Money isn't everything? Bullfeathers!

[Monkeyleg]

This thread is associated with another thread I started a few days ago.

Back in the late 1980's, I was probably the highest-paid staff photographer in the state. If my wife or I wanted something, we just bought it (after some discussion, of course). Without bragging too much, I made more money than most professionals I knew--doctors, lawyers, pharmacists, engineers.

When I lost my job in 1987, I thanked myself for not going out on a limb and buying an expensive house. We'd bought a duplex, and the rent from upstairs paid our mortgage.

After my business got rolling in 1989 or so, I treated myself to a "repo" Harley. Like new, and paid 65% of what it cost the original owner when he bought it for full sticker price six months prior.

In 1992, we bought another house, and I set my price limit at $100,000. We were qualified for up to $400,, but I wasn't going to fall into that potential trap.

IOW, I'm cheap. I'm driving the 1991 Saturn that I bought for my wife on New Year's Eve in 1990. She thought she was living like a queen. I got her another car in 2003, and she had to drive the Saturn the other day. She said she felt sorry for me.

I said, "why?" With one exception, I've always owned beaters. Throw-away cars. I could buy another one for less than the cost of an oil and filter change. Makes no difference.

But now times are tough. I mean really tough. It shouldn't make any difference, since we can get by if we live like we always have: my wife buys her clothes at Goodwill or second-hand stores, and I don't buy clothes until I see holes in the ones I have. She's got a nice car, and the Saturn runs. What more can one ask for?

Well, maybe it's that "Jones" thing. You know, the neighbors have this, and you don't.

After thinking about it, though, it's not. In fact, Debbie and I were talking last night about all of this.

We're both in our 50's. We met in 1968, fell in lust, then in love, then had the time of our lives.

In the 1970's, we didn't have anything. Nothing. But we went out, we went out to eat, we went out for drinks, and we had the most fun I'll ever know. I'm so grateful to her and to God for those times.

We both long for those days. Of course, I had more hair then, and she was thinner. I don't know that all that matters.

What matters is that we're tied up in trying to do something that I don't understand or can even identify. I'm trying to bring in enough money to pay the bills, so is she, and we don't have any fun at all. Not at all. And the bills aren't that bad. The exception is medical bills, but we'll have them paid off by the end of the year.

So, I'm sitting here surveying all I own. It ain't much. But it's enough for us.

Yet I lie awake at night and worry about bills, retirement, and everything else that accompanies money.

And I ask myself: how did I go from earning serious money to making less than a third-shift McDonald's assistant manager? (If even that much).

And how did money get to be such a constant drain on my thoughts?

I don't think that I'm alone. Others please chime in.

[Sindawe]

Forgive me if I ramble...

Yet I lie awake at night and worry about bills, retirement, and everything else that accompanies money.

Money is one of the "funny" things in life.  It is not really important, but try living with not enough of it, even if the that "not enough" is only a matter of perception and not realiity.  Like you Monkeyleg, my daily driver is a beater, a '91 Civic bought shortly after college, getting my first professional job and midst of the Crazy Years in my life (so far).  Its not pretty, nor is it fast, but it gets the job done.  

From first perspective, I can see two issue.  The "Jones" issue, and doing what you can't understand or ID.  The first is really just a trap IMAO, the sweet siren song of consumerism and status that we've been feed all our lives.  Sure the toys are nice to have, but that "status" issue is a hollow reward.  In the end it does not matter how many possesions you accumulate, or even the quality of those possesions.  If they fit your needs, and make YOU happy, who gives a frell what the neighbors think?

On doing what you can't understand and ID, then I think its time to re-evaluate what you are doing and change course.  Maybe I'm the odd man out, but I've known all along what I want to do next, and have worked in that direction.  In High School/College, the goal was Biotechnology.  So I did that.  Course work and a work study helped me secure a position with a bright and shiny company full of potential to change the world.  Then it got old, and I took a different track in another feild that captured my interest. Now after a few years there, I'm starting the assess where I want to go next.  This field is fun in some respects, not so in others.  The question now, for me, is do I chase the long held dream of chasing spiders in the roofs of the forests, or follow the lure of power via politics?

