Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: Ron on July 20, 2016, 10:24:24 PM
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Doesn't endorse Trump and says to vote your conscience.
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2016/07/20/ted-cruz-vote-your-conscience/
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2/3 of his speech was great . . . the other 1/3 . . . disappointing.
I expected better from him.
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2/3 of his speech was great . . . the other 1/3 . . . disappointing.
I expected better from him.
I didn't. IMHO he lived down to my expectations.
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Newt came out and tried his best to save it for Ted. ;)
bob
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Proof that my initial support for him was in fact misplaced.
I guess that pledge to support the eventual nominee, that all of them took, means nothing, much like the oath of office they take.
Cruz, Kasich and Bush are beneath contempt.
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What, exactly, did he pledge to do for the nominee?
So anyway, they wanted Cruz to buckle to the new establishment. And he didn't do it. Boy, what a disgrace.
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What, exactly, did he pledge to do for the nominee?
So anyway, they wanted Cruz to buckle to the new establishment. And he didn't do it. Boy, what a disgrace.
They all promised during an early debate to support the eventual nominee, except Trump, who after creating a bit of a row over it, eventually did sign such a pledge.
I will leave it to others on this forum to assign whatever value they wish to such pledges....... [popcorn]
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So, basically, what happened is he made a pledge in good faith long ago that he would be supporting someone tolerable for office, even if it wasn't him and when the intolerable person made the nomination, he couldn't go through with it?
wow... what a stinky rotten bastard ;/
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They all promised during an early debate to support the eventual nominee... [popcorn]
Yes, I remember that. It seems like a very vague thing to pledge to do. Is there a timeline? Is there a requirement to make an official endorsement?
Are Trump supporters demanding obedience to the GOP leadership, now that Trump is leader of the party? Has Cruz out-Trumped Trump?
Have thought about it for a few more minutes, I think the way to trump Trump would have been for Cruz to have declined to pledge his support in the first place. That was his mistake. He should have voted his conscience back then, and maybe siphoned off some of that Honey Badger vote.
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Remind me not make a hand shake deal with any of you anti-Trump folks.
Ok, fine he was not willing to honor his pledge to actually support the eventual nominee, then just stay home, don't come out and try to undermine him.
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Morals and principles are complex
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Morals and principles are complex
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And Cruz just demonstrated a decided lack of character.
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And Cruz just demonstrated a decided lack of character.
Endorsing trump woulda showed character? As opposed to telling the truth? How so?
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Morals and principles are complex
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Especially when your main goal is to avoid a quote that might later force you to admit you took a position.
Have you ever read teds comments on immigration? If all you read is what he said, it's literally impossible to tell what his position was.
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Which comments
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Which comments
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http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/cover_story/2016/01/ted_cruz_may_be_the_most_gifted_liar_ever_to_run_for_president.html
Second, Cruz got through the entire immigration fight without leaving any solid evidence that he was faking it. That’s remarkable. Last month, FactCheck.org asked Brian Phillips, a Cruz campaign spokesman, whether he could “point to any instances in which Cruz tipped his hand” that the 2013 legalization offer “was not a plan he [Cruz] actually proposed, but was a legislative strategy to make a point.” Phillips said he couldn’t. “We were not trying to let on our legislative strategy,” Phillips explained. But Cruz’s 2013 record is so pristine, so perfectly devoid of nods and winks, that it’s impossible to know what his real game was. And that’s what sets Cruz apart. Lots of politicians lie. Cruz did something more impressive. He talked and talked and still managed to leave himself both options: to deny in the future that his amendments were sincere, or to claim that they were.
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Trump partisans upset that another candidate flip-flopped. Priceless.
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Trump partisans upset that another candidate flip-flopped. Priceless.
Agreeing to speak at an event to appoint the new candidate for president and then slagging him off?
I'm thinking Trump called this one best: "He holds up the bible, and he lies"
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Trump partisans upset that another candidate flip-flopped. Still priceless.
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http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/cover_story/2016/01/ted_cruz_may_be_the_most_gifted_liar_ever_to_run_for_president.html
Your boy has peculiar way of proving his point
But Cruz and his aides insist that he never explicitly embraced legalization. And they’re right.
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Endorsing trump woulda showed character? As opposed to telling the truth? How so?
