Author Topic: Vegas strip mass shooting!  (Read 56762 times)

MillCreek

  • Skippy The Wonder Dog
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 20,015
  • APS Risk Manager
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #325 on: October 08, 2017, 10:34:45 AM »
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/10/08/las-vegas-gunman-seemed-like-rational-man-steve-wynn-tells-fox-news-sunday.html

Steve Wynn also thinks Mr. Paddock was a plain vanilla gambler and hotel guest.
_____________
Regards,
MillCreek
Snohomish County, WA  USA


Quote from: Angel Eyes on August 09, 2018, 01:56:15 AM
You are one lousy risk manager.

Perd Hapley

  • Superstar of the Internet
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 61,475
  • My prepositions are on/in
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #326 on: October 08, 2017, 01:28:17 PM »
They keep talking about the murderer leading a "double life" or "secret life." Seems a little overwrought to me. He doesn't seem to have been doing anything illegal, or even sneaky, until his killing spree. He didn't talk about his apparent gun hobby, or obsession, or whatever it was, but does that mean he's "leading a double life"?

I guess we'll have to see what details emerge. If they ever do.
"Doggies are angel babies!" -- my wife

wmenorr67

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 12,775
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #327 on: October 08, 2017, 01:44:44 PM »
Lollapalooza is primarily geared towards the feminist among us.  I've worked security at a couple of them and the nutcases I saw at them was very scary.
There are five things, above all else, that make life worth living: a good relationship with God, a good woman, good health, good friends, and a good cigar.

Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you, Jesus Christ and the American Soldier.  One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.

Bacon is the candy bar of meats!

Only the dead have seen the end of war!

French G.

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 10,198
  • ohhh sparkles!
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #328 on: October 08, 2017, 02:52:49 PM »
Guess who is not staying with Steve Wynn? His comments on security are really expected and sad.
AKA Navy Joe   

I'm so contrarian that I didn't respond to the thread.

BobR

  • Just a pup compared to a few old dogs here!
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 7,303
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #329 on: October 08, 2017, 03:13:17 PM »
He really started beefing up business and personal security after his daughter was kidnapped out of her home in the early 90's so that they started this is not that big a surprise to me. I could never afford to stay at one of his properties. :(

bob

Ben

  • Administrator
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 46,198
  • I'm an Extremist!
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #330 on: October 08, 2017, 08:23:52 PM »
He didn't talk about his apparent gun hobby, or obsession, or whatever it was, but does that mean he's "leading a double life"?

I guess we'll have to see what details emerge. If they ever do.

Some of that goes back to what i said earlier about a lot of older people not having a big social media presence. They're talking about "decades" of avoiding social media, but social media wasn't around decades ago.

My avoiding social media now aside, back in the 80's, I also had no presence in any media anywhere, because there really was none. I dunno, maybe somebody archived my posts on the couple of BBSs I was on at the time. I guess they could setup an Atari emulator and dig up whatever I wrote.

While it may seem "weird" and "ominous" to a 30 year old reporter that he had no online or other digital presence, to me, it's not at all out of the ordinary.
"I'm a foolish old man that has been drawn into a wild goose chase by a harpy in trousers and a nincompoop."

lee n. field

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 13,610
  • tinpot megalomaniac, Paulbot, hardware goon
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #331 on: October 08, 2017, 08:48:21 PM »
Some of that goes back to what i said earlier about a lot of older people not having a big social media presence.

A lot of people don't.  I've been trying to track down some friends from college, since their parents seem to have retired and moved.   Whole family, zip, nada, nothing.  Not even with the g00gle.
In thy presence is fulness of joy.
At thy right hand pleasures for evermore.

T.O.M.

