Executions by nitrogen gas

[Mannlicher]

I have to agree with fistful.   A brief bit of 'discomfort' for the miscreant being executed, should not be a worry.

[wmenorr67]

As for RKL's dig a hole idea, here in Oklahoma there are several deep mines that one could be dropped in, if you can get out you can live.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

Ever seen a gas chamber in use? Not pretty . Not as imagined.  The guy I saw tried to hold his breath.
Shoot em up with a big shot of dope. It's over should take less than 60 seconds to tie em off and hit em. Bye


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[Ben]

I find it interesting that the two currently most used methods are, to me, actually the most painful to the criminal. Not necessarily from a physical aspect, but psychologically. They not only have to go through the whole "pomp and circumstance" of the slow walk, being strapped in, etc., but then when the word is given, they're still conscious and aware for a good while as the gas is pumped in, or the cocktail injected.

If the people who complain about the perceived suffering that the death penalty causes really cared, they'd be more in favor of the older, "messier" methods than they would of current methods, because while "the walk" is still there, once the word is given, it's lights out. With the possible exception of a firing squad.

I think if I were on death row, I would take the nail gun they use on cattle over a firing squad. However, anesthesia plus nitrogen would be my preferred choice if I was looking for an easy death. Because with nitrogen alone, while physically painless, I'd still be anxious over the time it took for the gas to do its thing. Not that I'm necessarily against someone who has committed a heinous crime thinking about that during their last minutes.

[wmenorr67]

Why don't we just let the family of the victim decide how they should be executed.

[MillCreek]

Working in the medical field, if I had my choice, I would have a face mask strapped to my face and given inhalational general anesthesia.  I would be unconscious in just a few seconds.  Then after being in deep anesthesia, you turn down the oxygen and turn up the concentration of the anesthetic agent.  You would be dead in just a few minutes from hypoxia and you would never feel a thing.

I have handled malpractice cases where pretty much this scenario occurred by accident.

[Nick1911]

Why don't we just let the family of the victim decide how they should be executed.

I wouldn't want to put that on the family.  That's a heavy burden.

Besides, the matter is between the state and the condemned.

[MillCreek]

I find it interesting that the two currently most used methods are, to me, actually the most painful to the criminal. Not necessarily from a physical aspect, but psychologically. They not only have to go through the whole "pomp and circumstance" of the slow walk, being strapped in, etc., but then when the word is given, they're still conscious and aware for a good while as the gas is pumped in, or the cocktail injected

I read the autobiography of Albert Pierrepoint, who was one of the final Chief Executioners in Great Britain. He took real pride in minimizing the anxiety of the prisoner and strived to complete the execution as fast as possible.  His personal best was restraining, noosing, hooding and springing the trap in 13 seconds after the prisoner entered the gallows chamber.  He did some executions for the US Army during WWII, and he thought it was barbaric the way the Army insisted that the prisoner be restrained, noosed and hooded on the gallows and then everyone stands there while the execution orders were read out for several minutes.

His book also convinced me that if you have someone who knows what they are doing, hanging is a humane method of execution.

[MechAg94]

Working in the medical field, if I had my choice, I would have a face mask strapped to my face and given inhalational general anesthesia.  I would be unconscious in just a few seconds.  Then after being in deep anesthesia, you turn down the oxygen and turn up the concentration of the anesthetic agent.  You would be dead in just a few minutes from hypoxia and you would never feel a thing.

I have handled malpractice cases where pretty much this scenario occurred by accident.

This is why I mentioned nitrous.  Give them some nitrous before hand so they are out of it.  I guess some other drug would work also.  Hell, give them a joint.  I just think nitrogen would be cheaper and more readily available.   

We train on oxygen deficient atmospheres at work since we use industrial nitrogen on site.  You have no symptoms when you suddenly breath nitrogen.  You just pass out.  Pure nitrogen actually draws O2 out of the lungs and your brain shuts down as soon as the oxygen deficient blood goes up to your head which is very fast.