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If he wasn't willing to stand up, man up and accept the terms of the pledge to support the eventual nominee then he shouldn't have made it.
Sucks out loud that the tactic that the establishment crowd intended to use against Trump came back and bit them in the ass but that's the way it is.
Trump gave Cruz a prime time slot for his backstabbing speech. If Cruz was unwilling/unable to support and endorse the duly nominated RNC candidate then he should have declined the invitation. That I could have respected some.
Ever make a bet or a handshake agreement with someone then the other party backs out of the deal because it backfired on them or welshes on a bet when they lose?
What character or principles are involved there?
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Did folk forget this
http://www.cnn.com/2016/03/29/politics/donald-trump-ted-cruz-nominee-pledge/
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And Cruz just demonstrated a decided lack of character.
To the contrary -- I think he showed us very clearly exactly what his character is. And it isn't pretty. He didn't have to "endorse" Trump. He could have used his speech to just remind everyone that the focus should be on keeping Hillary out of the White House. Not only did he renege on his pledge to support to party's nominee, he used his speech to tell his supporters to vote against the party nominee. He deserved every boo he got.
He should be booted out of the party.
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Trump admitted he saw Cruz's speech two hours prior and let him speak anyway.
Think about that...... [tinfoil]
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Did folk forget this
http://www.cnn.com/2016/03/29/politics/donald-trump-ted-cruz-nominee-pledge/
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Who backed out first?
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Trump admitted he saw Cruz's speech two hours prior and let him speak anyway.
Think about that...... [tinfoil]
He let Cruz take enough rope with which to hang himself.
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Or this
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/03/gops-candidate-loyalty-pledge-is-dead.html
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Who backed out first?
Does it matter? All three did in march
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He let Cruz take enough rope with which to hang himself.
Trump is puppet master....going to be interesting the next 3 months.
Can't wait what he does during the Dems' Convention.
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Does it matter? All three did in march
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Sure it matters, if Cruz and Kasich back out publicly first then Trump would have been insane to stick with it.
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Trump is puppet master....going to be interesting the next 3 months.
Can't wait what he does during the Dems' Convention.
Has Hillary and crew been making much noise about Trump during the RNC convention?
For my take, the classy thing to do would be to let them have their show and then go on the offensive.
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Has Hillary and crew been making much noise about Trump during the RNC convention?
For my take, the classy thing to do would be to let them have their show and then go on the offensive.
Not a lot but there has been a few little squeaks from her camp.
You're right, normally the sides take a "hands" off approach during the other side's convention.
Just think that Trump won't.
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This election is hilarious. We have Hillary supporters up in arms about Melania Trump's speech and calling for honesty and integrity and Trump supporters calling for candidates to "honor their word!" when a contract with Trump is treated as a negotiating position. (If you're building something for him...)
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Sure it matters, if Cruz and Kasich back out publicly first then Trump would have been insane to stick with it.
It seems, and I stress seems, that trump bailed first and definitively.
At least as I gather in the new Yorkagain piece.
Does that make him a bad guy or is there another trump loophole
Does it matter? All three did in march
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This election is hilarious. We have Hillary supporters up in arms about Melania Trump's speech and calling for honesty and integrity and Trump supporters calling for candidates to "honor their word!" when a contract with Trump is treated as a negotiating position. (If you're building something for him...)
It's not the contract that's the problem. It's the going to the event and pulling that move.
Part of me thinks trump may have wanted to remind people that the establishment hates him.
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And to those listening, please, don’t stay home in November. Stand, and speak, and vote your conscience, vote for candidates up and down the ticket who you trust to defend our freedom and to be faithful to the Constitution.
Ah, this is the line that's the problem.
He said "Vote your conscience" when he should have said "Forget all the rightful misgivings you have about Donald Trump and suck it up and vote for him! Because he's TOTALLY trustworthy!"
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Ah, this is the line that's the problem.
He said "Vote your conscience" when he should have said "Forget all the rightful misgivings you have about Donald Trump and suck it up and vote for him! Because he's TOTALLY trustworthy!"
Yeah because trump has been so guarded the party voters had NO IDEA what they were voting for!
Definition of hilarious: career politician who played every trick possible to subvert the will of voters imploring for conscience voting!
