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Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: Perd Hapley on November 10, 2012, 08:09:46 AM

Title: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Perd Hapley on November 10, 2012, 08:09:46 AM
Yesterday morning, a local, right-wing hate radio host took a call from some leftist kook, who wanted to list his grievances with the Republican Party. Near the top of the list was "corporate welfare." And somehow, despite all the talk about Solyndra, and bank bail-outs, the host never got around to asking the caller how corporate welfare was somehow the province of the Republican Party.  :facepalm:


Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: HankB on November 10, 2012, 08:53:43 AM
Right-wing hate radio? What, is it the Klan Channel or something?

The worst example of corporate welfare was the GM bailout, which swindled Delphi workers out of their pensions, robbed bond holders, and gave a BIG ownership stake to the unions. We're still $25,000,000,000 in a hole because of that entire deal.
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: seeker_two on November 10, 2012, 11:40:12 AM
The only way gov't should provide economic benefit to a business is as a consumer buying their goods and services....like they do with ammo companies. With what FedGov spent on the GM Bailout, they could have bought the entire year's production run of vehicles & accomplished more on both ends.
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Perd Hapley on November 10, 2012, 12:28:07 PM
All this talk of GM needs to stop. Know ye not that only Republicans bail out businesses?
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: MicroBalrog on November 10, 2012, 12:51:53 PM
The GOP is supposed to be the free-market party. We expect better of them.
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Jamisjockey on November 10, 2012, 12:53:31 PM
The GM bailout was not a big business bail out: it was a big labor bail out.
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Perd Hapley on November 10, 2012, 12:55:55 PM
The GOP is supposed to be the free-market party. We expect better of them.

In the above case, it was someone who called a radio show, ostensibly to list the reasons why the GOP doesn't appeal to African-Americans (who voted >90% for Obama).
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: RevDisk on November 10, 2012, 01:01:49 PM
And somehow, despite all the talk about Solyndra, and bank bail-outs, the host never got around to asking the caller how corporate welfare was somehow the province of the Republican Party.  :facepalm:

It has been the province of both parties. The majority of the corporate welfare depends on who is in power. Bush used corporate welfare with the Kestrel project to help get European countries on board with our international nationbuilding exercises. Obama is using corporate welfare to shovel large amounts of cash into "green" businesses run by political allies. Both shoveled large amounts of money to banks.

Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Perd Hapley on November 10, 2012, 02:34:08 PM
It has been the province of both parties.


Per-zackly.
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: longeyes on November 10, 2012, 06:57:38 PM
Fistful is right (yes, I said that :)).  The economic history of the last half-century is littered with debris from both parties.  We are not where we are today just because government grew cancerously.  There were many people on the other side eager to give away our birthright for selfish reasons.  Look at the General System of Preference as an example--who pushed that?  Who stood by why our intellectual property was ripped off?  Who demanded that we provide a security umbrella for "the free world" and receive nothing in return for something paid for the American taxpayers? 
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Scout26 on November 11, 2012, 02:06:34 PM
Welfare = transferring money from one person or entity to another.

Welfare =/= allowing a person or entity to keep more of, or be taxed less on, what they earn.
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Perd Hapley on November 11, 2012, 02:09:30 PM
Welfare = transferring money from one person or entity to another.

Welfare =/= allowing a person or entity to keep more of, or be taxed less on, what they earn.


[whine] But how are you going to pay for that tax cut? [/whine]
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Scout26 on November 11, 2012, 02:36:23 PM
Logical fallacy that the liberals have created in that tax cuts have to "be paid for".  That makes it out that the .gov has first claim to your money.

Also the CBO scoring methodology is flawed in that it shows that lower rates reduce revenue, when history shows that when tax rates have been reduced revenues increase (and vice versa.  Remember the 1990 Luxury Tax (http://www.nytimes.com/1991/07/21/nyregion/new-luxury-tax-trimming-boat-sales.html?pagewanted=2&src=pm) and how it not only reduced revenue but also destroyed jobs?)

The semantics and what words mean.  Another reason why we are losing. 
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Perd Hapley on November 11, 2012, 04:25:44 PM
The semantics and what words mean.  Another reason why we are losing. 


+ a million. I'm sure you've noticed that an increase in taxes never has to be "paid for."  :lol:
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Ron on November 11, 2012, 05:02:52 PM
The destruction of our language is creepily Orwellian.

It is almost like it is being done on purpose  [tinfoil]

Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: longeyes on November 11, 2012, 05:10:30 PM
You think?

Once terrorism becomes "unanticipated chaos" we are through the looking glass.
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Hawkmoon on November 11, 2012, 07:05:53 PM
All this talk of GM needs to stop. Know ye not that only Republicans bail out businesses?

True.

Demoncrats nationalize them (only they call it "bailing them out").
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: MicroBalrog on November 11, 2012, 07:17:16 PM
Welfare = transferring money from one person or entity to another.

Welfare =/= allowing a person or entity to keep more of, or be taxed less on, what they earn.

This is why subsidies are a form of welfare, yes.
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Tallpine on November 11, 2012, 07:20:48 PM
What good is government if you can't use it to steal from somebody else  ???
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: JonnyB on November 12, 2012, 12:18:56 PM
What good is government if you can't use it to steal from somebody else  ???

And give it to your friends.

jb
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: ArfinGreebly on November 14, 2012, 02:21:47 PM

You think?

Once terrorism becomes "unanticipated chaos" we are through the looking glass.



Workplace Violence.
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Ron on November 14, 2012, 04:21:12 PM
Unanticipated workplace chaos
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: brimic on November 14, 2012, 04:56:32 PM
Quote
Unanticipated workplace chaos
Protest.
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Waitone on November 17, 2012, 07:25:27 PM
Quote
The semantics and what words mean.  Another reason why we are losing.
And we keep putting inarticulate boobs like Boehner and McConnell in leadership positions who don't seem to be able to explain anything in terms Joe and Martha Sixpack could understand.  They both use DC shorthand techno-speak in talking with the media.  Sorts gives a clue as to their mindset.
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: Myself on November 19, 2012, 11:53:25 PM
Someday they may get the idea to start calling illegal aliens undocumented workers.
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: SADShooter on November 20, 2012, 09:42:49 AM
Someday they may get the idea to start calling illegal aliens undocumented workers.

Self-motivated opportunity seekers.
Title: Re: Corporate Welfare
Post by: longeyes on November 20, 2012, 10:55:18 AM
Or they might call the pathway to citizenship the pathway to the irrelevancy of citizenship or national insolvency?

I tend to think their inability to communicate in Reaganesque clarity is deliberate.  Telling the American people, and especially the taxpaying portion, the full truth of things would be rather inconvenient, to say the least.  Government works by confusion and obfuscation, and that's where the semantic games come from.  The reality is that the few pay for the money and have to be persuaded that this is good and just and fair--and inevitable.  If the serfs were to think hard about why they play along the whole system would go POOF!