One Home Search Away From Being Adam Lanza

[Strings]

There's been a LOT of misinformation and contradictory facts out on this one.

Although I am VERY intrigued by the idea of a 12ga shotgun, feeding from a 35 rd mag, that will fit in a glove box. Where can I get me one of THOSE?

[Tallpine]

massive spreadsheet Lanza reportedly compiled containing extensive research on previous mass murders

No honest man needs more than ten rows and columns  

There's been a LOT of misinformation and contradictory facts out on this one.

Although I am VERY intrigued by the idea of a 12ga shotgun, feeding from a 35 rd mag, that will fit in a glove box. Where can I get me one of THOSE?

I want to know where I can get a Tardis glove box 

[dogmush]

Not necessarily currently, formerly; it was once the great white hope of government handgun calibers, as we all know.  I'll leave the SIG/Glock issuance matter to those on the board with specific expertise in that, but those are certainly the current handguns of choice for gov't agencies.  As for the 10mm caliber, whether Glock 20 or 29, it is not a typical self-defense purchase, not exactly a popular item with female shooters.  Perhaps you'd concede that much?  That said, I am merely suggesting that something about the "discovery" in this case seems lacking.  We still know very little about Adam's parents, much less than you would expect at this point. 

That I'll concede, but given the evidence  already that she provided firearms for her son, I think it's orders of magnatude more likely that Adam picked out the firearms based on internet gun boards and video games.

You may be suggesting NOW that discovery is lacking. IDK.  I don't know any more or less about Mrs. Lanza then any of the other victoms.  Seems like the media never really cares about them.  However your first post suggested that a 226, a G20/29 and a Bushmaster were weapons a .gov agency would issue.  They are, IMO, not. 

[RoadKingLarry]

If an arsenal is only a few firearms I shudder to think what the idiots in the press would make of my meager collection and woefully under-stocked ammo supply.
List of things I want to buy- my wish lists on MidwayUSA, Brownells, Midsouth and assorted other websites would probably make some of those nancy boy news "reporters" wet their pants, again.

[kgbsquirrel]

I'm trying to figure out how big a 35 rd 12ga mag would be.

Bigger than any made. It was a Saiga-12, and the (very pricey) 30 rounders are freaking huge. I had one a while back with a pro-mag 12 round drum. The drum was about the size of a large grape-fruit. The 20 round drum had the diameter of a cantelope. And those really expensive and fragile 30 rounders seem about the diameter of a basketball. As far as I know nothing larger than 30 rounds is made.

[Hutch]

IMHO, most, almost all, reporters who breathlessly describe technical details about firearms are monumentally ignorant.  The reports are unleavened by fact.  Most of these reporters wear their ignorance like a badge of honor in the service The Greater Good of Gun Control.  Actually, like KNOWING something about the tawdry details (magazine vs. clip, bullet vs. cartridge, semiautomatic vs. automatic, revolver vs. pistol, et endless cetera) might weaken their faith in The Cause.  This knowledge is to be avoided.

[mtnbkr]

Not necessarily currently, formerly; it was once the great white hope of government handgun calibers, as we all know.

So was the 38S&W at one point in history.  What's your point?

I'll leave the SIG/Glock issuance matter to those on the board with specific expertise in that, but those are certainly the current handguns of choice for gov't agencies.

As well as multitudes of gun fanbois (and girls).

As for the 10mm caliber, whether Glock 20 or 29, it is not a typical self-defense purchase, not exactly a popular item with female shooters.

So what's your point?  Not all guns are purchased for "self defense" and not all women shooters are "typical" or bothered by recoil.  I know one female shooter (friend, hunting partner, and former coworker) who owns multiple Glocks, H&Ks, 1911s, and magnum revolvers.  She doesn't have a 10mm to my knowledge, but she does own a 45-70 guide gun and a 375H&H (and a 270, and a 308, and a 30-06, and an AR).  I suspect she's not the only female with a nice collection of atypical firearms (for the delicate females of the nation)

So, again, what is your point?

Chris

[Jocassee]

So was the 38S&W at one point in history.  What's your point?
As well as multitudes of gun fanbois (and girls).
So what's your point?  Not all guns are purchased for "self defense" and not all women shooters are "typical" or bothered by recoil.  I know one female shooter (friend, hunting partner, and former coworker) who owns multiple Glocks, H&Ks, 1911s, and magnum revolvers.  She doesn't have a 10mm to my knowledge, but she does own a 45-70 guide gun and a 375H&H (and a 270, and a 308, and a 30-06, and an AR).  I suspect she's not the only female with a nice collection of atypical firearms (for the delicate females of the nation)

So, again, what is your point?