News flash: they DID vote their conscience, which is why Ted isn't the nominee.
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0. I expected Ted to do what Ted thought best for Ted in the speech...and I was inclined to think that Ted would parley an endorsement for either a SCOTUS nom or an appointment to Attorney General. The former is a terminal position, the latter left open further political climbing. Ted would have made a good AG, especially if set after the Dem moles in gov't.
1. I don't think we'll have to worry about Ted Cruz (R-Uncanny Valley) getting a spot on SCOTUS or an appointment in the Trump Administration.
2. I also think that Cruz thought this a smart move, setting himself up for 2020 vs Trump or Hillary.
3. Thing is, Ted is like Hillary in that the more folk see and hear him, they less they like him (see Uncanny Valley). Ted does not have the MSM to drag his carcass over the finish line while shielding him from scrutiny as they do for Hillary. Thus I doubt Ted will ever be POTUS and he has screwed himself good and hard with his no-endorsement speech.
4. I see about zero long term damage to Trump from Ted's shenanigans. Trump beat Ted like a drum among Christian Conservatives in the primaries and he'll do even better vs Hillary. Trump has not yet begin to play the fear card vs Hillary, as she has done to Trump.
5. DS is correct in that Ted left open every possible construction of his words and action on immigration. He is very (Bill) Clintonian that way. Heck, he is even better than Bill at that game and smarter, too. Sadly, Ted is lacking something human inside and has not learned to convincingly feign the whole panoply of human emotion and expression.
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It's telling that everyone konws "vote your conscience" means don't vote for Donald Trump. ;)
The local, Trump uber alles radio guy even called it a "dog whistle." :lol:
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Morals and principles are complex
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Seems that way.
Lots of finger-crossing involved with handshakes, I guess. Pinky pledges are still reliable, though... right?
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It's telling that everyone konws "vote your conscience" means don't vote for Donald Trump. ;)
The local, Trump uber alles radio guy even called it a "dog whistle." :lol:
Yep. Everyone knows Trump is a loathsome person. The only reason to vote for Trump is that Hillary is even worse.
Of course, if primary voters were worried about Hillary getting elected, they won't have voted for the most unpopular candidate in the race among the general election voters.
It galls me that we are going to get an evil hag for president when we could have had an actual conservative. The second amendment is going to DIE in the courts once she picks a bunch of judges.
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0. I expected Ted to do what Ted thought best for Ted in the speech...and I was inclined to think that Ted would parley an endorsement for either a SCOTUS nom or an appointment to Attorney General. The former is a terminal position, the latter left open further political climbing. Ted would have made a good AG, especially if set after the Dem moles in gov't.
1. I don't think we'll have to worry about Ted Cruz (R-Uncanny Valley) getting a spot on SCOTUS or an appointment in the Trump Administration.
2. I also think that Cruz thought this a smart move, setting himself up for 2020 vs Trump or Hillary.
3. Thing is, Ted is like Hillary in that the more folk see and hear him, they less they like him (see Uncanny Valley). Ted does not have the MSM to drag his carcass over the finish line while shielding him from scrutiny as they do for Hillary. Thus I doubt Ted will ever be POTUS and he has screwed himself good and hard with his no-endorsement speech.
4. I see about zero long term damage to Trump from Ted's shenanigans. Trump beat Ted like a drum among Christian Conservatives in the primaries and he'll do even better vs Hillary. Trump has not yet begin to play the fear card vs Hillary, as she has done to Trump.
5. DS is correct in that Ted left open every possible construction of his words and action on immigration. He is very (Bill) Clintonian that way. Heck, he is even better than Bill at that game and smarter, too. Sadly, Ted is lacking something human inside and has not learned to convincingly feign the whole panoply of human emotion and expression.
Everything Ted Cruz does is Machiavellian calculation... while everything Trump does is...any different?
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Yep. Everyone knows Trump is a loathsome person. The only reason to vote for Trump is that Hillary is even worse.
Of course, if primary voters were worried about Hillary getting elected, they won't have voted for the most unpopular candidate in the race among the general election voters.
It galls me that we are going to get an evil hag for president when we could have had an actual conservative :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:. The second amendment is going to DIE in the courts once she picks a bunch of judges.