Retirement?  Time enough to rest in the grave.  Retirement IMAO is a vanishing phenomena of a by gone era. I fully expect to work at something until its time for my buddies to prop my corpse up against a tree in the woods where it can frighten hikers and small children.  The key is working at something *I* find worthwhile.  If I can feed myself and my pets, then I'm content.  Possessions don't really matter, nor really does status.

Maybe you're trapped in nostalgia for when you were "young" and the world was full of promise and opportunity.  Now that those years are past, you want to return to them, and miss the joys to the now.  Dancing until dawn, spending the night on the town is fun, but then, so is sitting about the camp fire after spending the afternoon killing soda cans with ones rifle.

[garyk/nm]

If you have enough to keep the wolves from the door, be happy. Everything else is gravy. That is sort of where we are, and my only regret is that, having a teen-age daughter, I am not able to indulge her as much as I would like.
I think the source of frustration for folks our age, is that we compare ourselves to our parents' generation. Dad worked for the same company all of his working life and steadily progressed until retirement. Not so anymore. Instead of valuing long-term employees, companies now seem to see them as a liability. This leaves the 40-50 age group wandering and competing for jobs with much younger folks with lower salary expectations.
Sucks, but what can you do? Gotta pay the bills!
{end ramble}

[USP45usp]

I hear ya (and I'm only 37).  To ensure that I don't fall into any other traps I am in the process of paying off all my credit accounts.

I did finally have to buy another car, a 2001 Impala, the other day.  My job may be moving to another city and I will have to drive about 45min. one way to go to work.  This is the first "new car" in over 13 years (I did get a truck but only to get better credit, it's an old one so I don't consider that "new" and it's for work only).  I love my 'Bird but she's starting to show her age.  I also needed something with better gas milage since gas is $2.48 a gal now (the cheapest type).

Things will get better.  Just keep on being positive and good things will happen to you.

Wayne

[charby]

in 2003 the real median household income in the US was $43,318 according to the census. In 2003 the real medium house price was 170,000 according to a study by Harvard.

Just wait, I live within my means too and I can't wait until the day the realestate bubble just goes in the sh!tter and us who aren't strapped with debt will be able to get a nice place to live for dimes on the dollar. Of course more than likely inflation will soar and interest rates will be out of sight.

Charby

[Monkeyleg]

"I fully expect to work at something until its time for my buddies to prop my corpse up against a tree in the woods where it can frighten hikers and small children."

LMAO!

I don't measure myself by my possessions. If I did I'd go nuts. When I see posters over on THR showing collections of hundreds of guns, all I can think about is the time required to keep them oiled and cleaned.

That's a realization I came to several years ago: the more stuff you have, the more time you have to spend keeping that stuff in order. Our lives revolve around trying to prevent ourselves and our stuff from decaying. The more stuff, the more time, and less time for enjoying life.

Where the money crunch really hits me is that I'm not able to take my annual motorcycle trips out west anymore. Starting in 1990, I'd take two weeks or so every July and ride 5,000 to 7,000 miles through just about every state in the west, southwest and northwest. It's an experience that borders on religious. Now such trips are an impossibility.

I have to remain positive, and tell myself that I'll be able to afford a trip next year, because there's only a few years left before I'd be too old to physically handle such trips. (500+ miles a day on a bike with no windshield or faring is pretty taxing physically).

At any rate, thanks for the replies. Some good things to think about.

[The Rabbi]

Back in the late 1980's, I was probably the highest-paid staff photographer in the state. If my wife or I wanted something, we just bought it (after some discussion, of course). Without bragging too much, I made more money than most professionals I knew--doctors, lawyers, pharmacists, engineers

So what happened to the money you made??

[Antibubba]

But we went out, we went out to eat, we went out for drinks, and we had the most fun I'll ever know.

