Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: AJ Dual on December 18, 2020, 04:36:11 PM
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Hoax? Leak of a new product? Uses P90 magazines?
Post all your ill informed/zero informed speculation here.
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Couldn't tell anything from the photo, too small. Found a larger version.
Very interesting. Guess you flip the top up to insert/remove the mag.
Needs an arm brace :P
(https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/x383/WLJohnson1/1608316414297.jpg)
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That lower rail is just screaming forward ver grip which a no no on pistols
(https://cdn11.bigcommerce.com/s-j4qw6gpgqh/images/stencil/500x659/products/119/384/ATF_Somebody_come_take_a_look__90275.1592078809.jpg?c=1)
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That lower rail is just screaming forward ver grip which a no no on pistols
Rapidly approaching the point where none of that matters.
AR's become illegal, might as well get home-made DIAS and suppressor, change the barrel to 10.5" and call it a day.
Foregrip on a big pistol ain't got nothing on that.
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Which also means we may never see this come to market.
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It's real
Introducing the New P50 5.7x28mm Pistol from KelTec
https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2021/01/04/p50-5-7x28mm-pistol-keltec/
The KelTec P50 pistol will begin shipping in the first quarter of 2021 and will be sold for $995 MSRP.
If Biden doesn't have his way that is
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The P90 magazines are amazing and I welcome new arms that utilize them.
ETA: if I recall there is a wildcat where the 5.7mm casing is opened to 7.62mm and made basically a straight wall subsonic .308 cal that can use the 50rd 5.7mm mags.
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Now I am sort of tempted to try to buy a P90 magazine or two. I figure it will be while before I see one of these. Who knows what the law will be by then.
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That lower rail is just screaming forward ver grip which a no no on pistols
(https://cdn11.bigcommerce.com/s-j4qw6gpgqh/images/stencil/500x659/products/119/384/ATF_Somebody_come_take_a_look__90275.1592078809.jpg?c=1)
That is your bayonet attachment.
Two extra slots in the rail over what my HK 45 has.
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E-mail from Kel-Tec.
Now shipping and it comes with two mags. Ammo though is going to be a *****
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E-mail from Kel-Tec.
Now shipping and it comes with two mags. Ammo though is going to be a *****
I saw some articles and new videos recently. I was wondering if that meant they were finally shipping. I need to keep an eye out.
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This cartridge looks rather small. Is there anything special about it?
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This cartridge looks rather small. Is there anything special about it?
It has a coated case and you need to be careful reloading it.
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This cartridge looks rather small. Is there anything special about it?
IMO, it is just a hair more powerful that 22 Magnum but centerfire so it should be inherently more reliable. Probably good for varmints nd punching holes in paper and stuff. You can't buy the armor piercing bullets new, but other rounds are available.
To me, it is just a small blaster pistol with a very high magazine capacity. I have a Keltec CMR 30 in 22 mag. IMO, this would be similar only with more capacity and a bit better than 22 mag.
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In a full auto such as the P90 the low recoil of the 5.7x28 allows rapid tight grouping on a target and is extremely effective for that reason and is really the reason the round was design the way it was. Just ask the Goa'uld =D. In semi autos like the PS90, P50, and handguns it loses much of it's effectiveness IMHO.
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5.56 is not exactly hard to group at PDW distances full auto. But the whole PDW argument goes back and forth all the time.
P90's and 5.7 aside, I'm not sure what real use this pistol fills. I mean it's a neat piece of gun-building, but probably heavy fully loaded, and I'm not sure having 50 rds in a handgun is worth that size, weight, and reload speed penalty.
Neato gadget though.
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5.56 is not exactly hard to group at PDW distances full auto. But the whole PDW argument goes back and forth all the time.
P90's and 5.7 aside, I'm not sure what real use this pistol fills. I mean it's a neat piece of gun-building, but probably heavy fully loaded, and I'm not sure having 50 rds in a handgun is worth that size, weight, and reload speed penalty.
Neato gadget though.
Agreed. I think Keltec pretty much assumes there will be pistol braces made for them. If you were after some sort of tactical use, an SBR is what you would want. However, this package is probably lighter than an AR pistol with a D60.
This has a 10" barrel. I wonder how it would look with a 16" barrel and a somewhat sturdy stock.