You have to be kidding me. I wouldn't call Trump conservative....he is a capitalist.
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It's telling that everyone konws "vote your conscience" means don't vote for Donald Trump. ;)
The local, Trump uber alles radio guy even called it a "dog whistle." :lol:
I know, that's particularly hilarious to me. Because OF COURSE people's consciences have a problem with voting for Trump.
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The local, Trump uber alles radio guy even called it a "dog whistle." :lol:
Hey, he just called me a dog! ;) ("if you can hear the whistle, you're the dog")
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To be fair, "vote your conscience" pretty much always means voting third-party or write-in. It's still funny that it has people so riled.
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Yeah because trump has been so guarded the party voters had NO IDEA what they were voting for!
Definition of hilarious: career politician who played every trick possible to subvert the will of voters imploring for conscience voting!
News flash: they DID vote their conscience, which is why Ted isn't the nominee.
The GOP needs to own Trump, because he is their creature, the end result of the way they've done business for ages.
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Honest question, do any of you think that the slanderous statements from Trump about Rafael Cruz and Heidi Cruz excuse Ted's lack of an explicit endorsement? Because if someone had said that ish about my family I wouldn't have endorsed him for a million bucks.
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Honest question, do any of you think that the slanderous statements from Trump about Rafael Cruz and Heidi Cruz excuse Ted's lack of an explicit endorsement? Because if someone had said that ish about my family I wouldn't have endorsed him for a million bucks.
Perhaps, but in that case you say so up front. And you don't accept a prime time speaking slot.
At least he attended the convention, unlike Bushs, Romney, etc.
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Honest question, do any of you think that the slanderous statements from Trump about Rafael Cruz and Heidi Cruz excuse Ted's lack of an explicit endorsement? Because if someone had said that ish about my family I wouldn't have endorsed him for a million bucks.
I think it may have played a large part of it ---- though Cruz is long known for his inability to "play well" even with other members of his own kindergarten. Trump's quips about Cruz's wife were rude and loutish, and his idiot inference that his father had something to do with the Kennedy assassination since he allegedly had a photo with Oswald, I mean, that was the mark of a true jackwagon. Oswald had photos made with Marina, his wife .... are we to suppose she was there in the book deposiory handing off ammo to Lee as he fired the rounds into the President??
In fact we know Marina was no where near the assassination site.
The whole thing was excercise in jackassery in its dumbest mode.
And we, the voters, are stuck with the results. :'(
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Perhaps, but in that case you say so up front. And you don't accept a prime time speaking slot.
At least he attended the convention, unlike Bushs, Romney, etc.
He won 8+ states. He didn't have to "accept" a speaking slot, he earned it.
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Perhaps, but in that case you say so up front. And you don't accept a prime time speaking slot.
At least he attended the convention, unlike Bushs, Romney, etc.
Since the donald knew what the speech was gonna be do you think he was using it to play the faithful? Again
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He won 8+ states. He didn't have to "accept" a speaking slot, he earned it.
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fuploads.tapatalk-cdn.com%2F20160721%2F400d518febfb5944c9dfd9237bcd2d98.jpg&hash=e4bb8fbf74563d2122ed524c2c429378d290f6fd)
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The whole lot of them should be booed.
And tarred and feathered.
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Trump brags about his serial adultery, his fans applaud what a player he is. Ted Cruz honors a pledge he made, but not as vigorously as Trump's fans want and they call Cruz a traitor.
Trump calls Cruz's wife ugly and implies he has dirt on her, his surrogates spread false rumors that Cruz has had numerous affairs, he implies Cruz's father helped assassinate JFK, and he constantly called Cruz a liar.
It's shocking, shocking I say, that Cruz refused to wholeheartedly endorse Trump.
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I think the next 4 months are going to be a hoot. [popcorn]
We get the government that we deserve becomes more evident every day. Don't worry, Trump won't be elected even if he gets the most popular and electoral votes. Why? Because we won't know he got the most popular and electoral votes because key voting areas in America are rigged to pick Hillary no matter how anyone their votes.
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Trump brags about his serial adultery, his fans applaud what a player he is. Ted Cruz honors a pledge he made, but not as vigorously as Trump's fans want and they call Cruz a traitor.
