Armed Polite Society

Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: MechAg94 on September 24, 2021, 08:09:16 PM

Title: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: MechAg94 on September 24, 2021, 08:09:16 PM
https://www.yahoo.com/news/juvenile-hunter-fatally-shoots-suspected-182100715.html

Quote
A Missouri boy fatally shot an alleged thief with an arrow after catching the man trying to steal a tractor on a family friend’s property, authorities said Tuesday.

Quote
The family’s attorney said the young hunter warned the man several times to stop and was “in fear of his safety” as the accused thief came closer, according to the sheriff’s office. The man apparently did not stop, so the boy released an arrow that fatally struck him, authorities said.

Assuming the facts are right, I hope things work out for them and they don't get screwed over. 
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: T.O.M. on September 24, 2021, 08:13:09 PM
So...what draw weight for a tractor thief? 
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: MillCreek on September 24, 2021, 08:23:55 PM
I, for one, would not want to take a broadhead to the chest.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: RoadKingLarry on September 24, 2021, 08:35:08 PM
So...what draw weight for a tractor thief?

45# and a good sharp broadhead on your arrow will give you a passthrough on 90% of any game animal or 2 legged vermin in the lower 48.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: MillCreek on September 24, 2021, 10:00:48 PM
^^^Since I know nothing of archery, what is 'passthrough " in this context? The arrow is sticking out the other side?
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Ron on September 24, 2021, 10:18:54 PM
^^^Since I know nothing of archery, what is 'passthrough " in this context? The arrow is sticking out the other side?

Passes all the way through.

I don't think there are any penetration issues hunting with modern bows.

Hopefully you see the LED on your expensive carbon fiber arrow after it passes through the deer.

Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Bogie on September 24, 2021, 11:08:19 PM
Yeah, and when the damn thing tunnels under a dozen or so yards of prairie...
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: 230RN on September 25, 2021, 12:22:09 AM
Passes all the way through.

I don't think there are any penetration issues hunting with modern bows.

Hopefully you see the LED on your expensive carbon fiber arrow after it passes through the deer.



I did a penetration experiment once.  Dropped a 230 grain .45 bullet onto a slice of steak on a cutting board from three feet up and the nose barely dented it.

Repeated this with a broadhead arrow and the point went right through that steak and stuck in the cutting board it was lying on.

The arrow sure wins in penetration.

Terry
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Northwoods on September 25, 2021, 01:07:41 AM
I did a penetration experiment once.  Dropped a 230 grain .45 bullet onto a slice of steak on a cutting board from three feet up and the nose barely dented it.

Repeated this with a broadhead arrow and the point went right through that steak and stuck in the cutting board it was lying on.

The arrow sure wins in penetration.

Terry

I took hunter safety in AZ close to 20 years ago now.  The did a demo where the fired I think it was a .357mag into a plastic bucket (thin plastic like what a tree or shrub would be sold in) filled with sand.  Then an arrow from a hunting legal bow.  Sand stopped the bullet, but not the arrow.

A bit more meaningful than that kitchen experiment.

Anyway sounds like the kid has a legit self defense claim.  Hopefully they don’t charge him, or his parents.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: 230RN on September 25, 2021, 05:01:14 AM
"A bit more meaningful than that kitchen experiment."

I can't tell if you took that seriously or not.

I first saw that one in an archery magazine back in the 70s.

They weren't serious either.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Devonai on September 25, 2021, 07:09:35 AM
Quote
Anyway sounds like the kid has a legit self defense claim.

May the odds forever be in his favor.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Fly320s on September 25, 2021, 07:45:55 AM
I, for one, would not want to take a broadhead to the chest.

How about a redhead to the groin?
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Boomhauer on September 25, 2021, 08:08:19 AM
I never knew the penetration ability of an arrow from a compound bow until I saw a guy shooting one on an archery range. The standard recurves would just stick in the target, the guy shooting the compound, well, the thickest block we had might as well not have been there. I was impressed.

And the hunting broadheads these days make any hollow point on the market look like a nerf dart.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: K Frame on September 25, 2021, 08:09:20 AM
And this is why we need gun control, damn it!
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: RoadKingLarry on September 25, 2021, 09:26:49 AM
How about a redhead to the groin?

(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51515424099_4e76eb117f_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/2muf1Pe)
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: MechAg94 on September 25, 2021, 01:16:49 PM
I never knew the penetration ability of an arrow from a compound bow until I saw a guy shooting one on an archery range. The standard recurves would just stick in the target, the guy shooting the compound, well, the thickest block we had might as well not have been there. I was impressed.

And the hunting broadheads these days make any hollow point on the market look like a nerf dart.
I would say it all depends on the pull rating of the bow.  I thought compound bows just make it easier to use a bow with a higher pull rating. 

My old boss hunted with a cross bow and he said the bolt would pass through a deer easily.  I don't remember what type of bow.  He was using the mechanical points that extend out on impact.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Northwoods on September 25, 2021, 01:57:41 PM
Most archers I know have gone away from mechanical broadheads.  Too much risk of failure to expand for not enough aerodynamic advantages.

