Can someone please explain Russiagate?

[AZRedhawk44]

I swear I remember Russiagate starting off as some sort of accusation against Hillary.

WTF has been done that's wrong, and why TF should I care about it?

It all seems insanely convoluted and victimless.

[BlueStarLizzard]

Trump and Putin are members of the Evil League of Evil, and thus must be defeated.

[Andiron]

Leftists aren't creative,  so projecting treason with our usual adversary is their way of claiming Trump is bad.

No mention of Obama, a hot mic, and something about having more options after re-election.

[Jamisjockey]

Orange man bad.
Orange man and his cronies colluded with Russia to get wikileaks dirt and/or have wikileaks dirt released on Hillary.
Orange man possibly got peed on by hookers in Russian hotel.

Very likely that they did ask Russia for dirt on hillary.  Trump was in the middle of negotiations for a Trump tower in Moscow.  Of course, nobody's talking about the actual wrong doing of Hillary and the DNC, conspiracy against Bernie (election tampering anyone?), nor the pay for play that was wikileaked.
Additionally, it's very likely that the investigation is covering up FBI wrongdoing during the election including bugging Trump tower.

When you turn a special prosecutor loose, they can chase down any lead that pops up.  What popped up that has the most legs, is the probably bribes to Stormy D and the other chick.  If those were directed by Trump, and came from campaign funds...that's a criminal offense that can be prosecuted fully.

[WLJ]

I think it all boils down to
"We didn't get our trophy! "

[Jamisjockey]

I think it all boils down to
"We didn't get our trophy! "

I've heard some very compelling arguments that it was launched to give the FBI a chance to bury it's wrong doing.

[WLJ]

That's more or less business as usual IMHO
I was thinking more in terms of whats keeping the fire lit with the MSM and snowflake masses.

[AZRedhawk44]

Orange man bad.
Orange man and his cronies colluded with Russia to get wikileaks dirt and/or have wikileaks dirt released on Hillary.
Orange man possibly got peed on by hookers in Russian hotel.

Very likely that they did ask Russia for dirt on hillary.  Trump was in the middle of negotiations for a Trump tower in Moscow.  Of course, nobody's talking about the actual wrong doing of Hillary and the DNC, conspiracy against Bernie (election tampering anyone?), nor the pay for play that was wikileaked.
Additionally, it's very likely that the investigation is covering up FBI wrongdoing during the election including bugging Trump tower.

When you turn a special prosecutor loose, they can chase down any lead that pops up.  What popped up that has the most legs, is the probably bribes to Stormy D and the other chick.  If those were directed by Trump, and came from campaign funds...that's a criminal offense that can be prosecuted fully.

So all of this boils down to Trump possibly using election funds rather than his own billions to pay off a couple of hookers?

What a load of horseshyt.

[Jamisjockey]

That's more or less business as usual IMHO
I was thinking more in terms of whats keeping the fire lit with the MSM and snowflake masses.

Both sides are guilty.  I grew weary of the "impeach" chant during the Obama years, to the point of being embarrassed to be in conservative conversation.
That said, the shrill left began calling for Impeachment from day one, without any evidence of any wrongdoing.  
It's the default cry of the opposition anymore and I have a feeling it'll get louder with each new President.

[Jamisjockey]

So all of this boils down to Trump possibly using election funds rather than his own billions to pay off a couple of hookers?

What a load of horseshyt.

Like it or not it's Illegal. 

[AZRedhawk44]

So:

1. Trump uses millions of his own money to begin courting the electorate in primaries.
2. Trump begins to solicit donations partway through primaries and into the general election.
3. Some people, in a voluntary manner, give money to the GOP or to Trump's PAC (both non-governmental institutions).  There are accusations of possible misuse of those funds.
4. The ENTIRE GOVERNMENT gets its panties in a twist over it, soak up BILLIONS of dollars and tens of thousands of man-hours of GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES using VIOLENTLY COERCED TAX FUNDS TO PAY FOR IT.


Seems like the far better solution is for the accusations to sully the reputation of Trump's PAC or the GOP and leave it at that. 

Donations to other charities (lulz, a PAC a charity ) or nonprofits (same lulz) don't elicit such scrutiny.  There's no federal prohibition against prostitution... the IRS ran a brothel in Nevada 20-odd years ago that they seized during a tax default.

I still don't see the crime.  Nor do I see the justification for this much expensive activity.

[Jamisjockey]

So:

1. Trump uses millions of his own money to begin courting the electorate in primaries.
2. Trump begins to solicit donations partway through primaries and into the general election.
3. Some people, in a voluntary manner, give money to the GOP or to Trump's PAC (both non-governmental institutions).  There are accusations of possible misuse of those funds.
4. The ENTIRE GOVERNMENT gets its panties in a twist over it, soak up BILLIONS of dollars and tens of thousands of man-hours of GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES using VIOLENTLY COERCED TAX FUNDS TO PAY FOR IT.


Seems like the far better solution is for the accusations to sully the reputation of Trump's PAC or the GOP and leave it at that. 

Donations to other charities (lulz, a PAC a charity ) or nonprofits (same lulz) don't elicit such scrutiny.  There's no federal prohibition against prostitution... the IRS ran a brothel in Nevada 20-odd years ago that they seized during a tax default.

I still don't see the crime.  Nor do I see the justification for this much expensive activity.

