Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: Monkeyleg on March 24, 2014, 12:39:21 AM
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I was talking to an old friend on the phone today. He loves to argue politics, and I hate arguing politics with him, as he just throws absurd arguments rapid-fire, too fast to really respond to.
He doesn't like being called a liberal, and insists that he's a conservative. He bases that assertion on the fact that he's debt-free and not on welfare. He voted for Obama twice, for Kerry and Al Gore, Clinton and God only knows who before that. He favors raising the minimum wage to $12. He thinks that CEO salaries should be controlled and slashed, so that the money can be given to the "workers".
When I told him that raising the minimum wage would give many employers no choice but to eliminate some jobs, he insisted that those who lost their jobs would do something else, like start their own businesses. When I countered that entrepreneurial types likely don't work at McDonalds, he dug in his heels and said that these people would open businesses. When I said that highly paid CEO's are sought out for their talents, he insisted that anyone can do those jobs. He doesn't seem to have a problem with sports figures, actors and musicians making eight figures a year, though.
He's a public sector union worker, and hates Wisconsin's governor, who eliminated collective bargaining for public sector unions, and who turned a $1.5 billion budget deficit into a surplus. He thinks that the governor balanced the budget on the backs of public workers, and that there's nothing wrong with public sector unions negotiating with the same legislators whose campaigns they finance.
He hates oil companies, as he thinks that they're gouging the public, but has no problem with gas taxes. He hates pharmaceutical companies, but favors Obamacare.
It's scary to look inside the mind of a liberal.
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I used to work with a guy that claimed to be a conservative. He voted for O, in 2008. He thought Bill O'Reilly was a far-right-winger.
He disapproved of Obamacare, except for the most obviously wrong-headed part of the whole thing (coverage for pre-existing conditions).
Illinois. =|
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Obama is about to make raising the minimum wage to $10 / hour his touchstone for the next election. Charleston Air Force base had a Mickey D's owned by a contractor. . . . . you know, the very one impacted by Obama's edict. Well, seems $10 and hour is make or break in the services sector. It closed down.
Raw probability says Obama will at some point screw up and do something right. It ain't happened yet which tells me he is working a plan to perfection. I thought Carter was amazingly consistent at being wrong. Obama makes Carter look like piker.
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Raw probability says Obama will at some point screw up and do something right.
You say that like you think they are leaving any of it up to chance. [tinfoil]
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He's right...he isnt a liberal...he's a *expletive deleted*ing commie rat bastard.
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That is the big problem with throwing around labels these days. They are often meaningless because everyone has a different view of what the label means. You really have to go issue by issue and get deeper into the what and why questions to really know what someone thinks. Unfortunately, a lot of politicians won't answer those questions.
I have always considered myself conservative, but I am sure there are some out there who would call small govt conservatives libertarians.
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It's scary to look inside the mind of a liberal.
Yeah, black holes scare me too =(
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Meh, I say socially liberal and fiscally conservative. In other words small L libertarian on most issues. Rarely "liberal" or even "classical liberal" (ie the Founding Fathers).
Most folks mean "liberal" to mean "socially liberal and fiscally liberal".
Most folks mean "conservative" to allegedly mean "social conservative and fiscally conservative", which is extremely rare the case in terms of actually elected conservatives. Many, many social conservatives are as fiscally liberal, or more fiscally liberal than most social liberals. "Tax and spend" is far better idea than "Borrow and spend".
One axis labels tend to be disingenuous at best. Gee, big surprise.
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I'll just drop this right here:
http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/03/rand-paul-america-hates-liberterians-104858.html#.UzBcOoVjW5U
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Meh, I say socially liberal and fiscally conservative. In other words small L libertarian on most issues. Rarely "liberal" or even "classical liberal" (ie the Founding Fathers).
Most folks mean "liberal" to mean "socially liberal and fiscally liberal".
Most folks mean "conservative" to allegedly mean "social conservative and fiscally conservative", which is extremely rare the case in terms of actually elected conservatives. Many, many social conservatives are as fiscally liberal, or more fiscally liberal than most social liberals. "Tax and spend" is far better idea than "Borrow and spend".
One axis labels tend to be disingenuous at best. Gee, big surprise.
I think you need to separate politicians who call themselves X from actual humans who call themselves X. I think it's a given at this point that %99 of all policritters want big .gov.
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I was talking to an old friend on the phone today. He loves to argue politics, and I hate arguing politics with him, as he just throws absurd arguments rapid-fire, too fast to really respond to.
He doesn't like being called a liberal, and insists that he's a conservative. He bases that assertion on the fact that he's debt-free and not on welfare. He voted for Obama twice, for Kerry and Al Gore, Clinton and God only knows who before that. He favors with sports figures, actors and musicians making eight figures a year, though.
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It's scary to look inside the "mind" of a liberal.
I've given up trying to understand some human beings.
"philosophical zombies (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophical_zombie)", or, "the noetic effects of sin (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presuppositional_apologetics)". Pick one.
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If I had to pick a label it would be libertist or anarchtarian.
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Funny you should mention this, Dick
Was in the local folks music shop the other day, killing time. The owner (OLD school hippy) comes over to chat me up, and the topic of the Gibson "Government Model" comes up. He "explained" why Gibson got raided: because "this president is a conservative!"
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Funny you should mention this, Dick
Was in the local folks music shop the other day, killing time. The owner (OLD school hippy) comes over to chat me up, and the topic of the Gibson "Government Model" comes up. He "explained" why Gibson got raided: because "this president is a conservative!"
Did he offer you a hit off his doobie? Or maybe he's been stoned since the 1980's, and thinks that Reagan is the president.