You still can.  It's simply a matter of adjusting your sights from Ritz-Carlton to Ritz Bits.     I live in california, so wherever you are has got to be cheaper.  I go to the farmer's market every weekend; right now they're almost giving away peaches and nectarines, and the heirloom tomatoes are showing up.  It's a week's good eating for under $10.  you can still have your "date nights".  Here, it's taquerias or sushi; elsewhere, that little ethnic place or a millenium-old greasy spoon or hamburger stand.  Or grab the burgers and the peaches and a good four-dollar bottle of wine (no longer a contradiction, happily), get an old blanket, and have a picnic.  The State Fair is pricey, but there are going to be harvest festivals every weekend until Thanksgiving.

   The thing about having money is, it does make everything easier; by easier, I mean that you have to invest less of yourself into it.  A new movie, Disneyworld, etc-someone else's labor replaces your own.  Remember what it was that made those times as much fun as it was-friends, the love you had for each other (And that overwhelming sense of smug superiority that comes with youth probably enhanced it!).  You can still have your friends, or new ones, and you still have each other, so you're really doing well.

   If you save twenty dollars by not going out, but you sit and simmer and stress about it, you're still paying-it just isn't coming out of your wallet.  it's coming out of your hide, and hers, and out of your sleep.  That's a lot to pay for a night out.

[Standing Wolf]

I've been rock-solid broke and deeply in debt. I've been on top of the world. It amazes me sometimes that through thick and thin, I kept on being essential the same old me, with just about the same raw quantity of ups and downs.

I always thought money was more important than it's turned out to be.

[Felonious Monk/Fignozzle]

"Maybe you're trapped in nostalgia for when you were "young" and the world was full of promise and opportunity."
Don't know whether that's YOU, but that's definitely ME!

"I think the source of frustration for folks our age, is that we compare ourselves to our parents' generation. Dad worked for the same company all of his working life and steadily progressed until retirement. Not so anymore. Instead of valuing long-term employees, companies now seem to see them as a liability. This leaves the 40-50 age group wandering and competing for jobs with much younger folks with lower salary expectations.
Sucks, but what can you do? Gotta pay the bills! "

Dad was an FBI agent (really) and mom was a full time teacher.  I was the original "latchkey kid", was drinking by 13 and smoking dope by 15.  God is full of grace and I lived through it and wised up.

Honey and I live on one income, and I get VERY wistful for the Lexus SUV and the lake homes and Sandestin and exclusive island vacations that SOME folks around us take.  I also know their kids; some are in rehab (in fairness, some are GOOD kids).  All 3 of mine love the Lord, are very well-grounded, know who they are, and are very secure in their world view.

I hurt sometimes in not being able to give them all the exclusive advantages that the wealthy can give to their kids.
Then, when I gain perspective, I realize that some of those advantages are chains that my family manages to avoid.

Honey and I have been married 22 years now, and it's far from perfect, but it's better than having 2 or 3 ex's and a boatload of regrets about missing my kids' growing up.

Count your blessings daily.  Read "The Prayer of Jabez".
And know that your friends in this virtual community think very highly of you.

[Monkeyleg]

The Rabbi: what happened? Business. Debt. Repayment of debt.

I'm sure I don't have to tell you, but there are others who need to be reminded: for every "rich" self-employed person, there's probably 10 or 100 who lost everything they had starting their own businesses.

And a person doesn't have to be terminally stupid. I had a great business going until I missed the warning signs in the late 1990's. That's all it took. In 1997 I was doing a tremendous business. By 1998 I was trying to figure out how to do damage repair. By 2, I was toast.

I could have declared bankruptcy and kept just about everything, but I had a hard time thinking about stiffing others for the money I owed them. I know guys who routinely declare bankruptcy, stiff even the little people, and somehow sleep at night.

I'm just not one of them.

All that money I'd saved? It went to pay off creditors, freelance assistants, my landlord, and anyone else that I owed money to. My landlord alone wanted $150,000 to let me out of my lease that I'd signed just one year prior (new landlord; the old one would have said "goodbye and good luck").

IOW, I paid everybody I owed, and made a special effort to pay those "little people" who live from month to month first.

