Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: Brad Johnson on April 13, 2014, 06:39:36 PM
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Posted this in the BLM/Nevada "Could Get Interesting" thread, but thought it important enough to have it's own separate entry.
Given the public relations butt-kicking BLM just received in Nevada, it's going to be interesting to see what happens in Texas. They're trying to redraw property boundaries in a way that will effectively seize about 90k acres of ranch and farmland properties along the Red River (Texas/Oklahoma border).
http://www.rfdtv.com/story/25206377/oklahoma-texas-border-dispute-has-ranchers-worried
These shenanigans are happening in Vernon, about 30 miles from my home town of Crowell. Only in this case it's not a lone state's-rights semi-minuteman who's already had several days in court and lost, it's a bunch of everyday upstanding community members with lots of close friend, a tight-knit ag community, and a very, very, very supportive local population of several tens of thousands.
Brad
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what happened in the lawsuit henderson lost?
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what happened in the lawsuit henderson lost?
The government said they could do what ever they damned well please and he could just shut the hell up about it.
I'm sure you're ok with that though.
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What's that old saying? Oh, yeah ...
"I love my country but I fear my government."
You'd think they (the government, in general) would learn. Anybody remember the Kelo case in New London, Connecticut? That was the one that went all the way to the Supreme Court, and none other than Chief Justice Roberts cast the deciding vote that a government (in that case the city) could take property by eminent domain and then turn it over to a private, for-profit developer. The so-called logic behind this was that taking the land for use as something that would generate more tax income made it a taking for public purposes.
I saw an article a few weeks ago on Kelo. Turns out the developer backed out of the deal, so the city of New London spent a lot on money on lawyers, tore down an historic neighborhood, and they now have a bunch of empty land that's generating zero tax revenues.
Karma is a female dog.
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I think the Kelo case pre-dates Roberts appointment by a short time.
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Which Justice was it that had property taken under Kelo? Souter?
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I think the Kelo case pre-dates Roberts appointment by a short time.
Yup, it was under Rehnquist, who was one of the 4 (IIRC) dissenters.
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Yup, it was under Rehnquist, who was one of the 4 (IIRC) dissenters.
According to wiki the majority consisted of "Justice Stevens who wrote the majority opinion, joined by Justices Anthony Kennedy, David Souter, Ruth Bader Ginsburg and Stephen Breyer."
"The principal dissent was issued on 25 June 2005 by Justice O'Connor, joined by Chief Justice Rehnquist and Justices Scalia and Thomas."
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According to wiki the majority consisted of "Justice Stevens who wrote the majority opinion, joined by Justices Anthony Kennedy, David Souter, Ruth Bader Ginsburg and Stephen Breyer."
"The principal dissent was issued on 25 June 2005 by Justice O'Connor, joined by Chief Justice Rehnquist and Justices Scalia and Thomas."
Damn swing vote Kennedy.
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The government said they could do what ever they damned well please and he could just shut the hell up about it.
I'm sure you're ok with that though.
He'd prefer that there be a good ole fashioned no-knock followed by some beatings and dog shootings.
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What's that old saying? Oh, yeah ...
"I love my country but I fear my government."
You'd think they (the government, in general) would learn. Anybody remember the Kelo case in New London, Connecticut? That was the one that went all the way to the Supreme Court, and none other than Chief Justice Roberts cast the deciding vote that a government (in that case the ity) could take property by eminent domain and then turn it over to a private, for-profit developer. The so-called logic behind this was that taking the land for use as something that would generate more tax income made it a taking for public purposes.
I saw an article a few weeks ago on Kelo. Turns out the developer backed out of the deal, so the city of New London spent a lot on money on lawyers, tore down an historic neighborhood, and they now have a bunch of empty land that's generating zero tax revenues.
Karma is a female dog.
People should remember that next time someone says "ZOMG! We gotta vote for a Repub or the Dems will appoint a liberal!!!!!!eleventy!!!!!!
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People should remember that next time someone says "ZOMG! We gotta vote for a Repub or the Dems will appoint a liberal!!!!!!eleventy!!!!!!
If you'd have read a bit further in this thread you'd have seen it was before Roberts' time. Although I find it unforgivable to twist the law as he did to find Obamacare unconstitutional, it was Kennedy who cast the deciding vote on Kelo.
Who, I will note, was appointed by Ronald Reagan.
Which, of course, leads me to ask- how come only Republicans get tricked by their picks, but Democrat picks ALWAYS stay true to the left-wing?
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If you'd have read a bit further in this thread you'd have seen it was before Roberts' time. Although I find it unforgivable to twist the law as he did to find Obamacare unconstitutional, it was Kennedy who cast the deciding vote on Kelo.
Who, I will note, was appointed by Ronald Reagan.
Which, of course, leads me to ask- how come only Republicans get tricked by their picks, but Democrat picks ALWAYS stay true to the left-wing?
Thanks for the correction. And it is indeed troubling that a Reagan appointee was a turncoat to the the Constitution.
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If you'd have read a bit further in this thread you'd have seen it was before Roberts' time. Although I find it unforgivable to twist the law as he did to find Obamacare unconstitutional, it was Kennedy who cast the deciding vote on Kelo.
Who, I will note, was appointed by Ronald Reagan.
Which, of course, leads me to ask- how come only Republicans get tricked by their picks, but Democrat picks ALWAYS stay true to the left-wing?