Chris

Its a data point. It may mean nothing by itself. But its worth making note of.

[makattak]

There's been a LOT of misinformation and contradictory facts out on this one.

Although I am VERY intrigued by the idea of a 12ga shotgun, feeding from a 35 rd mag, that will fit in a glove box. Where can I get me one of THOSE?

My bet is he had a shotgun and several boxes of shells, probably in the trunk (from which, I believe, there is video of the police removing a shotgun), which the idiot reporter translated into "70 rounds in a magazine and a shotgun in the GLOVE COMPARTMENT!"

[Tallpine]

IMHO, most, almost all, reporters who breathlessly describe technical details about firearms are monumentally ignorant.  ...

Fixed 

[longeyes]

So was the 38S&W at one point in history.  What's your point?
As well as multitudes of gun fanbois (and girls).
So what's your point?  Not all guns are purchased for "self defense" and not all women shooters are "typical" or bothered by recoil.  I know one female shooter (friend, hunting partner, and former coworker) who owns multiple Glocks, H&Ks, 1911s, and magnum revolvers.  She doesn't have a 10mm to my knowledge, but she does own a 45-70 guide gun and a 375H&H (and a 270, and a 308, and a 30-06, and an AR).  I suspect she's not the only female with a nice collection of atypical firearms (for the delicate females of the nation)

So, again, what is your point?

Chris

My point was what I said.  There are "odd" things about this case that beg for more scrutiny.  I stand by the fact that to me the choice of weapons implies possible government-issue.  Notice I said "possible."  By the way, what do we know about where and when and by whom those firearms were purchased?  Anything?  Strange that all this is just brushed over given how "big" this case has been made.

I don't need to tell you that anecdotal evidence does not prove your point.  Of course there are exceptions, but if you are trying to suggest I am anti-feminist by saying that few women opt for 10mm handguns, that's silly.  Maybe there are sales figures by gender that can settle it?  I am only trying to indicate that when things are unusual they require more investigation than we have so far seen.

[mtnbkr]

Its a data point. It may mean nothing by itself. But its worth making note of.

No different than the data point posted by longeyes except mine doesn't include conspiracy theories.

My point was what I said.  There are "odd" things about this case that beg for more scrutiny.  I stand by the fact that to me the choice of weapons implies possible government-issue.  Notice I said "possible."  By the way, what do we know about where and when and by whom those firearms were purchased?  Anything?  Strange that all this is just brushed over given how "big" this case has been made.

What difference does her choice of guns make outside the feverish conspiracy theories of your mind?  If you were to visit the NRA HQ range in Fairfax, VA on any busy night, you'd see a similar collection of guns on just about every lane.  The 10mm is a bit odd, but not so much to cause concern.  Then again, not many guys have the 10mm either, it's kind of an obscure caliber these days.  So are the 32-20 and 32swl, both of which combined constitute roughly 1/4th of my handgun collection.

I don't need to tell you that anecdotal evidence does not prove your point. 

:rolleyes:
I matched your one data point with one of my own and *mine* isn't sufficient?

Of course there are exceptions, but if you are trying to suggest I am anti-feminist by saying that few women opt for 10mm handguns, that's silly. 

I didn't make any such suggestions.  Not many guys shoot the 10mm either, what does that say?  Maybe that it's an enthusiast chambering these days?  Of all the shooters I know, folks who shoot everything from 22lr up to the big Linebaugh calibers and the 500Mag, only one has owned a 10mm.  Nah, it's an obvious govt conspiracy!!eleventy!! 

Maybe there are sales figures by gender that can settle it?  I am only trying to indicate that when things are unusual they require more investigation than we have so far seen.

Except there's nothing truly unusual about her selection of guns.  How many times do we insist others not read motive into our own gun purchases? 

Wait!

I get it now.

The 10mm was defacto proof of govt action in Enemies Foreign & Domestic.  That's where you got it from.  Because it was in a work of fiction, it MUST mean something in real life. 

Chris

[Jocassee]

Wait!

I get it now.

The 10mm was defacto proof of govt action in Enemies Foreign & Domestic.  That's where you got it from.  Because it was in a work of fiction, it MUST mean something in real life.  

Chris

If i were going to *expletive deleted* with the threeper crowd, and let them know they were being *expletive deleted*ed with, thats how i would do it. As i said, by itself it means nothing. But if, other, blatantly obvious continuity problems show up, it still wouldnt be proof, but it might give you an idea where to look for it.

