A/V Help -- Where do the Wires Go in This Here Movin' Picture Box?

[Ben]

AKA - The Borg Collective has taken over my living room.
AKA - Whatever happened to the good old days of Coax and RCA connectors?
AKA - I used to make fun of people who kept their VCR perpetually set to 1200.
AKA - Apparently I'm an idiot.


Okay, so finally, kicking and screaming, I find myself in the 21st century of television. I got a DVD recorder/VCR for Christmas,  just bought an HDTV that will arrive on Wednesday, and am upgrading to an HDTV/DVR cable box from my cable company as well. The only problem: WHERE THE HELL DO ALL THE GALLDANG WIRES GO?!?

Obviously I want to get the best HDTV picture possible, but the manuals for each of the three components  each show a different way to hook them up, and they each have (or are lacking) different sets of the HD connections. Can one of you A/V smarty-pantses pretty-please help me choose the best wiring sequence?

Here are the connectors available on each unit:


HDTV

HDMI input (1)
HD component input (2)
S video input (1)
Composite video input (3)
Audio inputs RCA (3)
Audio output Optical Digital (1)
Audio output RCA (1)
S video output (1)


DVD-R/VCR

Component video output (1)
Digital audio output (1)
S video output (1)
S video input (1)
Composite video output (1)
Composite video input (1)
Coax antenna in/out (1 each)


Cable box / DVR

Cable in/out (1 each)
Component out (1)
HDMI out (1)
S video out (1)
Composite video/audio out (1)
Composite video/audio in (1)
Digital audio out (1)
VCR Archive (composite video/audio out to DVD recorder for archiving from the cable DVR) (1)


Given all the above: The manuals seem to call for the sequence: cable box to DVD to HDTV. However, since I want to use either HDMI or component (right?) and my DVD recorder has no HD input, am I not then losing HD signal if I do something like S video in to DVD (best available input) and then component DVD out to component HDTV? I would be getting HD signal from any DVDs I play, but wouldn't I lose HD signal from cable to live TV because the bottleneck input to the DVD was S video?

Can I use S video or composite input to the DVD from the cable box (plus coax to antenna in), but then also use either HDMI or component out from the cable box to the TV, then component out from the DVD to the HDTV? If I do HDMI or component directly from the cable box, I do not then have to run coax from antenna out on the DVD to antenna in on the HDTV, right? This seems like it would get me full HD to to TV, but somehow I'm thinking that I'm missing something regarding being able to record stuff to the DVD/VCR. Maybe I just have to always record to the cable DVR, then only archive from the DVR to the DVD/VCR?

This is so confusing. Maybe i'm overanalyzing because of all the connections? My current  cable / standard TV / DVD player setup is coax in / coax out,  coax in / coax out, so all these extra connectors are totally flustering me.

Sorry for the long, drawn out, convoluted, help request. Any advice is greatly appreciated though. I'm now off to to take 18 more Excedrin.

[Nathaniel Firethorn]

WWCD: What Would Curly Do?

No wonda da wudda don't woik! Da pipes is clogged up wit wires!

- NF

[Sindawe]

Disclaimer: I'm still at the analog/coax cable stage here as well.

This seems like it would get me full HD to to TV, but somehow I'm thinking that I'm missing something regarding being able to record stuff to the DVD/VCR. Maybe I just have to always record to the cable DVR, then only archive from the DVR to the DVD/VCR?

That sounds about right.  From the information you've provided, your best recording will be on the cable DVR, then archive the stuff you want to keep to the DVD-R.  Maybe set up in this sequence

Cable/DVR ==1==> HDTV ==2==> DVD-R

Connection 1 being HDMI
Connection 2 being S video

Or perhaps set the DVD-R  up to branch off the Cable/DVR using component connectors, with a small composite TV as a monitor for archiving, the feed the signal back into the HDTV for later viewing.

[Ben]

Mr. Firethorn -- all I have to say to you sir is, 'Whooo Whooo Whooo Whoop!"

Sindawe - That seemed the most logical to me, but I guess with the bajillion connections, I'm over-analyzing and figuring that I'm missing something somewhere. I'm so accustomed to linear progression, the whole A/V webbed  connection thing is baffling me.

"Mr. Spock -- tactical analysis." "Tactics indicate two-dimensional thinking Captain."

Or, as I look at all the wiring diagrams..... "KAAAAAAHHHHHNNNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

[Brad Johnson]

A few pointers first. Component is FAR superior to composite. Component means that the signal is broken down into it's component colors. Composite is a signal composed of all chrominance (color) and luminance (brightness) bunched (composited) into one signal. When possible, use component A/V feeds.

Use good cables. Don't be a sucker for the mega-dollar per set stuff, but expect to pay at least $20-$30 per tri-cable set for fully shielded cables with stable, heavy ends.

And always remeber to go from "Out" to "In".

On to the hookups....

One is a given. You only have one set of HDMI (hi-def connectors). So connect the Cable/DVR box to the TV via the HDMI set.

