Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: gunsmith on June 24, 2010, 04:02:31 PM
-
http://www.thomasmore.org/default-sb_thomasmore.html?969915640
Thomas More Law Center
TMLC Represents Four Christian Missionaries Arrested at Arab Festival
ANN ARBOR, MI – In what some have described as police enforcement of Sharia law at the annual Dearborn Arab International Festival, last Friday night Dearborn Police Officers arrested four Christian missionaries and illegally confiscated their video cameras which were recording the events surrounding their arrests. The Thomas More Law Center, a public interest law firm based in Ann Arbor, Michigan, today announced it is representing all of the Christian missionaries....
http://www.christianexaminer.com/Articles/Articles%20Jul10/Art_Jul10_01.html
Four Christians arrested outside Arab festival
Christian Examiner staff report
DEARBORN, Mich. — Four Christians were arrested for disorderly conduct outside the Dearborn Arab International Festival while handing out copies of the Gospel of John in English and Arabic.
Arrested were Negeen Mayel, Dr. Nabeel Qureshi, Paul Rezkalla, and David Wood. Mayel, an eighteen-year-old female, whose parents emigrated from Afghanistan and a recent convert from Islam to Christianity, was also charged with failure to obey a police officer’s orders.
According to a press release from Thomas More Law Center, Mayel was approximately 100 feet away and videotaping a discussion with some Muslims when her camera was seized.
Dr. Nabeel Qureshi is a former Muslim who converted to Christianity. He holds an MD from Eastern Virginia Medical School and an MA in Christian apologetics from Biola University.
The Thomas More Law Center announced June 22 that it would be representing all four of the Christian missionaries.
“These Christian missionaries were exercising their Constitutional rights to free speech and the free exercise of religion, but apparently the Constitution carries little weight in Dearborn, where the Muslim population seems to dominate the political apparatus,” said Richard Thompson, President and Chief Counsel of the Thomas More Law Center.
Thompson stated that the Constitution does not allow police to ban the right of free speech just because there are those to disagree.
“It’s apparent that these arrests were a retaliatory action over the embarrassing video of the strong arm tactics used last year by Festival Security Guards,” Thompson said. “This time, the first thing police officers did before making the arrests was to confiscate the video cameras in order to prevent a recording of what was actually happening.”
Distributing religious material or witnessing at the festival has been a matter of dispute for several years. The missionaries, who are free on bond, said that they only spoke with people who wanted to speak with them and were told that they could not hand out anything within five blocks of the Arab festival.
Meanwhile, in a separate case, a federal appeals court has ruled that another missionary, Pastor George Saieg, can distribute information on the festival's perimeter.
The ruling came after a June 7 decision by Federal District Court Judge Paul D. Borman, that upheld the Dearborn's policy of barring the distribution of religious material near the event.
Saieg, founder of Arabic Christian Perspectives, said that they have passed out Christian literature at the Dearborn festival for many years without any incidents prior to the restriction.
The appeals court stated that “the loss of a First Amendment right, ‘for even minimal periods of time, unquestionable constitutes irreparable injury.’”
-
The Detroit Free Press reports that four Christian missionaries who were trying to share the Good News of Christ to Muslims were arrested and jailed Friday for disorderly conduct at the Arab Festival in Dearborn.
The police chief confirmed that four arrests were made, saying “They did cause a stir.” The four, who are part of a Christian group called Acts 17 Apologetics, were released on bail.
According to eyewitnesses, the four were handing out a booklet containing the gospel of John on the festival grounds — which were primarily tents and booths set up on the public streets of Dearborn. The would-be evangelists were surrounded by green-shirted security personnel hired by the Festival, who taunted the four and gave shouts of “Allahu Akbar” when they were arrested.
Prior to the festival (attended predominantly by Muslim Arab-Americans), a U.S. district judge in Dearborn issued a ban on groups distributing literature on sidewalks and local officials required a five-block distance for anyone wanting to distribute literature. The four were within the festival grounds.
David Wood, one of the four arrested, has said, “There are certain elements of Sharia law being adhered to in Dearborn.” The four now have legal representation.
-
“These Christian missionaries were exercising their Constitutional rights to free speech and the free exercise of religion, but apparently the Constitution carries little weight in Dearborn, where the Muslim population seems to dominate the political apparatus,” said Richard Thompson, President and Chief Counsel of the Thomas More Law Center
Rolleyes appears an appropriate emoticon.