Trump calls Cruz's wife ugly and implies he has dirt on her, his surrogates spread false rumors that Cruz has had numerous affairs, he implies Cruz's father helped assassinate JFK, and he constantly called Cruz a liar.
It's shocking, shocking I say, that Cruz refused to wholeheartedly endorse Trump.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3701464/I-not-habit-supporting-people-attack-wife-attack-father-Cruz-doubles-refuses-endorse-Trump-angry-Texas-delegates-cowboy-hats-demand-GOP-s-nominee.html#ixzz4F44qmggh
'I am not in the habit of supporting people who attack my wife and attack my father,' Cruz said
He put family first.
Good. My estimation of the man just went up. (Family comes before country in the order of correct priorities.)
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I think the next 4 months are going to be a hoot. [popcorn]
We get the government that we deserve becomes more evident every day. Don't worry, Trump won't be elected even if he gets the most popular and electoral votes. Why? Because we won't know he got the most popular and electoral votes because key voting areas in America are rigged to pick Hillary no matter how anyone their votes.
Supporter of candidate who espouses conspiracy theories is preparing for his candidates crushing defeat by readying conspiracy theory in advance.
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Did folk forget this
http://www.cnn.com/2016/03/29/politics/donald-trump-ted-cruz-nominee-pledge/
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I don't keep up with debates, so I was unaware of that. It also looks as if the general public still believed Cruz was pledged to support Trump, at least up until last night.
Earlier, Cruz had told Cooper when asked the same question: "I'm not in the habit of supporting someone who attacks my wife and my family ... I think nominating Donald Trump would be an absolute trainwreck, I think it would hand the general election to Hillary Clinton."
That was almost four months ago, so this can't have been a surprise to the folks in charge.
I googled some of the more notable smears that Trump ran against Cruz, and they all seem to post-date Cruz's early March pledge to support the nominee.
That link also has text that's supposed to be from The Pledge. According to that, they did pledge to endorse the winning candidate, though it doesn't say when.
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Everything Ted Cruz does is Machiavellian calculation... while everything Trump does is...any different?
Sure. One difference...
Trump plays to win and then wins. Cruz plays to win and then loses.
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Achilles, sulking in his tent. My advice: Ted, watch your heel.
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It's telling that everyone konws "vote your conscience" means don't vote for Donald Trump. ;)
The local, Trump uber alles radio guy even called it a "dog whistle." :lol:
I hear "vote your conscience" as a fig leaf for may gopers who dont want to vote for trump but want others to vote for them when they get the nom next time around. Oh no they are not faithless gopers they just voted their conscience.
As for third party purist zero probability of winning voting, that is properly known as "peter pan voting."
Ftr my conscience tells me to vote for trump as jesus christ is not on the ballot.
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People thought Trump was exaggerating when he said he could murder someone on camera and his fanboys would still vote for him.
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You have to be kidding me. I wouldn't call Trump conservative....he is a capitalist.
You misunderstood me. We should have nominated a conservative instead of the orange baboon. But since the Primary voters picked Trump, we get Hillary instead.
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You misunderstood me. We should have nominated a conservative instead of the orange baboon. But since the Primary voters picked Trump, we get Hillary instead.
I don't think we will have the evil hag...the orange baboon I believe will be the next [barf] President.
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I'd say it really depends on what happens with terrorists between now and Nov. If a Nice happens and a bunch of folks are killed by an Islamic immigrant then Cheeto Jesus will probably win.
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I hear "vote your conscience" as a fig leaf for may gopers who dont want to vote for trump but want others to vote for them when they get the nom next time around. Oh no they are not faithless gopers they just voted their conscience.
As for third party purist zero probability of winning voting, that is properly known as "peter pan voting."
Ftr my conscience tells me to vote for trump as jesus christ is not on the ballot.
Well, the winky face is there for a reason. And don't get me started on the third-party angst.
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I'd say it really depends on what happens with terrorists between now and Nov. If a Nice happens and a bunch of folks are killed by an Islamic immigrant then Cheeto Jesus will probably win.
I have it on the highest authority that, despite his messiah complex, Glen Beck is not Jesus.
