Author Topic: More background checks coming to Washington state  (Read 3957 times)

roo_ster

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #25 on: November 05, 2014, 09:58:44 AM »
Let the monkey-wrenching begin in Washington.
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roo_ster

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tokugawa

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #26 on: November 05, 2014, 11:12:09 AM »
Apparently my county prosecutor was campaigning for this bill. He also has a strong dislike of our gun club, as he unsuccessfully prosecuted the XO of it for 13! years on a bogus machine gun charge, and is enabling the local handful of  anti gun nuts in their efforts to close the range, which has been in existence since 1921.

 So this gives him a whole new tool to go after the members, especially as per county requirements, all lanes on the range now have video recording of all shooters.
 
 Anyone recall if in the multiple pages of this bill they have changed the waiting period? Previously, if you held a ccw permit, the waiting period was waived.
 
 

Balog

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #27 on: November 05, 2014, 11:32:20 AM »
CO isn't complying. NY isn't complying. CT isn't complying. Hell, even Canadia didn't comply.

WA won't comply with this idiocy either.
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I was always pleasant, friendly and within arm's reach of a gun.

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If government is the answer, it must have been a really, really, really stupid question.

Balog

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #28 on: November 05, 2014, 11:49:44 AM »
I still can't believe they got dry siders to vote for this schiesse.

Quote from: French G.
I was always pleasant, friendly and within arm's reach of a gun.

Quote from: Standing Wolf
If government is the answer, it must have been a really, really, really stupid question.

tokugawa

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #29 on: November 05, 2014, 12:00:04 PM »
 Do you know when this goes into effect?

  It will be impossible to prove an illegal transfer unless the weapon was purchased and recorded after the implementation date, or unless there is an informant.

 So we will now have to get government approval to sell our own property.

 Was their not something about this in the Book of Revelations?
  

Balog

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #30 on: November 05, 2014, 12:09:03 PM »
90 days from now it hits, I believe. Some folks are trying to organize a rally for Olympia, bring a cheap NEF Pardner or something and pass it around in a circle. Set a record for most felonies in a minute.
Quote from: French G.
I was always pleasant, friendly and within arm's reach of a gun.

Quote from: Standing Wolf
If government is the answer, it must have been a really, really, really stupid question.

tokugawa

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #31 on: November 05, 2014, 08:17:36 PM »
Reading the text in the voters handbook, it looks like purchase of a handgun is now restricted to those with a CCW and the approval of a local sheriff or police chief. unless I am misreading it. (section 5) I also do not see any exemption from the waiting period for those with a CCW, as we have now.
 
 Going to be very tough to sell a gun legally now, if you have to go to a dealer to show the gun to a prospective buyer, conclude a deal and a background check, then wait 10 days to go back to the dealer and deliver the gun to the buyer. the gun has to be deliver at the dealer, and shown at the dealer. 
 
 http://sos.wa.gov/_assets/elections/initiatives/FinalText_483.pdf

   

 



AmbulanceDriver

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #32 on: November 05, 2014, 09:22:26 PM »
Looks like it's either:

a) CCW with approval of the sherriff

or

b) the 10 day waiting period.
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BobR

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #33 on: November 05, 2014, 10:57:54 PM »
I still can't believe they got dry siders to vote for this schiesse.



You and me both!!!


I have seen on other forums that the voter's pamphlet said it would be effective 3 Dec 2014. I can't find it online and threw away my book.

bob

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #34 on: November 05, 2014, 11:49:05 PM »
I voted no because I knew it was bad. Can someone do a Cliff Notes condensed version and of the bill?
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BobR

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #35 on: November 06, 2014, 12:39:07 AM »
Probably the largest change that Initiative 594 would bring about is a change in the definition of transfer as it relates to firearms. Currently, to transfer a firearm means to transfer ownership of a firearm to someone else, either by means of a sale, gift, or by inheritance. Firearms transferred as a gift (only allowed within families) or by inheritance do not require the services of a Federal Firearms License (FFL) dealer. On page 6, paragraph 25 of the initiative, the definition of transfer is expanded as the following; “Transfer’ means the intended delivery of a firearm to another person without consideration of payment or promise of payment including, but not limited to, gifts and loans.” Now, there are some exceptions to this, spouses, domestic partners, parents, children, siblings, grandparents, grandchildren, nieces, nephews, first cousins, aunts, and uncles may gift a firearm to one another.

The importance of the term “transfer” is seen in what is required to transfer a firearm. Anytime a firearm is transferred to another person a background check is required.

That may seem alright, until you look at how the term “transfer” is expanded and what is excluded. If you and a friend wanted to go to the local range and go target shooting, neither of you can shoot the others gun as this is now included in the expanded definition of “transfer”. If you wanted to shoot your friends gun you would first have to go to a FFL to have the firearm transferred to you.

