Doing Away With Flush Toilets

[HankB]

. . . It would make a great deal more sense to have a different water source for the toilet than for the sink.

Some places have dual water lines, one for domestic water, another for commercial water, which is cleaned up "a bit" but not enough to meet standards for drinking water.

In my city, the medians are watered with commercial water, as are some park areas - but cost would probably be prohibitive to bring commercial water into all homes for domestic purposes.

And you just know someone - or someone's pet - would drink the non-potable stuff and get sick . . . which means a payday for lawyers. In fact, overspray from a local park area - where excess commercial water was being sprayed over a stand of cedars - has caused quite an uproar, since on breezy days overspray drifts over an elementary school.

[MechAg94]

If I am not mistaken, Potable water is defined as water that will come in contact with human skin through normal use. ...or something like that.  That includes toilets, sinks, and other stuff where people think we should use grey water.  Regulations aren't set up for it. 

I agree on things like watering lawns.  It would be neat to collect the shower/bathtub drain in a tank for that use.  You just have to be careful with your Scrubbing Bubbles cleaners. 

[MechAg94]

Indeed; as well as a separate disposal path for industrial chemical waste.

What do you mean by that as far as the chemical waste goes?  Are you talking about domestic disposal or chemical plants?  Most chemical plants I have seen have their own water treatment plants or send it to one.  Others have permits to release what they release.

[wmenorr67]

Potable water is safe to drink.  Non-potable water usually is safe to bath with.  Grey and black water is waste water.

[Vile Nylons]

There is a difference between potable, non-potable, and recycled gray water. Non potable waters have been allowed to be used to flush toilets and even for hand washing in sinks labeled as non-potable, but this is usually by special permit and for special commercial purposes. Recycled gray water has been allowed to be used under special provisions but only for toilet flushing purposes. Special precautions to ensure abscence of cross connections in the plumbing must be ensured. Although non-potable might be allowed for bathing in some places, typically this frowned upon since the human body has "portals of entry" such as eyes, lungs and mouth which are vulnerable to pathogen invasion.
To keep municipal wastewater streams from being chemically contaminated provisions usually exist precluding the discharge of chemical waste into them, necessitating industry to deal with their own product. Residential discharges however also include chemical wastes which tend to be concentrated at the wastewater facilities. The elimination of wastwater sludge is problematic because of these "heavy metal" concentrates. State regulations on disposal vary. Here in Minnesota they are sprayed on open ground, usually farm fields which must be left fallow for a year after. The potential for heavy metal accumulation in wildlife, bees and even domestic animals in subsequent years is troubling to me personally because heavy metals do not mysteriously disappear. But the state regulating agency [MPCA] disagrees.
The use of non potable drinking water for other things like watering gardens, trees and lawns is non problematic. Typically non-potable means surface waters that have not been treated to meet the "potable" standard.
The use of recycled gray water for the above purposes is in my opinion troubling especially when in those applications the product is "misted" as in lawn spraying. The reason is that the droplets float and can easily be inhaled into the lungs. Lungs are highly susceptible to pathogen invasion in such a manner. Non-misted is less troubling unless you have a cut foot and you are walking in it.
[Just before retiring from public health there was a move to allow ski areas to use gray water in their snow-making guns which I believed was very troubling.]
The article this thread is about has theoretical truths but clearly was written to bash western civilization. It intentionally avoids the whole arena of efforts ongoing to effectively and successfully recycle all the water that goes down our toilets not just through municipal waste water treatment but individual septic discharge systems as well.

[Manedwolf]

I like this one. Scary. An older Soyuz space toilet.



Oh, those wacky Soviets...

[Thor]

Despite this process, it is clear that some chemicals are getting into the tap water supply. Ironically, the very chlorine added to remove impurities is responsible for some of these potentially cancer causing chemicals. Chlorine is also believed to be a factor predisposing a person to heart attack and stroke. Its not surprising, then, that many cities around the world are looking to alternatives to chlorine treatment of their water supply. The majority of them have turned to ozone treatment. Ozone is an unstable form of oxygen that reacts in a chemical frenzy with water, oxidizing impurities quickly and leaving no ozone residue.