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.breitbart.com%2Fmedia%2F2016%2F04%2FGlenn-Beck-Cheetos-YouTube.jpg&hash=068225c5b0e734e7540971a2ece2613baf40670c)
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What is this Glenn Beck cheeto thing, now?
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I'd say it really depends on what happens with terrorists between now and Nov. If a Nice happens and a bunch of folks are killed by an Islamic immigrant then Cheeto Jesus will probably win.
That might be a TOS/COC violation for here in TPP... but damn if that didn't make me bust out loud laughing. :rofl:
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What is this Glenn Beck cheeto thing, now?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBwR6o10P5I
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That might be a TOS/COC violation for here in TPP... but damn if that didn't make me bust out loud laughing. :rofl:
I'd hate to violate anyone's coc.
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http://savingtherepublic.com/blog/2016/07/sorry-america-heres-video-trump-saying-not-honor-pledge/
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I don't keep up with debates, so I was unaware of that. It also looks as if the general public still believed Cruz was pledged to support Trump, at least up until last night.
Apparently even Cruz's onw (former) supporters believed that:
http://www.breitbart.com/2016-presidential-race/2016/07/21/richard-viguerie-ted-cruz-committed-political-suicide-national-tv/
And most importantly for those of us who endorsed Ted Cruz and worked for him in the Republican primaries, he betrayed the trust we gave him that he was a bigger man than his attackers and that there was a cause greater than self in the hard-fought battles of the Republican primaries.
...
I thought Ted Cruz was a patriot. Tonight, he proved he isn’t. However bitter and angry he is at Donald Trump, he knows that Trump is the only person standing between Hillary Clinton (a liar, a fraud, a thief and a traitor) and the presidency. And yet – after meticulously laying out the case against another 4 to 8 years of leftist tyranny — he refused to endorse the one man who can put an end to our long national nightmare.
...
After failing to endorse the Trump – Pence ticket last night, in eyes of most conservatives with whom I spoke, Ted Cruz became just another self-centered politician who walked back on a promise, failed to live up to his own Biblical standards and, when the battle raged the fiercest, put his own petty hurts before the future of his country and the conservative cause.[/quote[
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Breitbart is %100 in the tank for Trump, their opinion means less than nothing.
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As for third party purist zero probability of winning voting, that is properly known as "peter pan voting."
Speaking (okay, "writing") as someone who has voted third party in more than two previous presidential elections, I would offer a correction: This year, a third party zero probability of winning vote is more properly known as "Hillary voting."
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Speaking (okay, "writing") as someone who has voted third party in more than two previous presidential elections, I would offer a correction: This year, a third party zero probability of winning vote is more properly known as "Hillary voting."
https://twitter.com/iowahawkblog/status/727849437339353088
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http://www.rawstory.com/2016/07/trump-pivots-to-the-general-election-by-questioning-whether-cruzs-dad-killed-jfk-again/
Whew, that Cruz, holding a grudge, he needs to just get over it!
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Vote your conscience. If your conscience tells you Trump, then vote for him. If it tells you otherwise, then vote for that person. I fail to understand why this a kerfluffle.
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Vote your conscience. If your conscience tells you Trump, then vote for him. If it tells you otherwise, then vote for that person. I fail to understand why this a kerfluffle.
Because he didn't scream vote Trump/Pence.
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Vote your conscience. If your conscience tells you Trump, then vote for him. If it tells you otherwise, then vote for that person. I fail to understand why this a kerfluffle.
"vote your conscience" has been the mantra of the #nevertrump crowd.
For all practical purposes he might as well as said "I'm with Bush, Romney and Kasich!"
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So we are unhappy with most democrats, because no matter what they have said or done, they will rally around and defend their candidate. Yet when there are actually members of the republicans that say "I cannot, in good conscience, vote for this candidate", everyone screams bloody murder?
Got it.
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Vote your conscience. If your conscience tells you Trump, then vote for him. If it tells you otherwise, then vote for that person. I fail to understand why this a kerfluffle.
Because, no matter what anybody else disagrees on, we're all pretty unanimous on NOT wanting Hillary. And that kind of creates one helluva game-theory "Prisoner's Dilemma" situation for the electorate. =|
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He said "Vote your conscience" when he should have said "Forget all the rightful misgivings you have about Donald Trump and suck it up and vote for him! Because he's TOTALLY trustworthy not Hillary!"
