Parents, School Tangle Over Boy's Long Locks

[280plus]

Just for the record, I find the wide differences on this subject pretty interesting. I hope we can keep it civil because it appears to be a much hotter topic than I first thought it would be. 

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

we need pics/video of the parents espousing their views

[Perd Hapley]

Furthermore the rule is stupid.  My public (went to public and private) schools never had any type of hair code.  I was never thinking "oh my God, if this guy in front of me didn't have a mohawk I totally would have aced that test".  These rules are stupid, and make controversy out of nothing.

And the only thing stupider than the rule is the way these parents choose to fight it.  There are good ways to get the rules changed.  And there are stupid ways.

How does one "demonstrate" membership in a particular religion?  Star of David embroidered on clothes?  Sikh decoder ring?

Do you really want the schools determining whether someone is faithful enough to their religion to be permitted to exercise it?  Little Timmy's just going to have to eat tacos on Friday: he can't be Catholic anymore because his parents had an Obama/Biden sign in their yard last year.  Levi must participate in the pep rally crawfish boil because his mother was seen wearing pants.

Slow down a minute.  All I'm saying is that religiously-based exemptions to policy aren't usually something you just grant yourself on any particular issue.  That would be too easy to abuse.  From what I understand, it usually takes actual membership in a known religious group with particular beliefs.  I guess you could imagine scenarios in which that could be abused.  It just wouldn't be so pertinent to the issue at hand. 

[Perd Hapley]

we need pics/video of the parents espousing their views

Please, no. 

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

aw come on  its like a video train wreck  horrific  but you have to watch   how can i truly assess the level of stupidity without video

[HankB]

Looking at the picture, I personally think the kid ought to have a haircut.

I also think it is NOT within the purview of a PUBLIC school bureaucrat to punish the kid if he doesn't. (BTW, what kind of nonsense is the "in school suspension" the article mentions? Kid is supposed to come in so the school gets its funding, but he can't go to class? Bovine excrement. When I was a kid, suspension meant you were OUT for a while.)

The principal ought to be made to personally pay the kid's legal fees, as well as cover the cost of tutoring for the classes the kid missed.

[roo_ster]

Sorta like the drama queen parents who teach their kids to play sports, hold any particular religious beliefs, etc.

Sorry, that's a big ol' fail in the analogy department.

Once again, as long as it's publicly funded they shouldn't have rules that are based off of cultural preferences.

Like wrote, welcome to federalism.  I bet other ISDs do it differently.

Sounds like you want one standard imposed from above that conforms to your preferences.  I think locals who pay taxes can use the ballot to determine how those tax dollars are spent without someone from outside the community(1) imposing their cultural preferences on the entire community.

Not quite sure where you get the "If gov't does it, there can be no standards," idea.

aw come on  its like a video train wreck  horrific  but you have to watch   how can i truly assess the level of stupidity without video

This.  I want the stoopid cold & unfiltered by mere text and journalistic interlopers.







(1) Or outside the community's cultural preferences

[Perd Hapley]

The link in the OP has video of the parents sounding stupid.  And looking stupid!!   

I also think it is NOT within the purview of a PUBLIC school bureaucrat to punish the kid if he doesn't. (BTW, what kind of nonsense is the "in school suspension" the article mentions? Kid is supposed to come in so the school gets its funding, but he can't go to class? Bovine excrement. When I was a kid, suspension meant you were OUT for a while.)

The principal ought to be made to personally pay the kid's legal fees, as well as cover the cost of tutoring for the classes the kid missed.

So you think the principal made the rules? 

In-school suspension has been around for a while now.  It means the kid keeps going to school and learning, just not in his usual class. 

[KD5NRH]

From what I understand, it usually takes actual membership in a known religious group with particular beliefs.

What religions (other than creepy cults) offer memberships in any form that can be verified by outsiders?  Do you get discounts at Denny's when you show the card like AARP?