-
they were inside the 5 block area the court had set. bad missionaries! :police: [popcorn]
-
Whether or not it was wrong to arrest these people and confiscate their cameras, it's an awful stretch to call that "Sharia law" being enforced.
-
Whether or not it was wrong to arrest these people and confiscate their cameras, it's an awful stretch to call that "Sharia law" being enforced.
Yeah, the 18 y/o girl probably wouldn't be alive right now if this was actual Sharia...
-
alright, hyperbole I guess- sorry!
http://blog.eyeblast.tv/2010/06/sharia-law-four-christians-arrested-for-passing-out-gospel-outside-arab-festival/
-
they were inside the 5 block area the court had set. bad missionaries! :police: [popcorn]
I never heard of a five block area, can you elaborate? what court?
-
alright, hyperbole I guess- sorry!
http://blog.eyeblast.tv/2010/06/sharia-law-four-christians-arrested-for-passing-out-gospel-outside-arab-festival/
It's not full application of Sharia law.
It is against Sharia to proselytize (for a faith other than Islam.) How is this a stretch when four Christians get arrested for proselytizing?
-
Yeah, the 18 y/o girl probably wouldn't be alive right now if this was actual Sharia...
Sharia lite? incremental Sharia? lo cal Sharia? non fattening Sharia?
-
they were inside the 5 block area the court had set. bad missionaries! :police: [popcorn]
Meanwhile, in a separate case, a federal appeals court has ruled that another missionary, Pastor George Saieg, can distribute information on the festival's perimeter.
The ruling came after a June 7 decision by Federal District Court Judge Paul D. Borman, that upheld the Dearborn's policy of barring the distribution of religious material near the event.
-
Quote from: Balog on Today at 08:17:41 PM
Yeah, the 18 y/o girl probably wouldn't be alive right now if this was actual Sharia...
Sharia lite? incremental Sharia? lo cal Sharia? non fattening Sharia?
<spock voice> it's Sharia Captain, but not as we know it<spock voice>
-
It's not full application of Sharia law.
It is against Sharia to proselytize (for a faith other than Islam.) How is this a stretch when four Christians get arrested for proselytizing?
They were arrested for disorderly conduct. It might be over zealous cops anxious to keep the notoriously riot happy Muslim community from getting upset at the infidels, it might be over zealous missionaries causing a ruckus. Can't really tell from the story, so I'll withhold my outrage for the moment.
-
ok, its cleared up a little, the 5 block ( or rather FIVE FREAKING BLOCKS!! )
was ruled un constitutional after the fest was already over.
DUH!!!
A clear violation of the first amendment, the cops should be fired ( imho ) for even thinking it was ok to enforce that rule.
Free speech is a basic human right, if those cops enforce a basic violation of the Constitution they're sworn to upheld, what else would they enforce? slavery? genital mutilation? rape? murder?
-
ok, its cleared up a little, the 5 block ( or rather FIVE FREAKING BLOCKS!! )
was ruled un constitutional after the fest was already over.
DUH!!!
A clear violation of the first amendment, the cops should be fired ( imho ) for even thinking it was ok to enforce that rule.
Free speech is a basic human right, if those cops enforce a basic violation of the Constitution they're sworn to upheld, what else would they enforce? slavery? genital mutilation? rape? murder?
Um....is your post meant to be rhetorical? :police:
Hurricane Katrina. Forced evacuations and gun confiscations. Destruction of property (dogs).
Cops will generally do what they are told to do. And that will and does include violating the constitution regularly.
-
And what good thing would occur if some muslim proselytizers showed up at some backwoods pentecostal or methodist tent revival? Who knows, may have already happened and there was no one left to file a report.
The troublemakers wanted to start trouble and they succeeded. Hardly news.
-
And what good thing would occur if some muslim proselytizers showed up at some backwoods pentecostal or methodist tent revival? Who knows, may have already happened and there was no one left to file a report.
The troublemakers wanted to start trouble and they succeeded. Hardly news.
OH that's rich! c'mon!! if Muslims can march into NYC and open a mosque at ground zero and announce that it will open on sept 11,2011 then you can be sure nothing would happen to evangelical Muslims anywhere in the USA.
what bunk!
-
I think I've got this straightened out.
Christians that proselytize (peacefully) at or near an Islamic fest = Bad
"Christians" that protest a serviceman's funeral in an inflammatory way = Good, and their right to be aholes absolutely covered by the 1st Amendment, backed up by local LEO.
;/
-
And what good thing would occur if some muslim proselytizers showed up at some backwoods pentecostal or methodist tent revival? Who knows, may have already happened and there was no one left to file a report.
