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Author Topic: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War  (Read 5755 times)

Sindawe

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Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« on: June 20, 2011, 06:47:39 PM »
Momument to the brave peace loving workers of the (former) Soviet Union get a make over.



http://sofiaecho.com/2011/06/19/1108734_gallery-soviet-army-monument-in-sofia-gets-touch-of-colour
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Viking

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2011, 06:52:09 PM »
Love it! =D
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lee n. field

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2011, 07:19:21 PM »
Quote
said that authorities would try to find the culprits and would seek to clean up the monument, but it was unlikely to happen right away.

 =D =D =D
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Zardozimo Oprah Bannedalas

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2011, 07:53:48 PM »
Dashed clever, especially Santa Claus with the PPSh.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2011, 08:01:03 PM »
A comment on the web page:

Quote
It's not just funny, it really says something. I know some Bulgarians were seriously put out by the paint job, but considering the soviet legacy in Bulgaria, it's worth it. The modern battleground is US pop culture as the imperialist, and this person knew what he was doing. Follow the art, always!


I guess there just aren't any real imperialists to fight these days. Poor revolutionaries.
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MicroBalrog

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2011, 08:12:53 PM »
Can we repaint the Iwo Jima memorial next?
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roo_ster

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2011, 09:38:47 PM »
Quote from: MicroBalrog on June 20, 2011, 08:12:53 PM
Can we repaint the Iwo Jima memorial next?

Sure, after the US gov't kills millions of its citizens and imposes totalitarianism on a bunch of neighboring states.
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MicroBalrog

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2011, 10:08:39 PM »
Quote from: roo_ster on June 20, 2011, 09:38:47 PM
Sure, after the US gov't kills millions of its citizens and imposes totalitarianism on a bunch of neighboring states.

Given that this monument commemorates Bulgarian, rather than merely Soviet, soldiers, I don't think this applies.
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stevelyn

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #8 on: June 20, 2011, 10:27:51 PM »
Quote from: MicroBalrog on June 20, 2011, 08:12:53 PM
Can we repaint the Iwo Jima memorial next?

Unlike the Marines at Iwo Jima, there was absolutely nothing good about the Soviets or the Soviet army regardless of whom they were fighting against.
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MicroBalrog

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #9 on: June 20, 2011, 10:41:58 PM »
Quote from: stevelyn on June 20, 2011, 10:27:51 PM
Unlike the Marines at Iwo Jima, there was absolutely nothing good about the Soviets or the Soviet army regardless of whom they were fighting against.

I think you'll find that Communism is no longer in power. The reason these monuments were maintained and kept up in the ex-Soviet countries has little to do with Communism.
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Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

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freakazoid

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #10 on: June 21, 2011, 12:25:30 AM »
Wow, that is pretty awesome and clearly took some planning.
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Balog

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #11 on: June 21, 2011, 01:41:32 AM »
I tend to be a "judge actions based on what they are" kinda guy. And if the Soviet conscripts handn't done such an admirable job of holding the Nazis at bay, German High Command might have gotten around to finally offing Hitler and putting someone sane and competent in charge.

I can hate Eisenhower, MacArthur et al for the Bonus Army incident, and still laud their deeds in WWII. I can hate everything Communism is and still recognize the cost in blood paid by it's slave soldiers to stop the Third Reich.
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Sindawe

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #12 on: June 21, 2011, 02:02:42 AM »
Quote
And if the Soviet conscripts handn't done such an admirable job of holding the Nazis at bay, German High Command might have gotten around to finally offing Hitler and putting someone sane and competent in charge.

/Emphatic cough

On the scale of things, Leninism/Stalanism was nest of angry wasps on crack.  Its adherents were crazy and dangerous, but did not spread real well since it failed to appeal to some basic human drives. Don't make it angry(er) and eventually it died out.

National Socialism was aerosolized Ebola.  Adherents are still crazy and dangerous, and smarter nut-cases DO know how to reach out with a sweet message that hides the bitter pill inside.  The infection was mostly stamped out, but vectors still roam free.
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MicroBalrog

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #13 on: June 21, 2011, 02:32:30 AM »
Quote from: Balog on June 21, 2011, 01:41:32 AM
I tend to be a "judge actions based on what they are" kinda guy. And if the Soviet conscripts handn't done such an admirable job of holding the Nazis at bay, German High Command might have gotten around to finally offing Hitler and putting someone sane and competent in charge.

I can hate Eisenhower, MacArthur et al for the Bonus Army incident, and still laud their deeds in WWII. I can hate everything Communism is and still recognize the cost in blood paid by it's slave soldiers to stop the Third Reich.