[longeyes]

No different than the data point posted by longeyes except mine doesn't include conspiracy theories.
What difference does her choice of guns make outside the feverish conspiracy theories of your mind?  If you were to visit the NRA HQ range in Fairfax, VA on any busy night, you'd see a similar collection of guns on just about every lane.  The 10mm is a bit odd, but not so much to cause concern.  Then again, not many guys have the 10mm either, it's kind of an obscure caliber these days.  So are the 32-20 and 32swl, both of which combined constitute roughly 1/4th of my handgun collection.
:rolleyes:
I matched your one data point with one of my own and *mine* isn't sufficient?
I didn't make any such suggestions.  Not many guys shoot the 10mm either, what does that say?  Maybe that it's an enthusiast chambering these days?  Of all the shooters I know, folks who shoot everything from 22lr up to the big Linebaugh calibers and the 500Mag, only one has owned a 10mm.  Nah, it's an obvious govt conspiracy!!eleventy!! 
Except there's nothing truly unusual about her selection of guns.  How many times do we insist others not read motive into our own gun purchases? 

Wait!

I get it now.

The 10mm was defacto proof of govt action in Enemies Foreign & Domestic.  That's where you got it from.  Because it was in a work of fiction, it MUST mean something in real life. 

Chris

You obviously don't get it.  Fine.  What I said was that few females opted for 10mm and you countered with an anecdote about some woman you know who has one.  So...?  That does not address my point, which was the rarity, sir, the rarity. 

I proffered no conspiracy theories, just a suggestion that we all lacked information you would think we might have by now, including some that really does not require deep probing.  I found that curious.  But here, once again, come the personal slurs from the gun-wise peanut gallery.  I assume you are implying, not for the first time, that you are a pillar of sanity astride your mountain bike and I am way on the "feverish" lunatic fringe.  You don't know how pompous you sound, man.  Sit high and enjoy the view from your pinnacle as an APS poobah. 

And for the poster above who suggested the the SIG 226 and 228 are not both gov't-issued, you're wrong. 

[dogmush]

And for the poster above who suggested the the SIG 226 and 228 are not both gov't-issued, you're wrong. 

Actually what I said was:

And other then NAVSPECWAR, who issues a Sig 226?

And the answer, apparantly, is the FBI in a limited capacity, and less then 10 city police departments.  And 2 of those drop off if I limit it to 9mm.  So it doesn't exactly scream "Revenuer!"

I put forward an alternate theory to explain the choice of weapons, I still think it's orders of magnitude more likely that Adam picked the guns and his mother bought them.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

gotta go with a quality info source
http://www.infowars.com/cover-up-of-adam-lanza-link-to-psychotropic-drugs/

[JN01]

I've read some reports on his "frightening arsenal" that included 1600 rounds of ammo (what, like 3 bricks of .22s?), a .323 (?) bolt action rifle, a Savage .22 rifle, and (Horror of Horrors!) a BB gun and a STARTER PISTOL 

[mtnbkr]

You obviously don't get it.  Fine.  What I said was that few females opted for 10mm and you countered with an anecdote about some woman you know who has one.  So...?  That does not address my point, which was the rarity, sir, the rarity. 

Actually I get it just fine, you're looking for meaning where none exists.  I didn't say my friend has one, but pointed her out as a female who had multiple guns not usually owned by women (large caliber handguns, magnum rifles, etc).  My point being that you can't read much into a gun collection.  How many folks on this board own guns that are used by govt and militaries past and present?

Actually, what you said was:

You find what you want to find.  A lot of the Lanza case remains oddly opaque.  To this day.  How little we know of the life of Nancy Lanza, for example.  Personally, I find her selection of firearms curious...unless they were, let's say, government-issue... 

That's not quite the same as commenting on their rarity in the ranks of female shooters, which itself is a nonsensical statement since the 10mm is fairly rare amongst male shooters as well.  For all intents and purposes, the 10mm is a dead caliber, the 41mag of semiautos (wait, some folks own the 41mag, maybe those are govt plants as well).

I proffered no conspiracy theories, just a suggestion that we all lacked information you would think we might have by now, including some that really does not require deep probing.  I found that curious. 

Of course you didn't, you never post anything specific, just vague accusations pointing to grand conspiracies.

Since she is dead, you'll never know what motivated her to buy those guns.  The selection, other than possibly the 10mm, is not at all odd for a female shooter.  The 10mm is a bit outside the norm for any shooter, but still mainstream enough to be easily found at any stocking Glock dealer, so it's not exactly indicative of anything beyond her desire to own one.

But here, once again, come the personal slurs from the gun-wise peanut gallery.  I assume you are implying, not for the first time, that you are a pillar of sanity astride your mountain bike and I am way on the "feverish" lunatic fringe.  You don't know how pompous you sound, man.  Sit high and enjoy the view from your pinnacle as an APS poobah. 

