Author Topic: What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.  (Read 12218 times)

onions!

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« on: August 31, 2005, 05:22:38 AM »
Yesterday noon.Gas was $2.69-$2.79/gallon.We were warned that it would hit $3.00 yesterday afternoon.Fine.I filled up last night($58.00).

Today,there are stations both north & south of town that are between $3.19 & $3.48/gallon!Eighty cents in less than 24 hours.Bastages.

MaterDei

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #1 on: August 31, 2005, 05:35:05 AM »
You blame the gas station owner for the price of gas?  Waaaaaaa!

onions!

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #2 on: August 31, 2005, 05:52:27 AM »
Yes,I do.I don't know about Texas but in Western Michigan all the fuel comes from only 2 or 3 suppliers.

So,Waaaaaaaaaaa,if it's no the station owner just who do you think it is?Casper the friendly ghost?

MaterDei

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #3 on: August 31, 2005, 06:00:51 AM »
Tune in to Fox news, you might figure it out.  Smiley

Paddy

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #4 on: August 31, 2005, 06:03:46 AM »
Quote
You blame the gas station owner for the price of gas?  Waaaaaaa!
It's the same gas that was in the underground tank a few hours before.  How is a big price increase justified?

MaterDei

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #5 on: August 31, 2005, 06:09:54 AM »
How do you know that they didn't just have the tanks refilled?  Besides, the gas station business is a business that runs on small margins and is heavily cash flow dependent.  The station owners need to have the cash available to buy the next delivery of gas, not just pay for their current inventory.

What do you guys propose happen?  Government regulation of gas prices?

The Rabbi

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2005, 06:16:08 AM »
Quote from: RileyMc
It's the same gas that was in the underground tank a few hours before.  How is a big price increase justified?
You're joking, right?  This is similar to the comment I heard on the radio: "They raised it up so they can lower it down too."
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Sindawe

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #7 on: August 31, 2005, 06:26:15 AM »
Welcome to the semi-free market.  Demand will remain the same, the the projected supply in the near future will be curtailed due to Katrina, so the price rises.

I damn glad I did not buy that SUV I was thinking about buying five years ago.
I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.

onions!

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #8 on: August 31, 2005, 06:30:27 AM »
Quote from: MaterDei
How do you know that they didn't just have the tanks refilled?  Besides, the gas station business is a business that runs on small margins and is heavily cash flow dependent.  The station owners need to have the cash available to buy the next delivery of gas, not just pay for their current inventory.

What do you guys propose happen?  Government regulation of gas prices?
My point is that the privately owned station on Alpine is three bucks/gal.Five miles up the road in Sparta it's three bucks per gallon,if you follow the very same gasoline tanker another five miles it jumps to $3.48?

How is that justified?All three have to pay rent.All three pay their employees.It's just a few jackasses who want to gouge.

It's September eleventh all over again.That day the local stations raised gas from $1.60ish to between $2 & $2.20/galThe Govener had to step in & offer fines to those stations that wanted to gouge.The next day it was back down to $1.60ish.

Larry Ashcraft

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #9 on: August 31, 2005, 06:33:26 AM »
Quote from: Sindawe
I damn glad I did not buy that SUV I was thinking about buying five years ago.
Haha.  This morning I was talking to a guy whose wife is comptroller at a large Ford dealership.  He said the dealer is basically saying "Come in, buy anything, we'll GIVE you an SUV".

onions!

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #10 on: August 31, 2005, 06:39:31 AM »
Quote from: Sindawe
Welcome to the semi-free market.  Demand will remain the same, the the projected supply in the near future will be curtailed due to Katrina, so the price rises.

I damn glad I did not buy that SUV I was thinking about buying five years ago.
This I understand.To a point.

Sindawe

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« Reply #11 on: August 31, 2005, 06:40:20 AM »
Quote
This morning I was talking to a guy whose wife is comptroller at a large Ford dealership.  He said the dealer is basically saying "Come in, buy anything, we'll GIVE you an SUV".
Well, if the SUV were powered by one of these I'd be strongly tempted.
I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.

onions!

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #12 on: August 31, 2005, 06:40:44 AM »
Quote from: Larry Ashcraft
Quote from: Sindawe
I damn glad I did not buy that SUV I was thinking about buying five years ago.
Haha.  This morning I was talking to a guy whose wife is comptroller at a large Ford dealership.  He said the dealer is basically saying "Come in, buy anything, we'll GIVE you an SUV".
On the flip side.
I work @ a GMC dealership.We've almost no trucks left on the lot!

onions!