[birdman]

I read the autobiography of Albert Pierrepoint, who was one of the final Chief Executioners in Great Britain. He took real pride in minimizing the anxiety of the prisoner and strived to complete the execution as fast as possible.  His personal best was restraining, noosing, hooding and springing the trap in 13 seconds after the prisoner entered the gallows chamber.  He did some executions for the US Army during WWII, and he thought it was barbaric the way the Army insisted that the prisoner be restrained, noosed and hooded on the gallows and then everyone stands there while the execution orders were read out for several minutes.

His book also convinced me that if you have someone who knows what they are doing, hanging is a humane method of execution.

I've seen some of the ropes they used in GB for this purpose...its a rather interesting story...but only to be told in person :)

[RevDisk]

I'm against the death penalty in practice because the government is not competent on multiple levels and with multiple variations. The government has a proven history of executing innocent parties that were wrongly convicted. On the flip side, they regularly let folks not be executed if the person has wealth or exceptional lawyers.

If we cannot ban government usage of lethal force against its citizenry, we should regulate it as much as we are allowed. I gather some folks are in the "Who cares, make it as barbaric as possible!" camp. I'd remind those folks that is statistically certain said methods will be used against the innocent as well the the guilty. Because that's what governments do. Virtually any form of execution will be blotched. Because that's what governments do.

Ergo, it is reasonable to try to mandate that executions be humane and hard to screw up. Nitrogen, nitrous or anesthesia are all superior to current forms of execution in terms of humaneness, "hard to screw up" and cost effectiveness. We're stuck with our current situation due to bureaucratic inertia, blatant sadism of a large enough section of the citizenry and our politicians generally not being very good leaders.

If a person was absolutely guilty as determined by an impartial and just legal system, I'd be fine with them being fed into a wood chipper feet first while being dosed in sulfuric acid while forced to listen to Justin Bieber on repeat. But we don't live in such a system. We know beyond a reasonable doubt that our legal system is not impartial nor just.

[Ron]

I approve of and echo the above statements ^

Our government(s) are not worthy to judge life and death.

I'm also in favor of a more isolationist stance on foreign policy regarding making war. I realize the realities and accept that rolling back our  military adventurous policies would be a long term project so as not to cause to many disruptions worldwide. 

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

Eh.  There are people out there who need to be put down, and it's a proper responsibility of government to do it.  Blanket refusal to execute is itself a form of government incompetence. 

[Ben]

I'm somewhat in agreement with Rev and Ron, though I look at "should there be a death penalty?" as a different topic from how to kill someone if there is one.

I used to be more pro death penalty before I started seeing all the cases of DNA evidence proving people's innocence years after their conviction. Because of that I've changed my views. I'm still pro death penalty for heinous crimes where there are multiple reliable witnesses, DNA evidence, and/or the perpetrator is so proud of what he/she did that they happily confess. In those cases, kill them quickly and don't pussyfoot around the court system. Otherwise, if there is doubt, because there have been so many reversals, I prefer the life in prison option, regardless of the costs. A life term still sucks for someone innocent, but at least there's a chance that they can prove their innocence and get some of their life back.

[Firethorn]

Ever seen a gas chamber in use? Not pretty . Not as imagined.  The guy I saw tried to hold his breath.

Was it a nitrogen chamber? 

This is what happens when you use nitrogen:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTNX6mr753w

If you're using it as a death sentence you simply don't stop, have the person in the room alone, and preferably don't tell them exactly when you switch the gas supply from 'outside' to 'nitrogen'.
Yes, I even recommend having an air freshener(incense wouldn't work well, nothing would burn during the operation).

Shoot em up with a big shot of dope. It's over should take less than 60 seconds to tie em off and hit em. Bye

The problem is that they're having trouble finding professional needle-jabbers willing to do it combined with nobody's willing to sell them the drugs.  I suppose you could use confiscated stuff, but even then you run into that now you're really complicating the issue.  Supply and quality isn't assured, for one.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

Plenty of smack in property rooms. And hitting someone up is child's play. It's harder to take blood than give a shot and they train cops to do sticks road side

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

The cyanide killed him plenty quick it was the watching him try to hold his breath that was ugly

[MechAg94]

IMO, the death penalty is supposed to be a matter of seeing justice done, without revenge or malice.  There is no good or helpful reason to inflict unnessary pain/suffering.  Just get the job done. 