The troublemakers wanted to start trouble and they succeeded. Hardly news.
Also, this was not a religious event, it was an "Arabic festival" and Christians of middle eastern decent showed up, you did know that there are Christians in the middle east, right? some of them are Arabic, some are Jordanian and even Pakistani/Afghani.
I know a gal, really nice gal- guess what??!! She is Persian and a devout Christian!! OMG!!! call the Dearborn PD [barf] :facepalm:
-
from anudder forum
Originally Posted by odysseus View Post
Ahhhh, but therein lays an issue here since you pulled yourself into a problem. This was not a "Muslim" festival. It is an Arab festival, right? So if Arab Christians cannot have free speech in the USA to hand out pamphlets and information at an Arab festival, where can they? Hmmmm. It's a bit of a conundrum, eh? Oh - because they are Christian you think that is a problem that deserved them being silenced - but then no issue with Islamic Arabs evangelizing going on at the same Arab festival? Kind of confusing the issue? Or is COTUS pretty clear about this?
Let me tell you 2 things from my own experience knowing some Christian Arabs. First, they are a distinct minority and have had to learn from early on to "hide" themselves about their faith inside their own ethnic communities - even in the USA. They are ostracized and rejected or will be confronted with intimidation by fellow Arab muslims if they do so. The other point to that is that Muslim Arabs have resources to large amounts of funds, and they are more organized, having been leading the general impression via their lobbying to most people that somehow Arabic people are monolithic in thoughts and faith.
-
OH that's rich! c'mon!! if Muslims can march into NYC and open a mosque at ground zero and announce that it will open on sept 11,2011
Ya know, none of that's true.
The Islamic Center is 2 blocks away from Ground Zero. It's not hallowed ground. There's probably 300-400 business in that radius. They're taking over an abandoned BURLINGTON COAT FACTORY for crying out loud. And there's a nudie bar like 200 yards from it just around the corner.
And the only thing I've ever seen with 9/11/2011 from somebody involved in the project is they said they hoped to have STARTED construction by that date when asked.
-
I don't even want to get into it, for reasons that are probably obvious, but I do gotta say Dearborn is kind of a hilarious joke on racists generally.
-
I'm a real new yorker, born in Manhattan and two blocks might as well be on top of Ground Zero, it is an evil affront to the thousands who died.
I tried to verify ( here ) that it was opening on 9/11/2011 and I believed my fellow
APS'ers when they said it was.
http://www.armedpolitesociety.com/index.php?topic=24696.0
As far as I'm concerned everywhere below Canal Street is a freaking Cemetery, the ashes of innocents killed by bloodthirsty cowards are spread all over lower Manhattan.
I've got nothing against Islam what so ever, after 9/11 I helped the local Pakistani grocer buy a shotgun.
But this crud has got to stop!
-
I'm a real new yorker, born in Manhattan and two blocks might as well be on top of Ground Zero, it is an evil affront to the thousands who died.
Just to be clear you're OK with Catholic Churches, Amish goods shops, nudie bars, and a Subway shop being "on top of Ground Zero" but an Islamic-style YMCA taking over a BURLINGTON COAT FACTORY building is over the top.
I don't get it, but whatever.
I tried to verify ( here ) that it was opening on 9/11/2011 and I believed my fellow
APS'ers when they said it was.
http://www.armedpolitesociety.com/index.php?topic=24696.0
Actually nobody said it was opening in 9/11 unless that tidbit was embedded in the PJTV link that CS&D linked to which I didn't sit through and you didn't either because you said in that thread: "I can't hear/view video's from the pc I use."
So, no, there's no basis behind the goofball notion that they're opening on the 10th anniversary of 9/11. You'll have to provide better sources for me to believe what you do.
As far as I'm concerned everywhere below Canal Street is a freaking Cemetery, the ashes of innocents killed by bloodthirsty cowards are spread all over lower Manhattan.
Well, I ain't ever seen a Subway shop or nudie bar open up on a cemetery so I'd assume you're nit-picking what you'll get outraged about.
I've got nothing against Islam what so ever...
Well, unless they do their Islam too close to the WTC.
-
Some will make better dhimmi than others.
-
Prior to the festival (attended predominantly by Muslim Arab-Americans), a U.S. district judge in Dearborn issued a ban on groups distributing literature on sidewalks and local officials required a five-block distance for anyone wanting to distribute literature.
Help! Help!
I'm being oppressed!
;/
-
So no one else was distributing literature, including the festival people?
