Are you off the grid? L.A. would prefer that you be off your land.

[Doggy Daddy]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yw3RiMdS7sE

The Antelope Valley is a vast patch of desert on the outskirts of Los Angeles County, and a segment of the few rugged individualists who live out there increasingly are finding themselves the targets of armed raids from local code enforcement agents, who've assembled into task forces called Nuisance Abatement Teams (NATs).

This concerns me.  Is it a localized problem of "somebody" wanting someone else's land and using the gov to get at it?  Or is it an attempt to "round up" those people that the gov is worried about being out of their control.  Or, could it just be an honest, innocent attempt by the gov to provide and serve as they are supposed to by making sure that people who live in the middle of nowhere don't offend their neighbors?

DD

[Hawkmoon]

Didn't we do Antelope Valley a couple of months ago? Or did I see it on another forum?

Found it: http://www.armedpolitesociety.com/index.php?topic=30285.0

[Doggy Daddy]

Did we? 

DD

[MrsSmith]

I'm really starting to think this type of thing is just the .gov's way of "desensitizing" us to their abuses of power. At some point a few months down the road after weekly raids of various entities (cheese farm, Gibson, this valley, etc.) appearing in the news, the general population will come to accept these events as a fact of life. Paving the way for even greater abuses.

Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get me.

[AZRedhawk44]

We face something similar here in AZ, and as my solar-electric project in my home grows, I will probably face it as well.

We have a law that dictates that your home can be condemned if it doesn't have an arbitrary amount of electricity available to it.  That amount is equal to the consumption of a refrigerator and an air conditioning unit to keep the temp below a particular temperature.  I forget the temp, I think it's around 90 degrees.

I have a small solar rig right now.  It generates about 4 amps through the day, 0 at night.  I currently use a little bit more than that in my typical daily work, working from home.  Once I get it up to 8-10 amps, I will install a dedicated circuit in the 3 bedrooms, including my home office.  I will then replicate that array on the other side of the house for another 10 amps, and it will run my fridge and living room's entertainment system. 

The point at which I anticipate potential problems, is when I have another 10-15 amp array and I hire an electrician to install a make/break/make switch on my house mains for the remaining circuitry.

At that point, I'll be calling the power company and disconnecting my house from the grid for the winter.  I'll only need city power in the summer to run the AC.

SRP and APS have in the past launched investigations against suburban solar installations where the homeowner goes off grid.

[Jamisjockey]

We face something similar here in AZ, and as my solar-electric project in my home grows, I will probably face it as well.

We have a law that dictates that your home can be condemned if it doesn't have an arbitrary amount of electricity available to it.  That amount is equal to the consumption of a refrigerator and an air conditioning unit to keep the temp below a particular temperature.  I forget the temp, I think it's around 90 degrees.

I have a small solar rig right now.  It generates about 4 amps through the day, 0 at night.  I currently use a little bit more than that in my typical daily work, working from home.  Once I get it up to 8-10 amps, I will install a dedicated circuit in the 3 bedrooms, including my home office.  I will then replicate that array on the other side of the house for another 10 amps, and it will run my fridge and living room's entertainment system. 

The point at which I anticipate potential problems, is when I have another 10-15 amp array and I hire an electrician to install a make/break/make switch on my house mains for the remaining circuitry.

At that point, I'll be calling the power company and disconnecting my house from the grid for the winter.  I'll only need city power in the summer to run the AC.

SRP and APS have in the past launched investigations against suburban solar installations where the homeowner goes off grid.

Why draw attention to yourself?  Just knowing that if the power becomes unstable or goes out, you can run what you need to, seems like a winner to me. 

[CNYCacher]

Yeah I don't understand why you would call to have the house disconnected.  Why not just switch it off and not use it?

[AZRedhawk44]

Yeah I don't understand why you would call to have the house disconnected.  Why not just switch it off and not use it?

Because the taxes and default fees on a home electric account are about $50 a month, even if your meter isn't spinning at all.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

Because the taxes and default fees on a home electric account are about $50 a month, even if your meter isn't spinning at all.

that sucks. i had seperate service run to a garage and was paying 15 a month average

[Doggy Daddy]

Because the taxes and default fees on a home electric account are about $50 a month, even if your meter isn't spinning at all.

And now we're getting to the crux of what's pissing off the gov when people are off grid.  Taxes and fees.

DD

[CNYCacher]

Because the taxes and default fees on a home electric account are about $50 a month, even if your meter isn't spinning at all.

This I did not know.  Not like that around here, your bill is zero if your usage is zero.  I'm sure there are taxes and fees but they must be on a percentage basis.

[AZRedhawk44]

that sucks. i had sepeeate service run to a garage and was paying 15 a month average

Just grabbed my July SRP electric bill.

(Remember, this is AZ and my AC is fighting a summertime average 94.7 degree ambient temp including daytime and nighttime... kind of like those starships in Niven's "Mote in God's Eye" that fly into the burning nebula )

Monthly service charge: $15
On-peak energy charge: $175.52  (On-peak is a higher rate to discourage home high energy use when businesses are in peak production as well... I work from home so I have a high on-peak rate... but I also don't use a lot of gasoline commuting)
Off-peak energy charge: $123.55 (Lower rate per kW/H)
Mesa City Tax: $5.49
County and State Tax: $22.93.

That's $43.42 in taxes and service fees.  Aside from the $300 in actual electric charges.  

My July bill was $331.31 and the taxes/fees were $15/$5.31/$22.18 for a total of $42.49.

My June bill was $176.90 and the taxes/fees were $15/$2.84/$11.84 for a total of $29.68.

My smallest electric bills are in April or November, typically around $90.  The taxes/fees come out to $15/$1.52/$6.35 for a total of $22.87.

Looks like it averages around $33 a month, for a total of about $400 a year in taxes/fees.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

they screw you one way or another.  we have "personal property tax" here.  its special

[Scout26]

Check to see that the taxes are based on consumption, not just simply being "hooked up'.  It looks like it's just $15 a month to be connected.  And don't they have to buy any excess power you create.  You could end up with them owing your each month.  But they may have ended that requirement. 

[AZRedhawk44]

Check to see that the taxes are based on consumption, not just simply being "hooked up'.  It looks like it's just $15 a month to be connected.  And don't they have to buy any excess power you create.  You could end up with them owing your each month.  But they may have ended that requirement. 

They pay you a fraction of what your generated power is worth.  Whatever you generate by day, they still charge you twice what they pay you for your production, when you consume it at night.

And pumping your amps into the city grid still results in you being "down" when the city grid is down.  I'm going hybrid split electric systems (dedicated solar circuit(s) and dedicated city circuits) until I have enough generating power to go with a make/break/make switch on my house mains.

[never_retreat]

Because the taxes and default fees on a home electric account are about $50 a month, even if your meter isn't spinning at all.

Holly crap, We had a house we were trying to unload from a dead relative and it had a 10 dollar bill per month. I realized there was a dusk to dawn light that was on at night. After I killed the breaker for that it went to 7 bucks.

[zxcvbob]

Choosing my words carefully here. 
Seems to me like the county has declared war on these people.  A guerrilla response might be appropriate.  (Look up asymmetrical warfare.)

[AZRedhawk44]

Choosing my words carefully here. 
Seems to me like the county has declared war on these people.  A guerrilla response might be appropriate.  (Look up asymmetrical warfare.)

Against the power company?  Or the county tax enforcers?  Or the council that put the tax policy in effect?

[zxcvbob]

Against the power company?  Or the county tax enforcers?  Or the council that put the tax policy in effect?

I can't comment further on a public forum.  But probably not the power company.  (this looks more like a land grab to me)