[MechAg94]

I'm somewhat in agreement with Rev and Ron, though I look at "should there be a death penalty?" as a different topic from how to kill someone if there is one.

I used to be more pro death penalty before I started seeing all the cases of DNA evidence proving people's innocence years after their conviction. Because of that I've changed my views. I'm still pro death penalty for heinous crimes where there are multiple reliable witnesses, DNA evidence, and/or the perpetrator is so proud of what he/she did that they happily confess. In those cases, kill them quickly and don't pussyfoot around the court system. Otherwise, if there is doubt, because there have been so many reversals, I prefer the life in prison option, regardless of the costs. A life term still sucks for someone innocent, but at least there's a chance that they can prove their innocence and get some of their life back.

Usually when you look at the cases where those people were exonerated, you have to wonder what the jury was thinking when they voted to convict.  There was usually lots of blame to go around.  This a good reason why I think good people should NOT avoid jury duty.  Do your part to make sure justice is done correctly. 

For the death penalty in Texas, many of the requirements people say they want are required.  The jury decides whether the death penalty applies by answering a set of questions. 

[KD5NRH]

We have discussed nitrogen hypoxia many times.  It will be interesting to see if this goes anywhere.

Screw it; just use normal air.  Get it up to, say, 50 atmospheres, hold for an hour then pop the latch.  What happens to him after you set him free is his own problem.

[MechAg94]

Screw it; just use normal air.  Get it up to, say, 50 atmospheres, hold for an hour then pop the latch.  What happens to him after you set him free is his own problem.

Why don't you just use pure oxygen and add a spark?

Lots of ways to die.  Just brainstorming on less expensive, painless methods.

[lupinus]

I'm fine with the death penalty. In fact I'd actually argue it is not used enough, for enough crimes,  and quickly enough once the sentence is handed down.

On the flip side beyond a reasonable doubt is not a high enough standard. There needs to be guilt with no doubt. For a variety of crimes, when convicted and with no doubt of guilt, then the sentence is fine and should be carried out as quickly as possible.

I say this because death is, well, pretty final. At least with another sentence you can be released with a big fat sorry about that check.

[Perd Hapley]

You can go on about old methods of execution all you like, but they've already been ruled out.  

A lot of things have been ruled out, only to be ruled in.

I don't give a flip which method of execution is used, ancient or modern, so long as it's reasonably fast, inexpensive, not gratuitously painful or cruel, and not overly messy.

We know beyond a reasonable doubt that our legal system is not impartial nor just.

Obviously. A just legal system would execute duly-convicted murderers within a reasonable time frame.

[KD5NRH]

I say this because death is, well, pretty final. At least with another sentence you can be released with a big fat sorry about that check.

It would have to be one hell of a check; after 10-20 years in prison, pretty much everything you had before is going to be gone, including plenty of the people you knew.  Unless you have a close relative who's willing to store everything, make sure property taxes get paid, etc. you're pretty much going to be out on the street with nothing but that check.  Honestly, I'd rather be executed, even if the verdict was wrong.  At least then I can face a Judge who has all the facts.

[Firethorn]

I don't give a flip which method of execution is used, ancient or modern, so long as it's reasonably fast, inexpensive, not gratuitously painful or cruel, and not overly messy.

Surprisingly close to my stance on the topic.  Oh yeah, and it can't squick out the observers too much. 

Hanging - tricky to do without being cruel or messy.  Long drop was known to pop heads off, for example.  Especially as the average weight increases...
Beheading - messy. 
Shooting - tricky, potentially cruel, and messy, as to NOT be cruel with it you need to shoot them in the head, and for some reason we want them to be able to have an open casket funeral.
Bolt gun(captive bolt pistol) - too personal for legislatures, I think.  As I understand it bleeding tends to be minimal because it's NOT going completely  through the head.
Electric chair - Cruel, not reliable
Lethal injection - proving to be cruel and not reliable, hard to source supplies and skills.
Normal gas chambers - cruel, can be expensive and hazardous.

etc...

It would have to be one hell of a check

I've seen figures of $20-30k/year of imprisonment.  So 20 years would be $400k on the low end.