-
Also, this was not a religious event, it was an "Arabic festival" and Christians of middle eastern decent showed up, you did know that there are Christians in the middle east, right? some of them are Arabic, some are Jordanian and even Pakistani/Afghani.
Actually, I've read that the majority of Middle Easterners in the USA are Christians.
They came here fleeing Moslem persecution.
-
Just to be clear you're OK with Catholic Churches, Amish goods shops, nudie bars, and a Subway shop being "on top of Ground Zero" but an Islamic-style YMCA taking over a BURLINGTON COAT FACTORY building is over the top.
Finally! we understand each other, yeah that's right!!! my friends were not KILLED by Catholic Churches, Amish goods shops, nudie bars, and a Subway shop they were KILLED by islamofascist and when people KILL my friends I tend to not want their Mosque at their gravesite
I don't get it, but whatever. personally I could care less that some ppl don't get it, the Taliban doesn't understand why people dance and women don't wear burkhas-they don't "get" it,but whatever
Actually nobody said it was opening in 9/11 unless that tidbit was embedded in the PJTV link that CS&D linked to which I didn't sit through and you didn't either because you said in that thread: "I can't hear/view video's from the pc I use."
So, no, there's no basis behind the goofball notion that they're opening on the 10th anniversary of 9/11. You'll have to provide better sources for me to believe what you do. they seem to be as accurate as your sources saying it wont
Well, I ain't ever seen a Subway shop or nudie bar open up on a cemetery so I'd assume you're nit-picking what you'll get outraged about.I guess you have not been below Canal St
Well, unless they do their Islam too close to the WTC. That's like saying you've got no problem with n*ggers if they stay away from white women. You DO have a problem with Islam to some extent.
No, that's YOU saying it, there are Mosque ALL OVER NYC, I am a Christian but I would love to beat the tar out of the westboro baptist jerks and I feel the same way about islamofascist nut jobs. Only a apologist for the islamofascist nutjobs would be OK with both the trampling of the COTUS in Dearborn & the crud going on at Ground Zero!... but...have a nice day ( whatever)
-
Help! Help!
I'm being oppressed!
;/
you were, that's why the Judge threw that stupid unconstitutional law under the bus.
Feel free to obey though, no law against you submitting to the will of a sect of Islam, free country you know.
-
:facepalm:
deleted.
-
No, that's YOU saying it, there are Mosque ALL OVER NYC, I am a Christian but I would love to beat the tar out of the westboro baptist jerks and I feel the same way about islamofascist nut jobs. Only a apologist for the islamofascist nutjobs would be OK with both the trampling of the COTUS in Dearborn & the crud going on at Ground Zero!... but...have a nice day ( whatever)
If I could think of something to say I would, for now just speechless...
-
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fthebrownbomber.50.forumer.com%2Fimages%2Fsmilies%2Ficon_eek.gif&hash=d0762ed28266c27a616c8783f6e9c751a81c1224)
-
^^^
ok, I got a little hot under the collar, but basically its true.
I have great respect for Islam and used to study both Sufism and Arabic in the late
70's early 80's - I couldn't convert because I figure if God had wanted me to be Islamic I would have been born that way ... but there are a lot of wonderful things about Islam, and some sects like Wahabbi (SP?) and Taliban etc ruin it for everyone.
The 5 block rule got tossed out because it was a violation of the COTUS - such a plain violation that a 5th grader could spot it but somehow the mopes enforcing it & whomever issued it couldn't.
As for the Ground Zero Mosque project? Forget about it! aint gonna happen- you can freakin bet on that.
It will be a magnet for everyone still slightly pissed off about losing friends, co-workers and the skyline they grew up with.
There are a lot of crazy people in the NY area, if 1% snaps that's 1000's of crazy people.
No way that Mosque project doesn't become a target of violent home grown really angry crazy people.
as far as my outburst, eh, big deal. Political correctness is some kind of idiotic radlib BS.
I am not gonna let fashion dictate my speech and thought- the Dearborn situation was a disgusting attack on the 1st Amendment and the Mosque project is a monument to appeasement, backstabbing, & Political correctness.
Me being Christian doesn't mean I wouldn't kick the westboro chumps in the teeth and me liking Islam doesn't mean I will not speak up if I see stupid BS.
Political correctness needs to die.
-
So no one else was distributing literature, including the festival people?
AFAIK, nope only a few Christians of middle eastern background distributing lit outside of the function on public property.
What were they thinking? That this was a free country or something? That they have rights? ;/