On page 7, under the heading “New Section, sec. 3” is the start of 3 pages of explanations of what does and does not constitute a “transfer”. For example, if the firearm is owned by a private shooting club and never leaves the club premises people at that range can use it and that is not considered a transfer. There is a specific exemption to loan a person “if such transfer is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to the person whom the firearm is transferred to.” There is a caveat to this though, “the temporary transfer lasts only as long as immediately necessary to prevent such imminent death or great bodily harm.”

Another exemption has to do with hunters. Say a friend from out of state comes to visit and do some hunting. You can loan your friend a gun to hunt, but only if “the hunting is legal in all places where the person to whom the firearm is transferred possesses the firearm.” So, if you loan a friend a gun for hunting and you give it to the friend at your house you have not met the exemption and have broken the law as it is not lawful to hunt at your house. Or, you loan the friend your gun and you ride in separate cars to the site of the hunt, you again do not meet the exemption and you have broken the law as it is not lawful to hunt from a road.

Another exemption has to do with inheritance. If you inherit any gun, except for a pistol, you do not the services of a FFL to transfer ownership. If you inherit a pistol, however, you have 60 days to either visit a FFL and have the gun transferred to you or you have to contact the department of licensing and report to them that you have a new pistol and that you intend on keeping it. This last part might make you wonder since we do not have gun registration in Washington. This law would invoke registration of handguns without people realizing what they are voting for.

Another new requirement for gun ownership in Washington provided in I-594, specifically in handgun ownership, is that to purchase a handgun from a dealer you must have a concealed carry permit. In other words, in order to own a handgun you must be licensed by the state to do so. Now, some people may think this is a good idea and we can debate that later. The unfortunate thing here is that it is being slipped in the middle (page 10 of a 19 page initiative) in order to keep it from being noticed and debated.

This is how I understand some of it, it is best to read the initiative several times, it is only 18 pages long. But that was long enough to confuse a lot of people, along with the pro 594 only focusing on the "gun show loophole".

It is a bad piece of work, hopefully the SAF will fight to get it repealed.

http://lawfilesext.leg.wa.gov/biennium/2013-14/Pdf/Initiatives/Initiatives/INITIATIVE%20594.pdf

bob
« Last Edit: November 06, 2014, 12:53:32 AM by BobR »

Northwoods

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #36 on: November 06, 2014, 12:49:47 AM »
Damn, that's a whole lot worse than I thought.  Closing the spurious "gun show loophole" was reason enough to oppose it.  This should have garnered a massive campaign from all the gun orgs to defeat it.
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BobR

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #37 on: November 06, 2014, 12:54:54 AM »
I could be wrong on some of this, I pulled it from the text of the initiative and other forums trying to educate others locally about how bad it was. I failed miserably from the looks of it. :(

bob

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #38 on: November 06, 2014, 11:28:39 AM »
Looks like it's either:

a) CCW with approval of the sherriff

or

b) the 10 day waiting period.

I'm not sure that's right.  They way I read Section 5, you don't need the approval of the sheriff if you have a valid CCW.  But, IANAL.
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tokugawa

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #39 on: November 06, 2014, 11:33:22 AM »
Under "General Assumptions", in the "Fiscal Impact Statement", page 21 of the voters Pamphlet, it states-  "the effective date of the initiative is December 4 2014.

 This is the most rapid implementation of a new law I have ever heard of- normally, they seem to take place at the start of the new year.

 So I suspect the Washington Arms Collectors  show at Monroe this weekend is going to be busy.
 Any of you folks going?

tokugawa

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #40 on: November 06, 2014, 12:23:26 PM »
one more thing- 594 fiscal comments- it is required to pay use tax on private transfer of a firearm-and now they have a paper trail- so if you sell or loan a gun, better figure on paying tax.

 

roo_ster

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #41 on: November 06, 2014, 01:12:15 PM »





Good luck up there.
Regards,

roo_ster

“Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions.”
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tokugawa

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Re: More background checks coming to Washington state
« Reply #42 on: November 06, 2014, 02:46:01 PM »
My hope is we Alinsky the hell out of them- if they are gonna pass this *expletive deleted*it I want every one of them to live up to every word- gun buybacks? I want to see the background checks and tax paid on every one. Liberal Grandma inherits a pistol and does not report it? I want her charged.

 This can be beat in several different ways- the courts, another referendum, or simply by making them live up to every word.

 Also by massive civil disobedience, which is gonna be the default method.

 All this stuff gets passed because the leftists think it will only apply to their political enemies.  They count on selective enforcement .