Notably, to the best of my knowledge my grandfather was a volunteer. Not that this really mattered at the time.
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Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

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Balog

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #14 on: June 21, 2011, 02:36:12 AM »
I remember someone once gave me a copy of Turner Diaries, with the only instructions being to destroy the damn thing after I was done with it. Iirc it took a while before it went from "bad tikiwiki novel" to "horrifying screed." As a race traitor who started carrying after a bunch of skin head idiots with SS runes on their craptastic S10 almost jumped me for kissing on my Mexican gf, it was truly disturbing.
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Quote from: French G.
I was always pleasant, friendly and within arm's reach of a gun.

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If government is the answer, it must have been a really, really, really stupid question.

Balog

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #15 on: June 21, 2011, 02:42:06 AM »
Micro: I know some of the Army was strapping young lads eager to defend the Rodina (did I spell that correctly?), but a good number were conscripts forced to fight at gun point.

Or so is my understanding, correct me if I am mis-stating.
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Quote from: French G.
I was always pleasant, friendly and within arm's reach of a gun.

Quote from: Standing Wolf
If government is the answer, it must have been a really, really, really stupid question.

MicroBalrog

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #16 on: June 21, 2011, 02:47:51 AM »
At some point I'm going to post about my grandfather's military record.

He was one of these people who fought in the really stages of the war. What records I could find are all to the tune that his unit was issued rifles, but no real uniforms to speak of.
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Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

Lanius

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #17 on: June 21, 2011, 04:05:53 AM »
Weren't all major WWII militaries mainly made up of conscripts, that is people who were fighting involuntarily?

The only difference there was how harshly disobedience was punished. US Army never shot deserters or people who refused to fight out of hand, but then, it was never engaged in a life and death struggle against the Wehrmacht for three years.

@Sindawe

You are so wrong it's not funny. Nazism doesn't spread well, because it is a racist ideology with limited appeal for non-Aryans. Communism, or it's milder forms, on the other hand, is to be found almost everywhere..
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Hawkmoon

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #18 on: June 21, 2011, 06:36:40 AM »
Quote from: MicroBalrog on June 21, 2011, 02:32:30 AM
Notably, to the best of my knowledge my grandfather was a volunteer. Not that this really mattered at the time.

The U.S. Army in which I served in Vietnam was likewise a mix of volunteers and conscripts. Both bled the same when shot.
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K Frame

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #19 on: June 21, 2011, 06:51:35 AM »
"US Army never shot deserters"

I'm sure Eddie Slovik would disagree with you.

If he hadn't been court martialed and shot for desertion.
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Lanius

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #20 on: June 21, 2011, 07:36:43 AM »
Slovik was the only deserter to be shot. Red Army did that regularily, and IIRC, officers had the power of summary execution..
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MicroBalrog

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #21 on: June 21, 2011, 07:49:48 AM »
Quote from: Lanius on June 21, 2011, 07:36:43 AM
Slovik was the only deserter to be shot. Red Army did that regularily, and IIRC, officers had the power of summary execution..

Not legally. Although I am quite sure quite a few men have been shot without the authorities ever finding out, much less caring.
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Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

dogmush

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #22 on: June 21, 2011, 07:58:11 AM »
Quote from: Lanius on June 21, 2011, 07:36:43 AM
Slovik was the only deserter to be shot. Red Army did that regularily, and IIRC, officers had the power of summary execution..

Technically, so do ours.*



*Not that I've ever heard of it being used, but it is mentioned in training.

I think that's actually pretty much military standard.  In combat conditions quite a lot is acceptable under the guise of "Maintaining good order and discpline."
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vaskidmark

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #23 on: June 21, 2011, 08:03:50 AM »
Quote from: Lanius on June 21, 2011, 07:36:43 AM
Slovik was the only deserter to be shot. Red Army did that regularily, and IIRC, officers had the power of summary execution..

As do officers and non-commissioned officers in the US forces.  The only stipulation is you must be deserting in the face of the enemy for them to be allowed to shoot you.

stay safe.
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MicroBalrog

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Re: Heroes of the Great Patrotic War
« Reply #24 on: June 21, 2011, 08:17:06 AM »
Quote from: vaskidmark on June 21, 2011, 08:03:50 AM
As do officers and non-commissioned officers in the US forces.  The only stipulation is you must be deserting in the face of the enemy for them to be allowed to shoot you.

Was there any of this stuff in recent wars, and I mean in the past 50 years?
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Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner
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