FTFY.
That's all it would have taken. But, NOOOOOOOOooooooo
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So we are unhappy with most democrats, because no matter what they have said or done, they will rally around and defend their candidate. Yet when there are actually members of the republicans that say "I cannot, in good conscience, vote for this candidate", everyone screams bloody murder?
Got it.
We also have people getting in a lather about third party and write-in votes being, "a vote for Hillary". The electorate is pretty divided, and the establishment on the other side is getting in a lather about third party and write-in votes being, "a vote for Trump".
So in the end, those on either side worried about people voting their conscience should consider it a wash. The bonus (for me) would be to see the combined third party and write-in percentage be higher than the percentage for either Clinton or Trump.
One of them is going to get it, but if everyone actually voted their conscience, especially this time around with the low approval for both candidates, the high number of votes for all the people not them would absolutely send a strong message.
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One of them is going to get it, but if everyone actually voted their conscience, especially this time around with the low approval for both candidates, the high number of votes for all the people not them would absolutely send a strong message.
Which won't be received anyhow.
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I already know my vote doesn't count. I'm in Illinois. And the last time Illinois went R was in 1988 for Bush I.
However, I would love to see the election thrown into the House and all the media outlets screaming "Constitutional Crisis !!!!" When the constitution clearly delineates the process.
It would be great theater...
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I already know my vote doesn't count. I'm in Illinois. And the last time Illinois went R was in 1988 for Bush I.
However, I would love to see the election thrown into the House and all the media outlets screaming "Constitutional Crisis !!!!" When the constitution clearly delineates the process.
It would be great theater...
Majority GOP Congress = Bush III: Revenge of the Stiff
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Speaking (okay, "writing") as someone who has voted third party in more than two previous presidential elections, I would offer a correction: This year, a third party zero probability of winning vote is more properly known as "Hillary voting."
No. If this is the best we can get to lead our country, then we deserve to burn. I am not voting for the lesser of two evils. That's what got us here in the first place.
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It's starting to get real interesting. lol
And... if you think the cruz speech wasn't orchestrated with the approval and design of the trump campaign, you're delusional
It's all smoke and mirrors.
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It's starting to get real interesting. lol
And... if you think the cruz speech wasn't orchestrated with the approval and design of the trump campaign, you're delusional
It's all smoke and mirrors.
Orchestrated? Might be a bit of a stretch. Seems much more likely with the level of hate for trump that the RNC let Cruz do the "I'll pull out or speak on this" trick
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It's starting to get real interesting. lol
And... if you think the cruz speech wasn't orchestrated with the approval and design of the trump campaign, you're delusional
It's all smoke and mirrors.
Orchestration would mean that Trump people participated in writing the speech. Not likely. I'll go along with the "giving him enough rope to hang himself" bit (and he seems to have done so very effectively), but I don't think it was "orchestrated" by the Trump camp.
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Orchestration would mean that Trump people participated in writing the speech. Not likely. I'll go along with the "giving him enough rope to hang himself" bit (and he seems to have done so very effectively), but I don't think it was "orchestrated" by the Trump camp.
I don't think Cruz hung himself or anything of the kind. Trump supporters didn't like him before and they don't like him now (Surprise!!). He didn't attack Trump and Trump was big enough to not try to stop him from saying what he said. IMO, both came out ahead. Also, Cruz at least had the decency to show up at the convention unlike all the other establishment types.
If anyone is hanging themselves, it is Trump supporters making such a big deal about this. As before, be good winners and act like your guy won the nomination. Focus on the actual opponent in the next election rather than continuing to fight the last one.
For me, my other Texas Senator is John Cornyn and I will take Cruz any day of the week over that guy.
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http://www.rawstory.com/2016/07/trump-pivots-to-the-general-election-by-questioning-whether-cruzs-dad-killed-jfk-again/
Whew, that Cruz, holding a grudge, he needs to just get over it!
Trump really is a piece of excrement.
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Trump really is a piece of excrement.