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Speaking of the P90
Hill SMG/Pistol: Inspiration for the FN P90
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tAZs7GdLreI
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Speaking of the P90
Hill SMG/Pistol: Inspiration for the FN P90
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tAZs7GdLreI
That looks pretty cool. It is non-traditional, but I wonder why no one has attempted to build something similar. I can only assume there were reliability issues that were never worked out. Of course, I don't know how well something like this would work with a longer rifle cartridge. I also guess the market for civilian semi-auto pistol carbines was never huge until more recently.
You could have a high capacity without a long magazine sticking out allowing a more traditional look. The pictures of the SMG the army tested looked like a normal carbine.
Also, why were disposable magazines such a popular concept?
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That looks pretty cool. It is non-traditional, but I wonder why no one has attempted to build something similar. I can only assume there were reliability issues that were never worked out. Of course, I don't know how well something like this would work with a longer rifle cartridge. I also guess the market for civilian semi-auto pistol carbines was never huge until more recently.
You could have a high capacity without a long magazine sticking out allowing a more traditional look. The pictures of the SMG the army tested looked like a normal carbine.
Also, why were disposable magazines such a popular concept?
Field supply to soldiers, ready to be shot empty and discarded on the field.
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Field supply to soldiers, ready to be shot empty and discarded on the field.
What's old is new again. PING!
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Field supply to soldiers, ready to be shot empty and discarded on the field.
I guess we did that with the BAR and M1 Garand. Have we done it with any other rifle?
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I guess we did that with the BAR and M1 Garand. Have we done it with any other rifle?
M16.
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M16.
I never heard of us shipping loaded magazines to the soldiers. When?
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I never heard of us shipping loaded magazines to the soldiers. When?
Vietnam.
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Tim of MAC looks at the P50
Tim has the same ver grip worry I do. People are going to be temped to put one on and run afoul of a watchful range officer or worse.
Comes with Promag mags, UGH!
Certain parts and certain aspects of it's construction appear somewhat delicate and prone to break like the hinge to me at least.
Easy to get your support hand/fingers in front of the barrel.
Ran 100%
Certainly looks fun
NEW: Keltec P50 handgun in 5.7x28!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zK7RWIcglB0
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Looks like it doesn't kick a whole lot either.
I would be curious if they would try to make a rifle version of it like the CMR-30. It would very few changes to do it.
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Looks like it doesn't kick a whole lot either.
I would be curious if they would try to make a rifle version of it like the CMR-30. It would very few changes to do it.
All they would have to do is lengthen the barrel a little and put a stock on it. I like it. But 5.7 needs to come down from $75 a box to a more sane price before I would even consider it.
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Looks fun but... why does everything keltec make have to be hideous plastic clamshells held together by screws? :O
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Looks fun but... why does everything keltec make have to be hideous plastic clamshells held together by screws? :O
My assumption is that it keeps molding and tooling costs down and helps them meet their relatively aggressive MSRP's.
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It looks like a well designed gun, and seems to work nicely. I question the "clamshell open to reload" design choice, but you aren't going to be toing tactical or speed reloads with this gun.
I mentioned it before, but after watching the video I am even more unsure of the use case for a 3 lb, damn near 18" pistol. Even as a range toy 5.7 isn't particularly cheap or plentiful. It's not a plinker, it's not a useful defensive pistol, I guess you could hunt small game with it, but 100 other guns would do that better. I'm sure Hollywood will buy a few for their next low budget sci-fi series, but beyond that, why?
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I'm guessing some of you go to shopping malls. Watch. You're going to see guys with messenger bags. You'll see guys with Really Big diaper bags...
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It looks like a well designed gun, and seems to work nicely. I question the "clamshell open to reload" design choice, but you aren't going to be toing tactical or speed reloads with this gun.
I mentioned it before, but after watching the video I am even more unsure of the use case for a 3 lb, damn near 18" pistol. Even as a range toy 5.7 isn't particularly cheap or plentiful. It's not a plinker, it's not a useful defensive pistol, I guess you could hunt small game with it, but 100 other guns would do that better. I'm sure Hollywood will buy a few for their next low budget sci-fi series, but beyond that, why?
The main reason for the size is to let it use the 50 round 5.7 magazine.