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 6,414
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #332 on: October 08, 2017, 10:23:18 PM »
I've had conversations like that with younger attorneys.  They can't seem to understand why I don't do SnapChat, Instagram, etc.  I have Facebook, but only because it (1) lets me communicate easily with Scout people and (2) lets me stay in touch with some high school and college friends.  No blogs.  No vlogs.  Just FB and APS.  That makes me seem weird to young lawyers (late 20s).  I think of it as OpSec.
No, I'm not mtnbkr.  ;)

a.k.a. "our resident Legal Smeagol."...thanks BryanP
"Anybody can give legal advice - but only licensed attorneys can sell it."...vaskidmark

p12

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 988
  • I SEE NOISES!!
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #333 on: October 08, 2017, 11:11:09 PM »
One question I have not seen answered was why so damn many guns in the room. It makes no sense. Ammo yes. Loaded mags yes. But that many guns not so much.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

TommyGunn

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 7,956
  • Stuck in full auto since birth.
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #334 on: October 08, 2017, 11:19:42 PM »
One question I have not seen answered was why so damn many guns in the room. It makes no sense. Ammo yes. Loaded mags yes. But that many guns not so much.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
yea....I can see two guns----use one until it gets hot, switch to #2 and let #1 cool, so forth.   But this guy was.....well, nuts.
MOLON LABE   "Through ignorance of what is good and what is bad, the life of men is greatly perplexed." ~~ Cicero

BobR

  • Just a pup compared to a few old dogs here!
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 7,303
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #335 on: October 08, 2017, 11:38:36 PM »
yea....I can see two guns----use one until it gets hot, switch to #2 and let #1 cool, so forth.   But this guy was.....well, nuts.

I can only speculate that he had tried to use a bump fire stock prior to this and found they were prone to overheating guns and leading to jamming. Instead of clearing a FTF or FTE just throw it down and pick up the next one. My 2 cents worth which on the interwebs is worth even less. ;)

bob

Firethorn

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 5,789
  • Where'd my explosive space modulator go?
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #336 on: October 09, 2017, 12:55:33 AM »
One question I have not seen answered was why so damn many guns in the room. It makes no sense. Ammo yes. Loaded mags yes. But that many guns not so much.

Don't think like a regular soldier, or even like a regular gunnie.  It seems to be a thing with spree killers that they bring lots of "extra" weapons even when it prevents them from bringing more ammunition.

I'm not trying to explain the logic behind that, just that it seems to be something spree killers do.

p12 basically has it - he was nuts.  He probably left firearms, ammunition, and such in his vehicle because he was tired of hauling stuff up.

Hawkmoon

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 27,324
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #337 on: October 09, 2017, 01:08:11 AM »
One question I have not seen answered was why so damn many guns in the room. It makes no sense. Ammo yes. Loaded mags yes. But that many guns not so much.

One 100-round mag dump will overheat a barrel pretty badly. In fact, the autopsy found that he had burns on his fingers, presumably from handling the hot barrels. A guy as detail oriented as he apparently was may well have know that, so his plan was possibly to just dump a magazine and then switch rifles rather than reloading.
- - - - - - - - - - - - -
100% Politically Incorrect by Design

freakazoid

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 6,243
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #338 on: October 09, 2017, 01:25:38 AM »
Don't think like a regular soldier, or even like a regular gunnie.  It seems to be a thing with spree killers that they bring lots of "extra" weapons even when it prevents them from bringing more ammunition.

I'm not trying to explain the logic behind that, just that it seems to be something spree killers do.

p12 basically has it - he was nuts.  He probably left firearms, ammunition, and such in his vehicle because he was tired of hauling stuff up.

Yeah. I think largely thanks to the media. Guns are the big scary thing, so bring more of those. You just need lots of guns to do a lot of damage.

One 100-round mag dump will overheat a barrel pretty badly. In fact, the autopsy found that he had burns on his fingers, presumably from handling the hot barrels. A guy as detail oriented as he apparently was may well have know that, so his plan was possibly to just dump a magazine and then switch rifles rather than reloading.

Has an autopsy report been released? And didn't the leaked picture show him wearing a glove, on the one hand you can see?

Lollapalooza is primarily geared towards the feminist among us.  I've worked security at a couple of them and the nutcases I saw at them was very scary.

I thought Lollapalooza was just a rock festival?
"so I ended up getting the above because I didn't want to make a whole production of sticking something between my knees and cranking. To me, the cranking on mine is pretty effortless, at least on the coarse setting. Maybe if someone has arthritis or something, it would be more difficult for them." - Ben

"I see a rager at least once a week." - brimic

Brad Johnson

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 18,108
  • Witty, charming, handsome, and completely insane.
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #339 on: October 09, 2017, 10:20:50 AM »
I've had conversations like that with younger attorneys.  They can't seem to understand why I don't do SnapChat, Instagram, etc.  I have Facebook, but only because it (1) lets me communicate easily with Scout people and (2) lets me stay in touch with some high school and college friends.  No blogs.  No vlogs.  Just FB and APS.  That makes me seem weird to young lawyers (late 20s).  I think of it as OpSec.

