What if they had a gov shutdown, and no one cared?

[dogmush]

So, as of this morning, I'm on furlough. This has happened enough to me that it no longer really concerns me.

One thing I noticed is that the news coverage seems much less apocalyptic this time. Last shut down there was like two weeks of breathless reporting about how Republicans were killing orphans and puppies.  This time the media doesn't even seem to know who to blame (in addition to Trump, of course).

It seems like no one is scared by the Senate's scare tactics, which makes me wonder if the Senate will drag this out until something bad actually happens to make "Shutdown!" not an empty threat.

[Jamisjockey]

So, as of this morning, I'm on furlough. This has happened enough to me that it no longer really concerns me.

One thing I noticed is that the news coverage seems much less apocalyptic this time. Last shut down there was like two weeks of breathless reporting about how Republicans were killing orphans and puppies.  This time the media doesn't even seem to know who to blame (in addition to Trump, of course).

It seems like no one is scared by the Senate's scare tactics, which makes me wonder if the Senate will drag this out until something bad actually happens to make "Shutdown!" not an empty threat.

I fall in the "essential" category.  My coworkers are apoplectic about "working for free".  Bullshit.  We will receive back pay.

[charby]

So is this little checkers stunt going to delay tax returns until summer?

[dogmush]

I fall in the "essential" category.  My coworkers are apoplectic about "working for free".  Bullshit.  We will receive back pay.

Hell, historically I get back pay, despite sitting at home playing with my hobbies for the furlough.

[Ben]

These are always pretty ridiculous, because it generally comes down to just giving extra leave days to .gov employees.

During the Clinton shutdown, I was just a contractor, so I just did other stuff. During the Obama shutdown, the day after it was announced, I was in Mammoth fishing and treating myself to the most expensive steak on the steakhouse menu to congratulate myself on my good luck.  

I did a whole rant here during that shutdown because so many gov workers were whining about it. Most everyone I worked with was in the double digit GS levels and on around a 23% locality pay. A couple of them were crying about how they'd lose their homes. That shutdown (from memory) started around the beginning of a pay period, and they pretty quickly announced that we would indeed be paid. At that time, we only had one uniformed person, an O-3, in the office, and I actually felt sorry for her because she was the one stuck showing up for work while the rest of us got a "vacation".

At the end, IIRC, we got our "shutdown pay period" pay minus three days of pay, which was quickly made up for. Additionally, they did a deal where anyone that needed money could borrow from their TSP without penalty. Anyone that "was going to die" because of three days, could have borrowed from their TSP and paid it back when we were back on schedule.

It will be interesting to see how this one goes. It could easily be over by Monday. The last one, as mentioned above, was pretty "doom and gloom" mostly because of Obama creating that illusion with the "make it hurt" philosophy. Trump looks to be going in the opposite direction in that regard. While complaining about a shutdown being bad, he also seems to be pushing for making it nearly unnoticeable for people's day to day lives, While I probably could not drive into Yosemite or Sequoia National Parks today because of their few bottlenecked entry points, I bet I could drive into Death Valley NPS today and see most all the outdoor sights. Obama chained up picnic areas that would normally not have even seen a Federal worker show up more than once a month. Just to "make it hurt".

Anyways, congrats Dogmush on the bonus leave.  

[Jamisjockey]

Yep the last one, I was a contractor for the ANG.  They shut the tower down, which quickly the ANG didn't like because we were the NORAD alert field for the gulf, so they promised to *expletive deleted*it money and pay us.  However, this all happened on my days off....so I never even missed a minute of work. No free time off either 

These shutdowns are just a symptom of how we haven't had a balanced budget nor a "funded" government in over a decade.  They've figured out that if they just live CR to CR, they can spend more with less oversight to the people.
We truly live in a kleptocracy.

[BobR]

I fall in the "essential" category.  My coworkers are apoplectic about "working for free".  Bullshit.  We will receive back pay.

That's me, I still work and I know that eventually I will get all of my pay just like this never happened. Even the people who get to sit home have historically been "made whole" in the past so they will get their money also.

bob

[Ben]

These shutdowns are just a symptom of how we haven't had a balanced budget nor a "funded" government in over a decade.  They've figured out that if they just live CR to CR, they can spend more with less oversight to the people.
We truly live in a kleptocracy.