That said, IMO, most people are going to go the pistol brace route. That is more or less why I thought a CMR-50 rifle version would make sense. On the CMR-30, the stock collapses almost all the way to the grip and the barrel would only be 6" longer.
Otherwise, there are a large number of "why" guns out there. Never stopped people from making them.
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Certainly, and I'm not saying they shouldn't build it, I'm just confused about who they built it for.
I'm tracking on the magazine as the source of many of the design decisions. That's pretty obvious, but also a strange choice. A P90 mag is nicely designed, and works well, but it's not like a Glock mag that is approaching universality, or a G3 mag that has millions out there in surplus for less than $10. It's a bulky, hard to carry, $40 magazine.
And you can't even pistol brace this gun, because there's a charging handle where the brace would need to go. I guess on the plus side you could just 3D print a stock/grip clamshell and replace the whole bottom of the gun pretty easily.
I know I sound pretty down on this, and I don't mean to be. I like new things in the gun space, and I normally find Kel-Tecs ideas interesting, even if the execution often lacks. I'm just confused about the designer's vision for this gun. Are a lot of people finishing mag dumps on FiveseveN's and saying "man I wish I had another 20 rounds before the world's most awkward reload!"?
It's like someone left a Whitney Wolverine in whatever goo created the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.
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Try shooting a carbine with a glock gigglestick hanging out the bottom from a prone position. Get video?
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I shoot my carbine with a Colt 32rd mag hanging out the bottom from the prone just fine. Glock 30 rounders don't even hang that low. But that's not the point.
My point in mentioning Glock mags were it makes sense to have some design concessions to a weapon to make it fit a Glock mag, because they are ubiquitous. making concessions to fit an kinda expensive, kinda obscure FN mag makes less sense.
Let's put it another way:
We are a gun centric group that has some disposable income and likes weird stuff. Between all of us here on this forum we probably have a super eclectic firearms collection, many of which aren't super practical. Raise your hand if you are going to spend [checks gunbroker] two grand on one of these in the next twelve months.
Didn't think so.
ETA: Since I looked on Gunbroker, I feel I should point out that for a couple hundred less than this thing is selling for you can get an *actual* PS90. Sure, this is suffering from new gun unobtanium price hikes, but still. PS90 AND the tax stamp, or P50?
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Basically, for all intents and purposes, that is a "repel boarders" gun. Lots of rounds, which can be dumped, even with a single-shot trigger pull, rather rapidly. The 5.7, even the neutered version, will penetrate decently, with good energy transfer.
But...
For that kind of firearm, I'd rather have something with a can. Subsonic. A compact 50 round package looks a LOT more like a Calico...
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ETA: Since I looked on Gunbroker, I feel I should point out that for a couple hundred less than this thing is selling for you can get an *actual* PS90. Sure, this is suffering from new gun unobtanium price hikes, but still. PS90 AND the tax stamp, or P50?
I had to look and yep, people are ASKING $2k and up on gun broker. You would have to be a fool to pay that since MSRP is $995.
Wait for things to settle and places like Buds will have them for ~$800
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Yes, if there's one thing KelTec is known for it's producing enough firearms that their catalog is easy to kfnd in stock at distributors for MSRP.....
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Patience Grasshopper. I've never had trouble finding KT products with a little bit of patience often below MSRP. Too many people judge current prices by what people who are counting on panic buyers are often asking on GB .
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My local gun shop had a P50 today after work. $1099. I didn't buy it. Just didn't want to lay down $1100 then go spend more on ammo. I think my problem is if I was going to spend that much, I would rather buy a Ruger made Marlin. Or an M&P 10mm which seem to be vaporware.
It is very light weight for the size. I can really see shooting it one handed. 50 rounds might add some weight, but I doubt it would add that much.
(https://i.imgur.com/MkUOaCM.jpg)
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I'm guessing that they have a few good moldmakers and injection molding people on staff.
And... Damn, but I'm seeing a LOT of folks wearing chest bags lately. Probably shorty AR "pistols" in them.
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https://palmettostatearmory.com/new-years-sale/firearms/keltec-p50-5-7x28-pistol-black-p50blk.html
PSA has it in stock for $1099.
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The Kel-Tec P-50 Carbine and Stock are HERE! [SHOT Show 2022]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qcWFzflPwLI