Help me find a cheap, good car!

[Nick1911]

I have a friend (an international student) who needs to buy a car.  He can't spend more then $3k.  We've looked at some Honda's in that price range, and frankly, 3k doesn't buy much.

So now we're looking at a 2000 Mercury Mystique.  It has 122k miles on it, with an automatic tranny.

Now I haven't had that new of a Ford car.  How many miles, with regular maintenance, can he reasonable expect this car to go?  He does not work on his own cars, so repair costs are a good thing to keep in mind.

Anyone have any experience with one of these, or newer Ford's in general?

Thanks!

[Manedwolf]

Make sure it's not a rental return. Those are rode hard.

Get a CarFax subscription for a few weeks, run the VIN to see the complete history. If it's 7 years old, it might have unreported accidents, too.

There's also this on Wikipedia, take it as you will:

The Mystique went into production on August 15, 1994 and ended on December 23, 1999. Poor customer acceptance, various mechanical ailments, such as constant stalling that baffled technicians, and its short life led to the nickname "the Mercury Mistake". As a result, a used Mystique can be purchased for much less than similar used cars from competing companies, such as the Chrysler Cirrus or Honda Accord.

[Parker Dean]

It's always possible that you may run across one that bucks the trend but the Contour/Mystique models have a poor reputation with the auto repair crowd that I know. They also have the opinion that they are unnecessarily difficult to work on.

With 3K or so to spend I'd probably be looking at a Crown Victoria. For all intents and purposes it's an F150 with a different body. It's also comparitively unpopular so you get more for your money. Plus, should you need parts they are common and cheap. I hardly ever see these things in a shop, and if I do see one it's usually in for pente-ante stuff like window motors, door lock actuators, and the occasional evaporator. I've only seen one engine failure that I can recall and it had a rod out the side of the block that also took out the compressor. "But it was just idling in the garage, I swear." Yeah, right

[roo_ster]

Parker Dean has some good advice.

If a used Ford model is selling for less than a comparable Chrysler product, RUN, do not walk away from the Ford.  Usually, Chrysler has the worst resale of any American automaker.  The Mistake may be aptly named.

My first inclination is to wonder how much seating he needs?  $3K can buy many an older CHevy/GMC/Ford 1/2 ton pickup.  Parts are cheap & mechanics know them.  (FWIW, the Ford F150 is the best selling vehicle on the planet Earth.  The Chevy 1500 is second, by only a few thousand units.)

As for a $3K used car, I wold look into used GM mid-sized cars with a V-6.  They are not as sophisticated as the Hondas, but withstand poor maintenence over time with fewer complaints.  Century, Regal, Impala, etc.

Here is a quick & dirty kbb.com comparo of a few.  Note, the condition I used was "Excellent," which is usually the top 5-10% of the available autos of the type:
http://www.kbb.com/KBB/CompareCars/Report.aspx?CompareCarsSelectionHistory=5440%7c3875%7c75080%7c100%7c10%7c%24%24%24&CompareCarsVehicleIds=5440-5494-5453-10604

[Nick1911]

My first inclination is to wonder how much seating he needs?  $3K can buy many an older CHevy/GMC/Ford 1/2 ton pickup.  Parts are cheap & mechanics know them.  (FWIW, the Ford F150 is the best selling vehicle on the planet Earth.  The Chevy 1500 is second, by only a few thousand units.)

Trucks need not apply.  Gas is expensive.

As for a $3K used car, I wold look into used GM mid-sized cars with a V-6.  They are not as sophisticated as the Hondas, but withstand poor maintenence over time with fewer complaints.  Century, Regal, Impala, etc.

Interesting, we'll have to check out some GM cars.  The Crown Vic isn't a bad idea as well.  Thanks.

[Manedwolf]

The crown vic is a gas-guzzler, though. Massive V8, engine and mechanical design from the Reagan years.

My parents still have a 99 or so Grand Marquis, the higher-end version, and the thing DEVOURS premium gas.

[Nick1911]

The crown vic is a gas-guzzler, though. Massive V8, engine and mechanical design from the Reagan years.

My parents still have a 99 or so Grand Marquis, the higher-end version, and the thing DEVOURS premium gas.

Hmm... I thought the newer one's were better.  I have a friend with a 95 Olds 88 that gets 30mpg highway and 20-22 city... not too bad for a big car.

My 89 crown vic gets about 12-16 city and 20 hwy...

[Ron]

Tell him to look into the mid to late 90's BMW 3 series.

Great cars, the 3 series are why they are called the ultimate driving machine.

[Nick1911]

Tell him to look into the mid to late 90's BMW 3 series.

Great cars, the 3 series are why they are called the ultimate driving machine.

• They are out of his price range.
• They suck on fuel
• I'd guess they suck on insurance
• Two friends with early 90's 3-series have had major electrical issues
• They eat 91 octane fuel
• I'm told parts and labor are expensive

Thanks for the suggestion, but I don't think BMW fits his needs.  (A cheap, fairly reliable car, that's good on gas)

[Ron]

    * They are out of his price range = you can find them around here in the 3k range all day
   
     * They suck on fuel = my 94 which I have owned since 95 averages 27mpg, this is with the six cylinder and ME driving.

    * I'd guess they suck on insurance = for liability?

    * Two friends with early 90's 3-series have had major electrical issues = I guess if you say so, my car hasn't had any in 12 years

    * They eat 91 octane fuel = who told you that? not true

    * I'm told parts and labor are expensive = relative to a GM product probably so


Just throwing it out there, you get what you pay for. You can buy lightly used high end cars and actually get the experience of driving something of quality.