It could be worse ...... he could be on the Democrat ticket. :angel: [popcorn] :rofl:
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And still use same material
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk
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I don't think Cruz hung himself or anything of the kind. Trump supporters didn't like him before and they don't like him now (Surprise!!). He didn't attack Trump and Trump was big enough to not try to stop him from saying what he said. IMO, both came out ahead. Also, Cruz at least had the decency to show up at the convention unlike all the other establishment types.
If anyone is hanging themselves, it is Trump supporters making such a big deal about this. As before, be good winners and act like your guy won the nomination. Focus on the actual opponent in the next election rather than continuing to fight the last one.
For me, my other Texas Senator is John Cornyn and I will take Cruz any day of the week over that guy.
"Trump supporters didn't like him before"
The part you wrote that I put in bold font is untrue. Poll after poll indicated that Trump supporters' favorite alternative to Trump (IOW, their #2 pick) was Cruz. Cruz's self-defenestration onstage was just his latest forced error WRT Trump supporters who (had & may have still) viewed him positively. Cruz has needlessly alienated folks who were willing to pivot to him in the primaries and were highly likely to in the future.
It turns out that the Trump campaign did its best to throw gasoline on Cruz's self-immolation:
Halfway through the week, the media had already decided this would go in the books as the Plagiarism and Scott Baio convention. The turn came when Trump and his campaign supremo Paul Manafort, who had been dickering behind the scenes with Ted Cruz about the Texas senator’s much-awaited Wednesday night speech, managed to turn Ted’s dislike to its advantage. What looked like it was going to be a stinging rebuke became a glistening glob of golden honey on Trump’s toast.
Manafort couldn’t convince Cruz to give an endorsement, but he knew exactly what Cruz was going to say. We all did. The entire transcript was sent out to the media before Cruz started speaking. There would be only one mention of Trump and it would be as frosty as the maniacal air conditioning that chilled the Q. “I want to congratulate Donald Trump on winning the nomination last night” was as far as Cruz would go. So Manafort and Co. decided, before the speech even started, that it would end with heckling. (Time magazine and other sources reported as much, citing anonymous sources. Manafort evidently tipped off Bloomberg reporter Mark Halperin, who Tweeted before the speech, “@PaulManafort owns the floor. Will be key at several moments tonight. Watch what @tedcruz says & the reaction.”
As Cruz approached the end, Cruz’s campaign manager Jeff Roe said on a Philadelphia radio show, the “active whip operation got active.” The New York delegates were whipped up by Team Trump to interrupt Cruz with shouts of “We want Trump,” finally booing him off the stage. Cruz, in portraying himself as the man of principle, looked like a louse on a skunk.
It was a genius move by Manafort that pulled off three astonishing tricks: for the media, which thinks of itself as a relentless detective agency discovering for the people’s benefit the “unscripted moments” that reveal everything, it gave them a perfectly crafted scene they over-hyped because they didn’t know it was staged. For the public, it gave them a new and irresistible reason to watch, in huge numbers, Trump’s speech the following night. And for Trump, it made him, for once, the innocent wronged victim instead of the bully — in the parlance of the professional wrestling shows that Trump used to participate in, the “heel” had become the “face.” That certified smartypants Cruz — Princeton ‘92, Harvard Law ‘95 — essentially blew himself up on live TV was for Manafort and Trump merely an amusing side benefit.
Cruz has provided the archetype for the smarty-pants who got himself pantsed by a less smart but more wise/wiley opponent.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cn5CcAwWIAEbq-f.jpg)
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"Trump supporters didn't like him before"
The part you wrote that I put in bold font is untrue. Poll after poll indicated that Trump supporters' favorite alternative to Trump (IOW, their #2 pick) was Cruz. Cruz's self-defenestration onstage was just his latest forced error WRT Trump supporters who (had & may have still) viewed him positively. Cruz has needlessly alienated folks who were willing to pivot to him in the primaries and were highly likely to in the future.
It turns out that the Trump campaign did its best to throw gasoline on Cruz's self-immolation:
Cruz has provided the archetype for the smarty-pants who got himself pantsed by a less smart but more wise/wiley opponent.
I heard that also, but a lot of the commentary I saw once the race was Cruz vs Trump did not reflect that. Maybe that was just a few people on the internet.
At this point, Cruz supporters can either stay home or vote Trump. I am hoping most go ahead and do the latter. The worst case risks of a Trump Presidency are still better than Hilary.