[sumpnz]

What religions (other than creepy cults) offer memberships in any form that can be verified by outsiders? 

The majority of churches that I've attended over the years, and none would be considered cults expcept by the most ridiculously militant athiests, have had a formal process to become a member of that particular church.  Usually 1-3 days of meeting for a couple hours at a time to go over denominational doctrine (or that church's if not affiliated with a denomination), organizational structures, and whatever that church expects of members.  Some will issue a certificate of membership, but whether they do or not you can easilly contact the office to confirm membership if you care to do so.

[Perd Hapley]

What religions (other than creepy cults) offer memberships in any form that can be verified by outsiders?  Do you get discounts at Denny's when you show the card like AARP?

What are you talking about?  I've never had to seek a religious exemption from any policy, so I don't know what the usual procedure is.  Go check with your lawyer. 

I would imagine they just talk to the parents, but that doesn't apply to this case. 

[Balog]

Are the parents claiming a religious exemption from policy? If not, why are we arguing over how those are granted? 

[Perd Hapley]

Right here.

I can't even a imagine a public school having a policy on cutting hair. That's practically a body modification. There are multiple religions that prohibit hair-cutting. Unfortunately this boy probably doesn't belong to one of them so he doesn't get the special privileges. He's probably just a normal WASP kid with no special victimization capital.

 I replied to this comment, and somebody took it as a call for a new inquisition or something.  Maybe that person should take his questions to another thread. 

[MicroBalrog]

I'd think you're missing zach's point - which is that if you get a religious exemption from something, it should be voluntary altogether.

[KD5NRH]

Some will issue a certificate of membership, but whether they do or not you can easilly contact the office to confirm membership if you care to do so.

Somehow I doubt they'll be very forthcoming if a stranger calls up to ask if so-and-so is a member.  I suspect they'll be documenting heavily and calling their lawyer if businesses or schools start calling to check membership.  (especially if they know that said businesses or government agencies are already discriminating against said member)

And for that matter, how do you prove a religion if you live several hours from the nearest "official" church, and thus don't maintain a membership?  Is there an official Registry of Displaced Buddhists, for example?

Are the parents claiming a religious exemption from policy?

Not stated in the article, but why does the kid want to give his hair to (presumably) Locks of Love?  Is it because he thinks it is the Christian (or Buddhist, or whatever) thing to do?

[roo_ster]

Not stated in the article, but why does the kid parents want to give his hair to (presumably) Locks of Love?  Is it because he thinks it is the Christian (or Buddhist, or whatever) thing to do? his parents are attention whores and the idea of sending the moppet up in a weather balloon & calling the press has already been taken?

That ^^ is uncharitable of me, but unfortunately the likeliest scenario.

[280plus]

YEs, they do give the appearance of grabbing at straws with that one.

[jackdanson]

Bad parents, stupid school. Everyone's a loser here imho.

Yeppers.

we need pics/video of the parents espousing their views

Just so folks know, there IS a video on the link.  Parents are iffy at best.  I still don't care if the kid has long hair though.

[Perd Hapley]

Somehow I doubt they'll be very forthcoming if a stranger calls up to ask if so-and-so is a member.  I suspect they'll be documenting heavily and calling their lawyer if businesses or schools start calling to check membership.  (especially if they know that said businesses or government agencies are already discriminating against said member)

And for that matter, how do you prove a religion if you live several hours from the nearest "official" church, and thus don't maintain a membership?  Is there an official Registry of Displaced Buddhists, for example?

[Pulls out hair.]

I can't believe you're still going on about this.  People DO get religious exemptions for various things.  Conscientious objectors, for example.  No one is proposing anything new. 

Below are a few links that may give you some idea of how public schools handle such things.  I offer no commentary on how well they work, just sayin' that seems to be the way things operate. 

http://www.vahomeschoolers.org/guide/religious_exemption.asp
http://www.know-vaccines.org/exemptionFAQ.html
http://www.emsc.nysed.gov/sss/schoolhealth/schoolhealthservices/modelproceduresforschoolsmarch10.pdf

[KD5NRH]

I can't believe you're still going on about this.  People DO get religious exemptions for various things.