Yup. While I understand the need for an annual budget, I sometimes complained about how inefficient it was, especially for multi-year programs that included expensive hardware like satellites. Some things you want to re-evaluate every year, but other things should have the leeway (and some do) for longer budget cycles, just for efficiency and best value to the taxpayer. But way too many things are just considered together, even if in the end, it costs way more money to go through annual budget hoops.

CRs are just the bizarro version of that, because you'll spend sometimes up to 3/4 of the year on various CRs, having to spend 10 hours filing paperwork for permission to buy a box of paperclips, then come July, "OMG! We have to spend all this money that just freed up so they won't cut our budget next year! New laptops and Aeron chairs for everybody, RTF!"

[HankB]

This time, I actually saw one of the talking heads on TV ask the question . . . "WHY does government have NON ESSENTIAL workers in the first place?"

Good question. Last time the Feds shut down, I never actually heard of any non-government employees having a problem with the shutdown OTHER than a few folks who saw their vacations ruined when things like the doors to the Smithsonian were locked. And of course, Obama found it "essential" to have park rangers try to stop people from driving past and photographing some national monuments and he still found the people to put barricades around normally unmanned places in Washington to dramatize the effects of a shutdown.

On a smaller level, I remember when the public employees union went on strike up in Minnesota a couple of decades ago when I was still there, "shutting down" the state. Funny thing - roads kept getting fixed, police & fire kept working, power and water stayed on, garbage was collected . . . in fact, the ONLY group then inconvenienced were students at U of Mn, who had longer lines to stand in during registration. And THAT was because the administrators were TOO STUPID to hire students to help with registration, the way my old college did.

The strike in MN ended when more and more people kept writing to the papers and calling in to local radio talk shows questioning the need for so many state employees.

Back to the current Fed shutdown . . . the GOP can end this shutdown - fast - by emphasizing that it happened because DEMOCRATS ARE HOLDING AMERICAN CITIZENS HOSTAGE ON BEHALF OF ILLEGAL ALIENS.

But of course, the GOP really is The Stupid Party^TM . . . so don't hold your breath.

[Ben]

The Dem spin is interesting. They are blaming the "Republican majority", which I guess will work for your average sheep. If you can do math however, well, work it down from 60. Even the NYT understood that (and is taking flak from the left for it).

[grampster]

Democrats depend on the ignorance of their supporters.  It is not a misplaced viewpoint.  The stupidity of the D electorate is on full display on Fecesbook.

[K Frame]

I'm a contractor.

But, I don't worry about this shut down because our contract structure is firm fixed price, which means that we've already gotten our allocation. So, even if the feds don't work Monday, I do.

That all changes February 9, however, when we go to a time and material contract structure.

When that happens, if the government shuts down, I burn PTO. Those who don't have time saved up are *expletive deleted*ed.

[Firethorn]

At the end, IIRC, we got our "shutdown pay period" pay minus three days of pay, which was quickly made up for. Additionally, they did a deal where anyone that needed money could borrow from their TSP without penalty. Anyone that "was going to die" because of three days, could have borrowed from their TSP and paid it back when we were back on schedule.

Such extreme grasshoppers who are going to 'die' from 3 days without pay' are unlikely to have anything in their TSP, aren't they?

While I probably could not drive into Yosemite or Sequoia National Parks today because of their few bottlenecked entry points, I bet I could drive into Death Valley NPS today and see most all the outdoor sights. Obama chained up picnic areas that would normally not have even seen a Federal worker show up more than once a month. Just to "make it hurt".

I doubt Obama directed that personally.  It was probably a combination of employees doing things to get themselves marked essential and that the normally unseen trash collectors and such wouldn't be there.

That said, depending on how you define "essential" the government probably has quite a few.

I mean, there's jobs where if you don't work that day there's a reasonable chance(can still be really low) somebody could die or be seriously injured - that's essential.  Covers police, fire, and such.

Then there are jobs where you won't hurt now if it isn't done, but might hurt next month or next year - a day off isn't going to kill anybody.  They're non-essential.

Etc...

[Ben]

Such extreme grasshoppers who are going to 'die' from 3 days without pay' are unlikely to have anything in their TSP, aren't they?