Compound bows have several advantages.  They make it possible to hold a high draw weight bow at full draw.  You also get higher velocities for a given draw weight vs long or recurve bows.  The necessity for stiffer arrows also I think contributes to better accuracy.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: MechAg94 on September 25, 2021, 10:43:45 PM
I don't own a bow, but I have used them a few times.  Compound bows do make it easier.  Last time I fired one was bowfishing.  More than a few years ago.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Angel Eyes on September 26, 2021, 09:51:08 AM
How about a redhead to the groin?

I was thinking "an arrow to the knee" but your way has potential.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: cordex on September 26, 2021, 10:59:55 AM
 :mad:
You guys are pretty blasé about the fact that there is someone out there hunting kids with a bow and arrow.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: RoadKingLarry on September 26, 2021, 11:08:22 AM
:mad:
You guys are pretty blasé about the fact that there is someone out there hunting kids with a bow and arrow.

???

I thought the story was about kids hunting crooks with a bow and arrow.
 =D
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: WLJ on September 26, 2021, 11:28:46 AM
:mad:
You guys are pretty blasé about the fact that there is someone out there hunting kids with a bow and arrow.

What do you hunt them with?
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Hawkmoon on September 26, 2021, 12:07:26 PM
What do you hunt them with?

Bait a line with a couple of cheerleaders and go trolling ...
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: WLJ on September 26, 2021, 12:16:24 PM
Bait a line with a couple of cheerleaders and go trolling ...

If I caught a couple of cheerleaders I doubt I would be using them as bait   :P
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Kingcreek on September 26, 2021, 12:16:52 PM
I would not want to take a hit from a broadhead which is basically a 300ft/second scalpel.
I have shot over 70 Illinois whitetail with arrows, some of the deer quite large. Anything other than a total pass thru is rare and usually because heavy bone stops it or slows it down.
I shot my bow full crank at 72 pounds draw weight for years. In recent years due to age and arthritis I have had to turn my draw weight down lower and lower. Other than a need to adjust my sights, I have seen very little difference in results unless maybe my arrows aren’t stuck in the ground as far after going through the deer.
I never did like mechanical broadheads. I started shooting 100gr muzzy (3blade) many years ago and saw no need to change.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: MillCreek on September 26, 2021, 01:49:35 PM
From the standpoint of I learn something every day, prior to this thread, I had no idea that when hunting with arrows, the entire arrow typically goes through the entire animal.  Wow.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Boomhauer on September 26, 2021, 01:54:38 PM
From the standpoint of I learn something every day, prior to this thread, I had no idea that when hunting with arrows, the entire arrow typically goes through the entire animal.  Wow.

Compound bow and crossbow bolts are nasty. I’d much rather get shot with a bullet, because at least a bullet isn’t cutting a cross section of a broad head in you as it passes through.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Ron on September 26, 2021, 02:20:51 PM
From the standpoint of I learn something every day, prior to this thread, I had no idea that when hunting with arrows, the entire arrow typically goes through the entire animal.  Wow.

About my comment about "seeing the LED", they sell arrow nocks that have a built in LED. That way it is easier when the arrow goes through your target to find it, particularly in low light.

One of my best friends started bow, then crossbow hunting and hasn't used a firearm for deer since.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: MechAg94 on September 26, 2021, 02:41:41 PM
My old boss lived in a community a few miles away that is mostly 1 acre lots.  Lots of deer wandering through and some wild hogs.  He got a cross bow and would take a couple of deer in his yard every year. 

They weren't allowed to use firearms in the community property, but he would have to kill a hog in his yard periodically.  He kept a 10/22 around for that so they would die somewhere else.



Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Devonai on September 26, 2021, 05:25:32 PM
Quote
If I caught a couple of cheerleaders I doubt I would be using them as bait...

Yes officer this comment right here.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: WLJ on September 26, 2021, 06:12:05 PM
Yes officer this comment right here.

Don't interrupt my fantasies
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: RoadKingLarry on September 26, 2021, 06:32:10 PM
Yes officer this comment right here.

Pro sports teams have (nominally) adult cheerleaders.
 =D
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: WLJ on September 26, 2021, 06:38:36 PM
And college
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Ben on September 26, 2021, 06:55:58 PM
And college

Your mom goes to college.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Perd Hapley on September 26, 2021, 11:43:07 PM
Your mom goes to college.

Your mom votes for Pedro.
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Doggy Daddy on September 27, 2021, 12:31:58 AM
Pro sports teams have (nominally) adult cheerleaders.
 =D

Could the word you wanted maybe have been "ostensibly"?   ;/
Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: RoadKingLarry on September 27, 2021, 09:23:59 AM
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/nominal

Title: Re: Juvenile hunter fatally shoots suspected thief with arrow
Post by: Doggy Daddy on September 28, 2021, 11:51:55 AM
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/nominal

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ostensibly (https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ostensibly)

My #2 definition is a shade different from your 3a.  It might just be me, but I like that shade of difference.  Wutevahs.  =|