DC is a ratchet that only tightens to the left.
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DC is a ratchet that only tightens to the left.
Unfortunately, corruption is bipartisan.
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Unfortunately, corruption is bipartisan.
Oh, absolutely. But I don't know that the Supremes are becoming corrupt, just more and more statist.
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Oh, absolutely. But I don't know that the Supremes are becoming corrupt, just more and more statist.
When were they ever not statists? Marshall et al set the tone with horrific decisions early on.
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People should remember that next time someone says "ZOMG! We gotta vote for a Repub or the Dems will appoint a liberal!!!!!!eleventy!!!!!!
Okay, it wasn't Roberts. Imagine that -- fallible memory.
Sorry, folks. But the name of the Chief Justice wasn't the point of mentioning Kelo. The point was that the .gov is not immune to shooting itself in the collective foot.
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Okay, it wasn't Roberts. Imagine that -- fallible memory.
Sorry, folks. But the name of the Chief Justice wasn't the point of mentioning Kelo. The point was that the .gov is not immune to shooting itself in the collective foot.
We are indeed doomed.
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Which, of course, leads me to ask- how come only Republicans get tricked by their picks, but Democrat picks ALWAYS stay true to the left-wing?
just for once I would like to see a centrist go all right wing extremist
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Story has gone mainstream media, only this time the BLM isn't facing a couple hundred pissed of ranchers in the middle of nowhere. Now they have the State of Texas officially giving them the stinkeye.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/04/22/republicans-warn-blm-eyeing-land-grab-along-texas-oklahoma-border/
Texas Attorney General Greg Abbott's letter to the BLM. Summary (paraphrased)... "Legally justify your position or STFU and GTFO."
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/interactive/2014/04/22/greg-abbott-letter-to-bureau-land-management/
Couple of folks I know in polittikul inner circles are hinting that Gov Perry is quietly putting together a Thor's Hammer solution should the BLM try to muscle this thing forward.
Brad
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The federal .gov can't adequately manage the land it already lays claim to. They should not be even considering appropriating more.
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Story has gone mainstream media, only this time the BLM isn't facing a couple hundred pissed of ranchers in the middle of nowhere. Now they have the State of Texas officially giving them the stinkeye.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/04/22/republicans-warn-blm-eyeing-land-grab-along-texas-oklahoma-border/
Texas Attorney General Greg Abbott's letter to the BLM. Summary (paraphrased)... "Legally justify your position or STFU and GTFO."
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/interactive/2014/04/22/greg-abbott-letter-to-bureau-land-management/
Couple of folks I know in polittikul inner circles are hinting that Gov Perry is quietly putting together a Thor's Hammer solution should the BLM try to muscle this thing forward.
Brad
He ought to give him the same treatment he gives coyotes.
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Great letter from ag. Can anybody find the case the one rancher lost 30 years ago? It would be interesting to see what happened and what the arguments used were
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk
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Couple of folks I know in polittikul inner circles are hinting that Gov Perry is quietly putting together a Thor's Hammer solution should the BLM try to muscle this thing forward.
My google-fu doesn't immediately answer the question, so I must ask: What's Thor's Hammer Solution?
(And, although a device like the Stargate Thor's Hammer that scans all entrants into Texas and keeps out government bureaucrats would be great... I don't think that's what you're referring to.)
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My google-fu doesn't immediately answer the question, so I must ask: What's Thor's Hammer Solution?
Mjölnir = "That which smashes"
Brad
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The federal .gov can't adequately manage the land it already lays claim to. They should not be even considering appropriating more.
We can't even fix this problem at the local level. The city is constantly doing the "We can't keep up with repairs to the streets and sewers, but we're going to annex more anyway."
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My google-fu doesn't immediately answer the question, so I must ask: What's Thor's Hammer Solution?
I'm hoping it's Jerry Pournelle's orbital kinetic bombardment system. Perry never quite lives up to my highest expectations, though.
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Talking to Dad this morning and he mentioned that the original case had settled a couple years back, and that a few other positives have come about since. It appears I didn't do any followup so here's a quick revisit in the interest of closure and complete info.
TLDR version: The BLM figured out they were about to get their poop forcefully reinserted so they "settled" (attorney-spin for the BLM giving up and slinking away like the rotten, petty, yellow cowards they are). Boundaries reverted to pre-redraw locations and boundary criteria clarified. Later, a Texas attempt at making sure the BLM used third-party surveyors rather than their own internal crews as a way to ensure objectivity. More recently, a ruling mandated that fed access to the properties was strictly limited, requiring landholder pre-notification and adherence to a designated route. I see some references to a more structured and independently-managed survey program currently in progress, but didn't follow the rabbit hole.
The 2017 settlement.
https://www.texastribune.org/2017/11/08/texas-red-river-land-lawsuit-ends-settlement/
More recent update on proposed restrictions greatly limiting the BLM's surveying authorities, including a requirement for surveys to be done by disinterested third parties.
https://www.timesrecordnews.com/story/news/local/2019/02/09/measure-protects-landowners-embroiled-red-river-boundary-clash/2825255002/
Late 2019 ruling which puts strict limits on fed access to private land along the Red River. (i.e. no more of this "go wherever, whenever, just because we can" business)
https://texasfarmbureau.org/judge-allow-federal-access-private-property-along-red-river/
Brad
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Kneel before BLM!
Oh wait, wrong BLM