F-22 Raptors are having problems

[Balog]

What kind of argument is this?

The Osprey spent 18 years from first flight to its formal introduction. 26 if you count from program commencement. And yet it is an amazingly useful thing.

We have been at war all 6 years this aircraft has been in service. It has not been used once in a combat scenario. That doesn't seem off to you?

[birdman]

Actually it has.

[Balog]

Oh? I'm certainly ready to accept that the story is not accurate, but I'd be interested to hear about the mission and how it performed.

[birdman]

Oh? I'm certainly ready to accept that the story is not accurate, but I'd be interested to hear about the mission and how it performed.

Depends what you define as combat.  Missions of critical transport, over enemy occupied territory, yes.  Hot LZ, no.  But then again, the vast majority of aircraft don't do hot LZ missions, and the v-22 wasn't designed for that.

In fact, I have heard from a few people that the v-22 is highly valued as it has the response speed and range to "shrink" countries.

[Balog]

Depends what you define as combat.  Missions of critical transport, over enemy occupied territory, yes.  Hot LZ, no.  But then again, the vast majority of aircraft don't do hot LZ missions, and the v-22 wasn't designed for that.

In fact, I have heard from a few people that the v-22 is highly valued as it has the response speed and range to "shrink" countries.

Oh, you're talking about the Osprey. I was still referring to the Raptor, the Osprey was merely Micro's counter.

[makattak]

Oh, you're talking about the Osprey. I was still referring to the Raptor, the Osprey was merely Micro's counter.

Ok. We've been at war the whole time the F-22 has been in service.

What enemy fighters have we faced that an air superiority fighter would be necessary, or even useful?

I would guess it hasn't been used in combat because our currently engaged enemies don't have an air force.

We've been at war for 10 years (nearly). What use have our submarines been in that time? Not a single combat action.

[MicroBalrog]

The Minuteman III has not seen, and, God helping, will never see, combat use.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

The Minuteman III has not seen, and, God helping, will never see, combat use.

amen

[roo_ster]

Yeah, best if the MMIIIs never have to be used.  But, I really would have liked to have seen the AIR-2 Genie get a use during, say, Vietnam, GWI, Reagan's pounding of Libya, or what have you.

Operational use of the Genie was discontinued in 1988 with the retirement of the F-106 interceptor.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AIR-2_Genie

[seeker_two]

But, I really would have liked to have seen the AIR-2 Genie get a use during, say, Vietnam, GWI, Reagan's pounding of Libya, or what have you.

Hmmm....load up a B1-V interceptor with a brace of those..... 

[kgbsquirrel]

We've been at war for 10 years (nearly). What use have our submarines been in that time? Not a single combat action.

*cough*

Our subs have been used for tomahawk strikes in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya, in the last 10 years. The latter of the trio saw the first use of our newly converted Ohio class SSGN, the USS Florida, back in March, where she launched some one hundred Tomhawks against surface targets. All in one sitting.

[birdman]

*cough*

Our subs have been used for tomahawk strikes in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya, in the last 10 years. The latter of the trio saw the first use of our newly converted Ohio class SSGN, the USS Florida, back in March, where she launched some one hundred Tomhawks against surface targets. All in one sitting.

Beat me to it :)

[makattak]

*cough*

Our subs have been used for tomahawk strikes in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya, in the last 10 years. The latter of the trio saw the first use of our newly converted Ohio class SSGN, the USS Florida, back in March, where she launched some one hundred Tomhawks against surface targets. All in one sitting.

I figured they had been used, but I think the point was understood.  

[RoadKingLarry]

*cough*

Our subs have been used for tomahawk strikes in Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya, in the last 10 years. The latter of the trio saw the first use of our newly converted Ohio class SSGN, the USS Florida, back in March, where she launched some one hundred Tomhawks against surface targets. All in one sitting.

Had a few former shipmates still on AD when this mess started. We expended a bunch of nearing end of life ordinance in a most satisfying manner.

[RevDisk]

The Minuteman III has not seen, and, God helping, will never see, combat use.

Eh.  I don't believe in wall hangers.  A weapon not used is not a weapon but a piece of decoration.  Plenty of hippies we could have expended the Minutemen on. 

[erictank]

Eh.  I don't believe in wall hangers.  A weapon not used is not a weapon but a piece of decoration.  Plenty of hippies we could have expended the Minutemen on. 

As satisfying in one respect as it might be to launch an ICBM against, say, Berkeley, I'm gonna have to disagree with you.  Deterrence is a valid function.  There are weapons which only ever need to be expended in testing in order to serve their purpose, although having them at the ready in case of need remains a wise choice.  I'm thinking that strategic nuclear weapons fit that category.

[seeker_two]

Deterrence is a valid function. 

Agreed....but sometimes people forget what the deterrent weapon is capable of....hence, demonstrations are necessary....

....Somalia would be a great demonstration area, I think.....   

[Jamisjockey]

Agreed....but sometimes people forget what the deterrent weapon is capable of....hence, demonstrations are necessary....

....Somalia D.C. would be a great demonstration area, I think.....   

FTFY!!

[MechAg94]

Quote from: seeker_two on Today at 07:55:32 AM
Agreed....but sometimes people forget what the deterrent weapon is capable of....hence, demonstrations are necessary....

....Somalia D.C. would be a great demonstration area, I think.....   cool

FTFY!!

Can we use a Neutron bomb for that place.  I'd hate to destroy all those great monuments and museums.

[Hawkmoon]

Chances are we aren't going to have time to build the "Arsenal of Democracy" again.  The next war, like the last couple have been, "Run what ya brung"

We can't match the Chinese (or Indians or Russians or Norks) man for man in uniform.  So we have to have the qualitative edge, in both equipment and people.

And we've got to make sure that no one ever gets the notion that we've become "beatable".

Run what ya brung just became a shade more difficult. According to today's news, ALL our F-22s plus ALL the F-35s are currently grounded. They are so grounded that new F-22s can't even be ferry-flown from the factory to the Air Farce. Never mind combat-ready -- they aren't allowed off the ground. Period.

[birdman]

To bad they are manned...the problem is with the oxygen system...