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #13 on: August 31, 2005, 06:57:01 AM »
Quote from: MaterDei
How do you know that they didn't just have the tanks refilled?  Besides, the gas station business is a business that runs on small margins and is heavily cash flow dependent.  The station owners need to have the cash available to buy the next delivery of gas, not just pay for their current inventory.

What do you guys propose happen?  Government regulation of gas prices?
Excuse me.That sounds almost like the excuse I read yesterday.A New Orleans looter was asked why he was looting.His response (not verbatim-that was yesterday)"Why not?It's our chance to get some!"

& before you decry "apples & persimmons!!" I aknowledge that the station owner has to be able to buy next weeks fuel.Why does he feel obligated to gouge his customer base though?Yes,I know that no one has a gun to their head to buy from those stations.& I also know that the station owner knew what kind of business they were getting into before yesterday.

This might explain my perspective better.Last night/this morning two local companies-Old Orchard juices & Ice Mountain (Nestle) bottled water each sent one-three semi's full of bottled water to New Orleans.Donated.So if two companies are willing to help why do we tolerate another who wants to gouge?

Paddy

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #14 on: August 31, 2005, 06:59:51 AM »
Quote
Demand will remain the same, the the projected supply in the near future will be curtailed due to Katrina, so the price rises.
You left out one word. "the projected supply in the near future will be artificiallycurtailed due to Katrina"  

BTW, I've yet to hear an 'explanation' for the price increases over the past year.

Hey, I'm getting 40mpg with a $12,000 car.  Can't get much better than that. Smiley

BrokenPaw

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #15 on: August 31, 2005, 07:03:17 AM »
Quote
This might explain my perspective better.Last night/this morning two local companies-Old Orchard juices & Ice Mountain (Nestle) bottled water each sent one-three semi's full of bottled water to New Orleans.Donated.So if two companies are willing to help why do we tolerate another who wants to gouge?
Because Old Orchard and Nestle chose to donate.  Why does this, in your mind, create an obligation on the part of an entire other entity (the gas-station owner) to do anything in particular?

If you don't like the guy charging $3.48, and there's another station charging less, there's a logical course of action that may present itself to you.

The station owner is free to set his price at $25 per gallon, if he wants.  If you don't like the price he's set, you're free to not buy from him.

What part of this are you not getting?

Namaste,
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Sindawe

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #16 on: August 31, 2005, 07:05:23 AM »
RileyMc: Are you saying that the supply will be purposefully restricted, with the storm used as an excuse?  I'd be interested in seeing the supporting evidence of such.

Quote
Hey, I'm getting 40mpg with a $12,000 car.
Hmmm...what vehicle is that? Are they available on the used car market? Thats 33% better milage than I get now, and the savings might be worth looking at over dropping a new engine in the current ride.
I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.

USP45usp

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #17 on: August 31, 2005, 07:19:11 AM »
Next time that you get gas, just for the heck of it check the taxes by the feds and the state (and county if they have one, Lane in Oregon does).

Subtract that tax from the price.

And see what you're really paying.  I think that Bush and the state governments would make a huge dent in the price if the suspended the gas tax for a few months but they are money hungry and won't.

Wayne

Oh, to sent the example:

Federal Tax:      .25 cents per
State (Oregon)  .60 cents per
County:            .05 cents per
                      ____

                       .90

$2.76 - .90 = 1.86 per gal.

Art Eatman

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #18 on: August 31, 2005, 07:25:21 AM »
I ran across a discussion about raising the sales price on stock already in a store.  Trouble is, it was several years back and I don't remember the grimy details.  Anyhow, if prices are not raised in advance of the need to re-order, the storekeeper will wind up in the hole.  He has no choice but to raise his prices on that stuff already on the shelves--or in the storage tank.

I ran in to fortuitous thing, yesterday:  Normally, our gas prices down in Terlingua are ten to twenty cents higher than up in Alpine.  But, we were three cents cheaper, and the hearsay had it that nearby Marfa had just seen a twenty-cent jump.  So, I took my empty drum and all my gas cans and stocked up some 47 gallons' worth plus filled my truck at $2.53.9  I can at least stave off dire pain and agony for a few weeks. Smiley

I've not heard anything as to how long before the Gulf rigs will be back in production.

Art
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K Frame

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #19 on: August 31, 2005, 07:26:30 AM »
You guys are forgetting one very important thing...