Antibubba, a few years back I took my wife down to Memphis for Valentine's Day weekend. It  had been some time since we'd been to New Orleans, and we had forgotten what real Cajun and Creole cooking tastes like.

Well, one dish of shrimp etoufee on Beal Street told me that all we were getting from the fancy-schmancy restaurants here in Milwaukee was frozen shrimp covered with catsup.

So, we got Paul Prudhomme's cookbooks, and got to work. We don't go out to eat Cajun anymore, because there isn't a joint in town that has food as good as we can cook, and for a whole lot less. And by less, I mean probably 75% less. And it's good.

All those so-called Mexican restaurants with the American-Mex style mix of gourmet mushrooms, gobs of sour cream, and spicy ketchup?

Fuhgettaboutit.

We got some cookbooks on authentic Mexican cuisine, and it's really simple. Even better, it's healthier. Yeah, I have to remember how to ask for the meat and the chorizo and the tomatolies and the other stuff in Spanish. Last time out, I memorized all that, because nobody at El Rey speaks English.

So, I go up to the meat counter, do my best to order in Spanish, and the guy says, "will there be anything else, sir?"

Anyway, we have better "haute cuisine" than is available in any restaurant in the city. Bar none.

And pizza? I came up with a recipe for a croissant crust that will melt in your mouth. The tomato sauce needs real Italian tomatoes (meaning: go downtown to the only real Italian grocery store); the mushrooms get quick-fried in a garlic/wine combination; the cheese is from Sicily; and the prosciutto and sausage are fresh as can be. Start making the crust on Thursday, and by Saturday night it's a festa. And for maybe $15 to $20.

"Maybe you're trapped in nostalgia for when you were "young" and the world was full of promise and opportunity."

Promise and opportunity? Both are still there now. What I do with both is my responsibility.

What I long for is for the time when Debbie and I would spend our weekends  together. Not mowing lawns, not writing out bills, and certainly not worrying.

Debbie has made me happier than any man could possibly know. And I've promised to return that by moving as close to the city of her heart--New Orleans--as soon as we can. I've only failed to deliver on one promise I've made to her; I won't fail on this one.

My motorcyle trips out west, and living in Mississippi or Louisana to make my wife happy.

If that's not a simple but achievable ambition, I don't know what is.

[matis]

Monkeyleg,

I ain't rich and I ain't poor.  I've never lived "high" either and so things even out and we're ok.

But I know how you can make much more than enough money.


Write for money instead of for free.



Reading your last post (#11) just made me feel plain ol' good.  I can't exactly figure out why.  Might be what you did about your debt.  For sure it includes what you wrote about Debbie.

For some reason the best part was what you wrote about your haute cuisine.

I don't like to cook and I don't even care for shrimp.  But yours sounded wonderful.  And the Mexican -- and the Pizza.  I felt like ... I sorta wished we were there, eating it with you.  Even began imagining myself cooking this way, too.

So to the extent that you have a problem, I've solved it for you.

Write for money.


matis

[matis]

Quote:
 "All 3 of mine love the Lord, are very well-grounded, know who they are, and are very secure in their world view."
____________________________________________


That IS what's it's all about, isn't it, Felonius?

Mine (daughter) is 17 and currently she's a bit smarter than I am.  But as Mark Twain said, as she gets older, she's beginning to notice that I am somehow getting smarter.

Aside from that slight adjustment for her age, the sentence you wrote above describes her, as well.


And it is for this reason that, much as I love life and hope to make it to 120 (grin) -- I'd die happy even if I keeled over right now.

matis

[Sylvilagus Aquaticus]

My ex-wife is living proof there's no income you can't live beyond.


Regards,
Rabbit.

[atek3]

I'm young and by non-bay area standards making pretty decent money... but making decent money at a job you hate is no way to get rich... So I'm brainstorming WTF to do with my life... keeps me up at night thinking.

Oh Well, I'm young so I have the luxury of messing around, riding motorcycles, and shooting IPSC, until I get my head on straight.

atek3