstable to take across the ocean on a plane.  =)
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Gewehr98

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Re: Dirty Bomb plot uncovered in Maine
« Reply #49 on: February 14, 2009, 02:11:58 AM »
Quote
This thread is turning into a big "Mine is bigger than yours." Stop, please.

Yes. Indeed it is.

Consider it stopped.

And the staff is getting pretty tired of the number of reported posts we're receiving.

They're from, and about, the usual suspects - surprise, surprise.

Cabin fever may explain it, I dunno.

The signal to noise ratio has been pretty poor, though.

The level of civility?  That went out the window a while ago...


« Last Edit: February 14, 2009, 02:15:32 AM by Gewehr98 »
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