FERS (and maybe mil now?) employees get 1% put into their TSP whether they contribute or not, so unless they've been on the job less than a year, they've definitely got 3 days wages sitting in the account.

If you are a FERS or BRS employee, your agency or service will contribute an amount equal to 1% of your basic pay each pay date to your TSP account. These are called Agency/Service Automatic (1%) Contributions. You do not need to be making employee contributions to receive them.

Agency/Service Automatic (1%) Contributions are not taken out of your pay and they do not decrease the dollar amount of your pay for income tax purposes.

[BobR]

In 10 days, Trump is due to deliver his first State of the Union address. Democrats were convinced Saturday that it the optics of the president trying to speak about his accomplishments in the midst of a government shutdown would be devastating for the GOP —

Picked out of WP article.

It is becoming less muddy to me now.

bob

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/a-lot-of-blame-little-talk-of-compromise-as-congress-deals-with-shutdown/ar-AAuTlMT?li=BBnb7Kz

[Ben]

Yosemite, along with, apparently, a good deal of other national parks, remains open. The private concessionaires are also staying open. Quite a change from "make it hurt".

https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/01/20/heres-what-parks-services-are-open-closed-during-government-shutdown/

[dogmush]

Picked out of WP article.

It is becoming less muddy to me now.

bob

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/a-lot-of-blame-little-talk-of-compromise-as-congress-deals-with-shutdown/ar-AAuTlMT?li=BBnb7Kz

I can see the democrats somehow still thinking Trump gives a damn about the optics. I can also see Trump spending two weeks crowing about illegals.

That said, while I'm planning my furlough party, at some point no paycheck will start to tic me off.

One can hope that 10 or so days without a government will make normal folks rethink how much they government they actually need.

[Ben]

That said, while I'm planning my furlough party, at some point no paycheck will start to tic me off.

Where are you guys in the pay period right now?

[Firethorn]

Where are you guys in the pay period right now?

Should be about 10 days until the next paycheck would be expected.

[dogmush]

Where are you guys in the pay period right now?

Pay period ends this Sunday. Pay hit DFAS this Thursday. Next check is due on 1 Feb. That's a good portion of my "not real worried" attitude.

Last time we got a short paycheck for the furlough and back pay showed up about a month later.

[Ben]

Last time we got a short paycheck for the furlough and back pay showed up about a month later.

How the heck does that happen? I remember the shorted paycheck, but I also remember getting those missed days back in the next pay period, if not in a special run for the missed days. I though NFC handled everyone the same, but I guess not. I know there are different sections for handing out pay. I recall us and the coasties were paid by an NFC division run by dept of ag.

[dogmush]

How the heck does that happen? I remember the shorted paycheck, but I also remember getting those missed days back in the next pay period, if not in a special run for the missed days. I though NFC handled everyone the same, but I guess not. I know there are different sections for handing out pay. I recall us and the coasties were paid by an NFC division run by dept of ag.

DFAS*. Second only to the VA in customer service.

*ETA: Defense Finance and Accounting Service

[dm1333]

Just don't get killed during the shutdown and you should be fine.   And if you were only wounded or injured hopefully your physical and occupational therapists weren't declared non essential.  Of course Congress will still be getting paid while this goes on. 

[Scout26]

I can see the democrats somehow still thinking Trump gives a damn about the optics. I can also see Trump spending two weeks crowing about illegals.

That said, while I'm planning my furlough party, at some point no paycheck will start to tic me off.

One can hope that 10 or so days without a government will make normal folks rethink how much they government they actually need.

It looks like the Stupid party is learning (maybe Trump is teaching them something...)  They are already ahead of the curve with #SchumerShutdown, reminding everyone that it takes 60 votes in the Senate, that the D's have put illegals ahead of the troops, and it's a clean CR expect they did put funding for CHIP, so the D's are also holding kids hostage....

Plus Trump is doing everything to make this as painless and invisible as possible to average Americans, to show how unneeded most .gov is.

[Angel Eyes]

Yosemite, along with, apparently, a good deal of other national parks, remains open.

Yosemite is not only open:  it's free.

Just don't get killed during the shutdown and you should be fine.   And if you were only wounded or injured hopefully your physical and occupational therapists weren't declared non essential.