Many cities add fluoride to their water supply in an attempt to achieve mass medical treatment of teeth. Children who drink fluoride treated water reportedly have only a half to a third as many dental cavities. Opponents, however, state that those who drink a lot of water  as we all should  are put at danger by the fluoride, claiming that it could lead to mongolism, cancer and a shortened life span. Besides, they say, the dental benefits only apply to children.

So, where does that leave us? We need to drink more water, yet our water is potentially unsafe. Having a balanced view here is vital. It is impossible, and unnecessary, to avoid all impurities. On the other hand, a water purifier is a wise investment, one that will make the water you drink taste a lot better as well as removing concerns over chemical impurities.

The debate over chlorine and fluoride in our water looks set to continue for some time. In the meantime, lets get the most out of the water weve got  and continue to enjoy the health benefits of this amazing liquid.

Entire Article

This is only the tip of the iceberg. Retreated waste water may contain hazardous chemicals that aren't even specified in this article. Medications that have been dumped down the toilet, cleaners, and other HazWaste often finds it's way into the local water sources.

Another Article

[AJ Dual]

Everyone talks about how much water gets wasted, when the issue is the quality of the water.The same pristine sanitized water I drink and bathe with also carries away my waste; the water I use to brush my teeth is used to hose down the driveway.  It would make a great deal more sense to have a different water source for the toilet than for the sink.

I agree too. You could do things like route the kitchen sink and disposal water to the toilet.

One downside though. It might be hard to tell where any corn and whatnot came from... 

[K Frame]

Personally I think the addition of chlorine and fluoride to drinking water far outweighs any potential risks that might be involved.

Drinking water transmitted illnesses regularly cut HUGE swaths through the populations in urban areas. The advent of chlorination in combination with better sanitation helped virtually eradicate diseases such as cholera and dysentery from the general population.

Ozone looks like it will be a viable replacement for some levels of treatment, but I'm not sure that it will kill as many pathogens as chlorination will.

"Mongolism..."

Say WHAT?

Down Syndrom, as far as I know, doesn't occur in children once they're outside the womb. At least I think that might be the inference that's being drawn.

[roo_ster]

[gen_jack_d_ripper]A foreign substance is introduced into our precious bodily fluids without the knowledge of the individual. Certainly without any choice. That's the way your hard-core Commie works.[/gen_jack_d_ripper]

[BakerMikeRomeo]

What is it with authoritarian/fascist types and *expletive deleted*it?

Write what you know, I guess.

~BakerMike

[Phantom Warrior]

I liked the toilets I ran into in Europe for water consumption. They looked like a normal toilet but had a flat shelf where you did you business and a jet of water pushed it down the drain when you flushed, seemed to use a lot less water than the low flow toilets we are accustomed to.

Maybe your experience was different than mine, but my experience w/ those toilets has been TERRIBLE.  We have a lot of them in the barracks back in Schweinfurt (Conn Barracks, Schweinfurt, Germany) and they suck.  Since there isn't much water on the shelf, you usually end up with streaks of crap (literally) all over the bowl.  And the pint of water the toilet flushes usually isn't enough to push the turd over the ledge.  So you sit there flushing and flushing and flushing (I'm not kidding), trying to get the crap down the toilet.

Frankly, aside from the fact I don't like them, it seems like these shelf toilets waste way more water than they save.



Regarding non-potable water, I've been showering and doing hygiene with non-potable water for the last 11 months in Kuwait and Iraq.  I even brush my teeth with it, which probably isn't the best idea.  But I haven't experienced any adverse affects.  *shrug*

[mtnbkr]

"Mongolism..."

Say WHAT?

Down Syndrom, as far as I know, doesn't occur in children once they're outside the womb. At least I think that might be the inference that's being drawn.

It doesn't.  It's a genetic disorder and can be detected before birth.

Chris