You will also want to from the 'Component Out' on the cable/DVR box into the 'Component In' on the DVD-R/VCR box. This will allow you to record to DVD/VHS from the cable/DVR box. Then run from the 'Component Out' on the the DVD-R/VCR to the 'Component In - 1' on the TV.

On the TV you will have to manually switch Inputs from HDMI to Component One (or Video One or whatever that particular input is labeled). Your TV remote should have an "INPUT" button for that function.

It will look like this...

                                                         

Cable/DVR> (HDMI out) ------------------ (HDMI In) >Television
              v
   (Composite Out)
               l
               l
               l
               l
   (Composite In)
              v
DVD-R/VCR> (Component Out) --------- (Component In-1) >Television



Certain types of digital copy protection my require you to use the VCR Archive Out composite hookup from the Cable/DVR to the DVD-R/VCR. In that case, just go from the Archive Out jack to the Composite In on the DVD-R/VCR. You will have have to switch to that input when recording, but your DVD-R/VCR remote will probably have a single button for that function.

Brad

[garyk/nm]

So, Ben, watcha gonna do for surround sound?

Actually, a surround receiver might be the way to go. Most current receivers are set up to act as a hub for all of the other components. Everything goes to receiver inputs, then out from the receiver to the TV. You can also cross-connect components for recording purposes.
An engineering degree is sounding mighty useful right now.

[grampster]

I'd ask for him to set up a video link so we could all watch the fireworks, but maybe that would be the last straw that causes him to begin drooling and muttering to himself.
 

[Ben]

Brad -- Your setup diagram is the ideal I was looking for, but I have no component "in"  on the danged DVD/VCR. Best I have is S-video. I could probably live with that for stuff I want to send directly to the DVD, since I probably wouldn't ever really need to if I have the DVR in the cable box. The main reason I asked for this DVD/VCR for Xmas was to archive a bunch of my VHS tapes for preservation and to clear them out. At some point I'll probably give the DVD/VCR recorder to my sister so she can do the same thing, then get another DVD-R only for myself (that has HD inputs!).

Anyways I can't understand the engineering behind making a DVD recorder that has HD out but no HD in. Seems kinda dumb to me, but then if I'd been smarter and investigated all this stuff earlier,  I coulda avoided this particular recorder.

Thanks for the advice on cables. I already read to stay away from overpriced Monster Cables. I used to use them myself for other stuff years ago, but they've gotten kinda full of themselves with the prices they're asking for a 2 meter HDMI cable!

Gary -- Dude -- don't even get me started on the audio yet. I'll be happy if I get an HD picture with NO sound at this point...

Grampster -- You're a cruel, cruel man.......   (where the hell did I put my drool cup...?)

[Brad Johnson]

Ben

No sweat. Just use the composit connnections instead. It won't hurt anything. I have changed the diagram to reflect the difference.

On the DVD "HD" question, well, unless it has an HDMI connector it is not HD-anything. The only thing you have that is HD-ready is the cable/DVR box. Current DVD is not hi-def anyway - the DVD format simply can't hold enough information for a true hi-def image. Hi-def on disc will soon be reality, though. The new Blu-Ray and HD-DVD formats will be true HD. Unfortunately, you will have to purchase a new player for the new format discs. Happily, though, the players should be backwards compatible and will play all your current DVDs.

Brad

[Ben]

Okay, gotchya.  Thanks Brad!  

I obviously still have a lot of catching up to do re: all this newfangled TV technology. I thought being a computer nerd would be helpful to me, but it wasn't at all.

[Brad Johnson]

Here you go - the Yamaha HTR-5990 tuner and home theatre control center. Yamaha 7.1 surround capable. Integrated DTS decoder. Full control of up to eight video sources plus an additinional four audio sources. Built-in XM tuner. It even has HDMI upconversion to convert all composite and component video sources to HDMI so you only have to run one cable to your HDMI capable TV.

I have the predecessor to this unit. The only diff is that mine does not have HDMI switching or an XM tuner. I am VERY pleased with the unit. Good, clean, powerful sound.

Click here for a link to the Yamaha product description page

...and here's a pic of the back of the unit. So simple. So easy *evil grin* ....



And if you think YOU have lots of wires to control, you should see behind my theatre center. I run a full 5.1 system with a DVD player, laserdisc player, tape player, VCR, and DirecTV box not only piped into the control center, but crosswired into eached other and piped out to another amp in the bedroom. Just guessing, I'd say I have at least 200 feet of heavy cabling unceremoneously stuffed in every available nook and cranny.

Brad

[Ben]

As scary as that looks to me right now Brad, I can certainly see where in reality, once you have a whole lot of components, that having that central "command & control" would make life simpler. Something for me to think about once  I adjust myself to all these newfangled devices.

At least I've settled down some and the uncontrolled drooling and muttering have stopped for the time being (unless the New Years Eve brandy had something to do with that).