To put it in perspective you would choose a Mercury Mystique over an older car that was 30-40k brand new. Used luxury cars are in my opinion a great bang for the buck.

As far as American vehicles, esp trucks I'm a Ford man all the way.

[Iain]

I don't know if these are available in the US, but I just spent similar money on a '96 Nissan Almera. It only has 68,000 miles on the clock, so it was a little more expensive than a higher, but still acceptable, mileage car of that age would be.

1.4 engine is pretty tiddly, but it is 16v so there is some pep and 70mph+ speeds are comfortable for it (I'll not admit to going higher). It should return 40mpg which is ok, but I haven't done enough miles in it yet to see what it is actually getting.

Around 2000 a survey of motorists found it to be one of the most reliable and cheap to service cars on the road at the time. It looks dull, and it pretty much is dull, but I paid £1200 for it. In the UK there are 20 insurance groups (group 20 being the most expensive to insure) My Almera is a group 5, if I didn't have the fancy GX (electric windows and sunroof!) it would be group 4.

[Nick1911]

Sadly, I'm not finding any 3-series listed within 100 miles of here for under 4k. 

Maybe I'm not looking in the right places?

[Ron]

Sadly, I'm not finding any 3-series listed within 100 miles of here for under 4k.  undecided

Where I am at the market is flooded with BMWs, it may not be a very good indicator of prices around the country. The only reason I have any idea about prices is I was thinking about selling my car and getting a truck.

Getting only around three thousand for it I might as well just keep the thing.

[Brad Johnson]

Try an '01 or '02 Mazda Protege'.

Brad

[RadioFreeSeaLab]

Volvo 240, any year.  3k will buy a fantastic one.

[Brad Johnson]

There's always a Ford Aspire (so named because it aspires to be a car).

Brad

[Bogie]

Gas is cheap. What is your total transportation budget? If a car costs $1000 more a year to maintain, that's 6,000 miles at 15mpg...
 

 
 

[mgdavis]

Geo Metro. I've heard that they are decent cars, for econo-boxes.

[thebaldguy]

Check out Consumer Reports; they might have some good info. Look at Toyotas and Nissans.

[Gord]

Ford Probe GTs are pretty good-looking and, at least around here, are fairly cheap (when you can find 'em) - my first car was a '95 with 92k miles for $2,200 As far as I can tell, it's the most fun-on-wheels you can get for $2-3k. The automatics are a bit sluggish at low RPMs though, and if I recall mileage is only 23/27 EPA ratings... not terrible for a V6, but not as good as a Geo Metro I'm sure. At least he'll get a little more girly attention that way, especially with the stock GT rims

Old four-banger Toyota pickups are pretty much a dime a dozen anywhere, and while they usually have high miles, they're built to last and I've seen many over 300k miles still being used as daily work trucks and running fine. Just make sure he can drive stick as AFAIK they're all manuals. Better economy than a V6 or V8, he's still got the ground clearance and (light) hauling capability and older trucks are easy to work on - I miss the days of wide-open engine compartments, five-minute oil changes and only having to unscrew a wingnut to change an oil filter.

[wmenorr67]

Hey Nick,

You still in KC?  If so look on the Kansas side towards KCK and stay away from Johnson County and the Missouri side.  Cars were a little more expensive on the Missouri side when I lived there anyway for some reason.

[Parker Dean]

My beef with the GM intermediate front-crawlers is a couple of known issues, the biggest being the lower intake gaskets. IMO, GM deliberately sabotaged the coolant passage support in the gasket so that it would blow out at regular intervals. You can see the notches in the plastic support around the coolant pasage. While lower intake gaskets are not too terribly tough they are harder on the 3.1/3.4 than you'd think. You have to pull the rockers and pushrods out because the pushrods go through the intake. But what worse is these frequently contaminated the oil with coolant and to often have bearing issues a few months later. Buying a used one you don't know if the bomb went off already or not.

The 4T60's those things have give me the heebie-jeebies, too. Damn reaction shells like to break even more frequently than the rear-drive 4L60E's sun shell, and that's a lot. Getting a tranny out of a front drive GM is no picnic.

Then there's their constant appetite for alternators, a/c compressors, and hub bearings.

Oh, and availability of cheap older Toyota trucks is entirely dependent on how close you are to the Mexican border. Getting difficult to find one at all in Texas. They've even disappeared from the southbound convoys for the most part.

While we're on known issues, the CV has one big one. Ford used a composite plastic intake and the coolant passage between the heads at the front blows out. A new aftermarket intake is about $400 but finding a CV that's already had the intake replace is easy to verify. Just look right behind the alternator and if you see an cast aluminum passage from head to head, the intake has already been replaced. Most will have already been done but you should verify for yourself.

[Jamisjockey]

Hyundai.  I've said it before.  Hyundai!

[Manedwolf]

Geo Metro. I've heard that they are decent cars, for econo-boxes.

Until you see one jammed under an SUV. I have. Wasn't pretty.

On the plus side, though, when it runs out of gas, you can crumple it up and turn it in for recycling...   

[Scout26]

An older Saab 900.  4 Cylinder engine gets around 25-30 MPG (Even better if you can drive a stick).  Lots of space to haul crap.  Solid, won't kill you on insurance (get Min. Liability coverage).  And if you get into an accident, fairly decent chance of walking away alive.