Gas prices at individual stations are rarely set by the station owner.
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mtnbkr

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #20 on: August 31, 2005, 07:37:20 AM »
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Hey, I'm getting 40mpg with a $12,000 car.  Can't get much better than that
How about 40mpg on an $8k car ('93 Toyota Paseo).  It was still getting 30mpg town and 40mpg highway (sometimes as high as 45) when I sold it at 196k miles three years ago.  I should've kept that car...

Quote
I damn glad I did not buy that SUV I was thinking about buying five years ago.
I dunno.  I hate mine when I fill it up, but it's too damn handy when we need it, which is fairly often.  We couldn't have made the beach trip we took last week on something like the Paseo I mentioned above.  Oh, and the guy I pulled out of the sand at Oregon Inlet is probably happy I bought that SUV. Tongue

Chris

garrettwc

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #21 on: August 31, 2005, 07:41:13 AM »
Quote
BTW, I've yet to hear an 'explanation' for the price increases over the past year.
China.

I posted similar questions in a thread a few months back. It was pointed out to me, politely, that I didn't get it. Having worked in the industry at one time, I didn't see how that would be so I decided to educate myself.

The raw materials aka barrel crude is a commodity. As such it is sold on the world market at auction. When there are more buyers than sellers, the price gets bid up. China, and more recently India (IIRC) have been buying everything that is offered. If we want to get our share we have to out bid them. This is a byproduct of all that "outsourcing" of manufacturing and tech support centers.

How does that relate to the individual stations?

Well, on the radio this morning, they said the wholesale market closed at $2.47 a gallon on Tuesday. The gas station I was driving by at the time I heard this had signs showing $2.54 a gallon. This varies from state to state, but in Indiana about 30 cents of the $2.54 is state and federal highway taxes. Looks like he's taking a loss right? How does he stay in business?

Well if it's a convenience store/gas station combo, the sales from snacks and sodas help some. But the store will survive on the cash reserves he built up when the wholesale price was lower.

It's sort of like when you see something on sale, or know the price is about to go up. You go out and stock up on it right? Well if you are the seller, the inverse is true.

Paddy

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #22 on: August 31, 2005, 07:47:28 AM »
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RileyMc: Are you saying that the supply will be purposefully restricted, with the storm used as an excuse?  I'd be interested in seeing the supporting evidence of such.
If I could prove it, I'd be at the U.S. Attorney's office sooo fast........


Quote
Hey, I'm getting 40mpg with a $12,000 car.

Hmmm...what vehicle is that? Are they available on the used car market? Thats 33% better milage than I get now, and the savings might be worth looking at over dropping a new engine in the current ride.
It's a 2005 Toyota Echo 5 spd manual tranny, 1.5 liter VVT-I engine.  They quit making them as of 2005, and I had a difficult time finding a near base model with a manual trans.  Mine has a/c and radio, that's it.  Top speed is 105 mph and it will go up the Cuesta Grade (a local steep incline on the 101 freeway) at 80mph.

Quote
BTW, I've yet to hear an 'explanation' for the price increases over the past year.

China.
Oh, yeah. I'd forgotten about them.  How much of our money are they sitting on right about now?  I've heard it's somewhere in the neighborhood of $700 billion and increasing everyday.  Thanks, WalMart shoppers.  Keep it up.

onions!

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2005, 08:38:40 AM »
Quote from: BrokenPaw
If you don't like the guy charging $3.48, and there's another station charging less, there's a logical course of action that may present itself to you.

The station owner is free to set his price at $25 per gallon, if he wants.  If you don't like the price he's set, you're free to not buy from him.

What part of this are you not getting?

Namaste,
-BP
Well if you actually read my posts you would know that I already acknowledged both your "points".

My point is that I don't understand gouging during a "crisis".

I can't wait to see my gas bill this winter.You know,the one where you can't pick the vendor you buy from?

It's moot now.The corner Shell just went to $3.50...

jefnvk

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What a load of crap!Gas rant inside.
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2005, 08:41:22 AM »
Quote
Hmmm...what vehicle is that? Are they available on the used car market? Thats 33% better milage than I get now, and the savings might be worth looking at over dropping a new engine in the current ride.
35 or so town in an '03 Cavalier, ran about that, maybe a little less.  Had 46 on the highway once.

As for the gas, I look at it as anything else.  Someone has it, you want it.  You pay what they are asking, try to talk them down, go to the competition, or don't buy.  I don't see why it should be special, just because it is something everyone uses.

BTW, unchanged in Northern MI at most of the station as of last night, when I decided $2.63 was a good enough price to top off on.  Some have jumped to the high 80's/low 90's.  Haven't gone to town today yet.
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