You have a mighty thin skin, though I do strike a fine figure astride my mountain bike. :D

Though, I didn't realize I had been elevated to the level of "grand poobah".


Chris

[dogmush]

That's not quite the same as commenting on their rarity in the ranks of female shooters, which itself is a nonsensical statement since the 10mm is fairly rare amongst male shooters as well.  For all intents and purposes, the 10mm is a dead caliber, the 41mag of semiautos (wait, some folks own the 41mag, maybe those are govt plants as well).

I have a .41 mag.

and am building a 10mm.  Wait, how is that going to look in the press. "combat handgun home modified to be more powerful and carry more rounds...."

uh.............nevermind.  I don't have either. 

[Ron]

I used to shoot with a guy that had a 10mm 1911 (not his regular shooter).

He brought it to one of our low light/flashlight shoots.

The flash from that thing in an indoor range with the lights out was impressive!

[Ben]

I have a couple of Delta Elites. I bought them when the Jeff Cooper 10MM love was in full swing. I really don't pay attention to where 10MMs are now in popularity, other than being glad I reload it, because factory ammo isn't that available or cheap. There was a time though, when they were the "in" thing, and I really like the cartridge. If I ever get around to taking one of my Delta's to the gunsmith for an ambi safety, I would be quite happy to CCW the thing. With true standard 10MM loads, they make a fine semi-auto alternative for personal defense in areas where people are not your only concern.

Don't know why the Lanzas had a 10MM, but there are many reasons a person might want to own and shoot one.

[Gewehr98]

I have one of those dangerous-and abhorrent-to-women stainless Colt Delta Elites.

Wife #1 absolutely loved to shoot it.  Wife #2, not so much.

Maybe anecdotal, maybe data.  Who knows? 

If I get to Wife #3 someday, I'll see if there's a conspiracy afoot...   

[longeyes]

When you get to wife #3 you can call it a quorum, not a conspiracy.

It's too bad we have to eat our own, even here.   This forum supposedly bars personal attacks, so you would think that those charged with maintaining order would follow that dictum most scrupulously.   You'd think; you'd be wrong.

A lot about Newtown just doesn't wash, and my view is just that we need to find out why, especially given that this is the straw that is meant to break our backs.   The bogie of "conspiracy theories" is overdone, but why noodle about semantics.  The point is that there are people who will lie, cheat, steal, and murder to further their agenda.  Whether they do this in formal conspiracies, shared agendas, or just as swimmers in the same cultural stream doesn't matter as much as what is being done and why and to whom for what purpose.  There is a lot we don't know, can't know, will never probably know, but we should try to discern its outlines, if only by circumstantial evidence, as well as we can--for our own self-protection.

[dogmush]

A lot about Newtown just doesn't wash, and my view is just that we need to find out why, especially given that this is the straw that is meant to break our backs.   The bogie of "conspiracy theories" is overdone, but why noodle about semantics.  The point is that there are people who will lie, cheat, steal, and murder to further their agenda.  Whether they do this in formal conspiracies, shared agendas, or just as swimmers in the same cultural stream doesn't matter as much as what is being done and why and to whom for what purpose.  There is a lot we don't know, can't know, will never probably know, but we should try to discern its outlines, if only by circumstantial evidence, as well as we can--for our own self-protection.

Yeah.....uh.... I disagree.

Adam Lanza was a crazy little *expletive deleted*it who's mom catered to his whims, from not socializing him to buying him weapons, until such time as he was so fully crazy as to not be easily stopped.  Then he went on a spree to make as big a name for himself and punish his mother's (percieved) betrayal.  And sadly he succeeded at both.

If you have any actual evidence...of anything, I'd be interested.  Barely discerned outlines need not apply.

[Scout26]

A lot about Newtown just doesn't wash, and my view is just that we need to find out why, especially given that this is the straw that is meant to break our backs.  

Because most of what we "know" comes through the filter of journalists who have no clue what they are talking about.  Not only about firearms, but police procedures and everything else they are reporting on.  Facts get reported as rumours and rumours get reported as facts.  So unless you were there at the crime scene as it was happening, we have to take what is being reported with a degree of skepticism, not as gospel truth.  And even then eyewitness only see events from their perspective, not from on high with a G-d's Eye view of the entire scene.

If you want to paint journalistic incompetence as some grand "They set this up" conspiracy, you are free to do so.  However, when others mock your theory(ies), (like we do with Troothers, Birthers, and Globular Woerming religionists), don't get your panties in a wad.