The problem comes in how they decide who gets the exemption; unless there's a legitimate health or safety issue, there is no reason to require anything more than the parents' confirmation of their obvious belief that long hair is not a bad thing in God's (or whoever's) eyes.

http://www.know-vaccines.org/exemptionFAQ.html

Looks like Florida is the only one that doesn't insist on getting information they have no business having: "The statutory language for Florida vaccine policy clearly states that religious exemption must be granted without question if vaccination conflicts with a person's religious convictions.  A religious objection may be expressly implied by religious denomination or it may be based on an individual's own moral/spiritual conscience to live God's Word.  Agents acting on behalf of the state in vaccination matters are prohibited from requesting ANY administrative proof that explains the recipient's religious belief or that proves membership in an "acceptable" or specific religion.  The state may NOT discriminate between religious denominations and may NOT make judgments regarding religious convictions."

[Perd Hapley]

If you want to shrink the pool of things for which kids need an exemption, then you just change the rules to allow long hair and what-not.  And hey, maybe they should.  What will absolutely NOT work is for any and every school policy to be easily overturned by some parent falsely claiming an unverifiable religious conviction. That wouldn't be a religious exemption policy so much as a pick-and-choose-which-rules-you-like policy. 

there is no reason to require anything more than the parents' confirmation of their obvious belief that long hair is not a bad thing in God's (or whoever's) eyes.

They should at least have to say that their beliefs not only permit long hair, but require it. 

Looks like Florida is the only one that doesn't insist on getting information they have no business having:

Uh, so the Long-Braided-Hair Sect wants their kids to look different from everybody else, but they don't want anyone to know they're in the LBHS?  That would be odd.  Which brings us back to this:

Somehow I doubt they'll be very forthcoming if a stranger calls up to ask if so-and-so is a member.  I suspect they'll be documenting heavily and calling their lawyer if businesses or schools start calling to check membership.  (especially if they know that said businesses or government agencies are already discriminating against said member).

There's no reason for the school to call, unless they actually intend to work with the family, and accommodate their beliefs.  They wouldn't be ratting out their members, they'd be sticking up for their religious convictions.

It's not always Waco out there. 

[BlueStarLizzard]

Looking at the picture, I personally think the kid ought to have a haircut.

I also think it is NOT within the purview of a PUBLIC school bureaucrat to punish the kid if he doesn't. (BTW, what kind of nonsense is the "in school suspension" the article mentions? Kid is supposed to come in so the school gets its funding, but he can't go to class? Bovine excrement. When I was a kid, suspension meant you were OUT for a while.)

The principal ought to be made to personally pay the kid's legal fees, as well as cover the cost of tutoring for the classes the kid missed.

well... i for, one, preferred suspension over in school suspension. hell, it was even better then school. no getting up for the bus.  i wasn't the only one.

[RocketMan]

I haven't read the story or viewed the videos.  Why do I already have the notion that silliness abounds on both sides?

[Hawkmoon]

Oh, I am sure that the school board has plenty of reasons, some of which might even make sense. 

Nah. Having dealt with a few school boards over the years, I have to say that is EXTREMELY unlikely.

Aside from which, the policy is clearly illegal:

According to the district dress code, boys' hair must be kept out of the eyes and cannot extend below the bottom of earlobes or over the collar of a dress shirt.

Can we spell "gender discrimination," students? Of course we can: G-E-N-D-E-R D-I-S-C-R-I-M-I-N-A-T-I-O-N.

[Perd Hapley]

Aside from which, the policy is clearly illegal:
Can we spell "gender discrimination," students? Of course we can: G-E-N-D-E-R D-I-S-C-R-I-M-I-N-A-T-I-O-N.

Are boys allowed to wear dresses to public school in your area?