Paying off someone with campaign funds to keep quiet during an election is illegal.  Election influencing and all that, as well as not disclosing how funds are spent.


I'm assuming it's a normal act.  The russia probe just exposed the trump campaign.

[RoadKingLarry]

No mention of 'The Steele Dossier"?
The dossier/opposition research that was bought and paid for by Clinton and the DNC. The unverified dossier that was used by the FBI to obtain multiple FISA warrants to wire tap the Trump campaign.
Members of the Trump organization are being prosecuted persecuted for "lying to congress" yet it has been proven that Comey, Clapper, Brennan, Holder, and others blatantly "lied to congress" have been completely given a pass.

The Republic is dead, long live the republic.

[Chester32141]

Though long, this article does a pretty good job of laying it out … since it is several months old there has been a lot of info released since that supports his claims … What transpired is available to all who care and have time to research the truth.  All the Press knows the truth, all the politicians on both sides of the aisle know the truth.  The truth isn't what they get paid for, pushing the narrative is.  The president knows the truth.  If he fails to MAGA / KAG he and his entire family will be destroyed … pretty powerful incentive for him to win.

https://themarketswork.com/2018/10/12/spygate-the-true-story-of-collusion/

One method used to help establish evidence of collusion was the employment of “spy traps.” Prominent among these were ones set for Trump campaign advisers George Papadopoulos and Carter Page. The intent was to provide or establish connections between the Trump campaign and Russia. The content and context mattered little as long as a connection could be established that could then be publicized. The June 2016 Trump Tower meeting was another such attempt.

Lot of good info at this link ... https://themarketswork.com/

 

[makattak]

Paying off someone with campaign funds to keep quiet during an election is illegal.  Election influencing and all that, as well as not disclosing how funds are spent.


I'm assuming it's a normal act.  The russia probe just exposed the trump campaign.

Uhhh... While you are right that paying off people with campaign funds is illegal, he's accused of NOT using campaign funds for paying of the hookers.

Because it was obviously to effect an election and not something he would be doing even if not running for president.

[DittoHead]

I don't really consider the Stormy Daniels / campaign finance stuff to be a big part of "Russiagate".

It's a mix of:

• innuendo, unverified, and often salacious rumors amplified by by the media (Steel Dossier, Michael Cohen in Prague, collusion)
• Russian "influence" of indeterminate impact (twitter bots, facebook influence operations, Maria Butina)
• actual Trump campaign events/relationships that are very shady but not necessarily illegal (Manafort, Trump Tower meeting, backchannels to wikileaks/Russia)
• Intelligence Community misconduct (Fisa warrants, Page-Strozk texts, leaks)
• Whatabout Hillary Clinton's emails and Uranium One
• Process Crimes / Coverup (Mueller thus far: lying to the FBI, perjury, obstruction, witness tampering)

Being in the middle of it and depending on who you ask, you'll get wildly varying opinions on the truth of it. The MSM isn't reliable (see first item) but neither is the trump campaign (see last item). In my opinion - if you want to know the truth you're gonna have to wait about 10 years.

[WLJ]

Trying to get my head around some of these campaign laws they keep saying were broken and I'm not sure it would be possible to run a campaign without stepping on one somewhere alone the line or at the very least not appear to be no matter how honest you were.

[DittoHead]

Trying to get my head around some of these campaign laws they keep saying were broken and I'm not sure it would be possible to run a campaign without stepping on one somewhere alone the line or at the very least not appear to be no matter how honest you were.

That's absolutely true at this point. The Obama campaign paid a HUGE fine for violations. I think most campaigns have paid at least some fine, and virtually every one has had to return donations. The big sticking point (supposedly) is whether it was intentional or not. That part is very hard to prove.

[WLJ]

Yeah, I thought of adding after I posted
 If I was paranoid in a certain way I would think that was done on purpose to be used as needed/wanted.

[French G.]

The problem for the resistance is that Americans traditionally like a fighter and underdog and very much dislike unfairness. So it may seem like a certain win for them in 2020 inside their echo chamber, but unless they nail him to the wall they are going to be left to figure out how to beat Mike Pence in six years.

[WLJ]

If the best they can come up with is Warren, Hillary, and Harris and if Trump can keep dodging the feces they keep throwing at him then I think he doesn't have much to worry about in 2020. This is IF the right can get decently motivated to get off their collective behinds and vote.

[Jamisjockey]

Trying to get my head around some of these campaign laws they keep saying were broken and I'm not sure it would be possible to run a campaign without stepping on one somewhere alone the line or at the very least not appear to be no matter how honest you were.

Imagine the skeletons in the Clintons closets. 

[Scout26]

Paying off someone with campaign funds to keep quiet during an election is illegal.  Election influencing and all that, as well as not disclosing how funds are spent.


I'm assuming it's a normal act.  The russia probe just exposed the trump campaign.

But, since Trump used his own money and not money from a PAC or his campaign, it's not illegal.  (And most illegal campaign contributions and uses thereof have resulted in fines from the FEC and not jail time.  The only instance of anyone ever going to jail was D'nesh D'souza, because Obama was extremely pissed about the movie(s) he made about Obama)

[RoadKingLarry]

Imagine the skeletons in the Clintons closets warehouses. 

FTFY

[WLJ]

Imagine the skeletons in the Clintons closets. 

Catacombs