This times eleventy bajillion.

Brad
It's all about the pancakes, people.
"And he thought cops wouldn't chase... a STOLEN DONUT TRUCK???? That would be like Willie Nelson ignoring a pickup full of weed."
-HankB

Perd Hapley

  • Superstar of the Internet
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 61,475
  • My prepositions are on/in
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #340 on: October 09, 2017, 01:49:06 PM »
I think the age difference and lack of online presence, compared to so many other mass murderers recently, explains why we think it's taking so long for the information on the killer to come out. Maybe this is the just the normal time lag that we'd have, if the social medium wasn't so popular.

Are there other elderly mass murderers that we can use for comparison?
"Doggies are angel babies!" -- my wife

Chester32141

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 642
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #341 on: October 09, 2017, 02:13:31 PM »


It's not all about social media ... read thru your list of favorites ... mine is pretty revealing ... even more so would be the hard drive ... I imagine a review of his computer would answer a lot of questions ...  ???
"The best argument against democracy is a 5 minute conversation with the average voter...... "

Photos
CBs Hawg Sauce


Perd Hapley

  • Superstar of the Internet
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 61,475
  • My prepositions are on/in
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #342 on: October 09, 2017, 02:19:24 PM »

It's not all about social media ... read thru your list of favorites ... mine is pretty revealing ... even more so would be the hard drive ... I imagine a review of his computer would answer a lot of questions ...  ???


Unless he scrubbed all of that beforehand, or destroyed his computers, or was so paranoid that he didn't keep any incriminating favorites/bookmarks, and had his browser set to scrub all of the cookies, etc, every time he closed it.
"Doggies are angel babies!" -- my wife

AJ Dual

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 16,162
  • Shoe Ballistics Inc.
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #343 on: October 09, 2017, 02:51:13 PM »
One question I have not seen answered was why so damn many guns in the room. It makes no sense. Ammo yes. Loaded mags yes. But that many guns not so much.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I can only speculate that he had tried to use a bump fire stock prior to this and found they were prone to overheating guns and leading to jamming. Instead of clearing a FTF or FTE just throw it down and pick up the next one. My 2 cents worth which on the interwebs is worth even less. ;)

bob

I agree.

Considering his accounting and audit background, my gut feeling is he went out in the desert, used a stopwatch, and timed his effective sustained ROF with a bumpstock. He also probably accounted for the rifle heating up beyond what he could tolerate, and because of the time to reload or possible jams, he figured ROF / 100 round Surefire magazines, and x% of stoppages, meant that setting up umpteen rifles got him the most amount of rounds in the 10 minute window or whatever he thought he could shoot for, and still evacuate the hotel as just another "fleeing guest". So he could go on and do phase II with the Tannerite and the other rifle he'd left in his car.

The cost wasn't an issue because of his financial situation, nor did he care because his escape plan seemed predicated around being able to do more attacks, and/or having an "escape plan" was just a mental placebo to get him to commit, and he knew he was going to die all along.

I further suspect when he was actually shooting from his hotel suite, sticking with the same rifle longer was just easier, and despite filling the room with the rifles, he didn't decide to use them, adrenaline or whatever.
I promise not to duck.

Perd Hapley

  • Superstar of the Internet
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 61,475
  • My prepositions are on/in
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #344 on: October 09, 2017, 04:12:58 PM »
"Doggies are angel babies!" -- my wife

Chester32141

  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 642
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #345 on: October 09, 2017, 05:07:20 PM »
An interesting wrinkle that's either pure BS or not, though it is a fact that he killed himself and his daughter the day after an FBI visit ... Article is poorly written as it states he shot himself in the back of the head and doesn't do a good job of tying Beilman to the phone charger that was found in Paddock's room ...

Quote
John Beilman was wanted by federal agents in connection to a communications device discovered in Stephen Paddock’s hotel room at the Mandalay Bay.

The FBI had raided Beilman’s home one day before he shot his disabled daughter and then himself, according to sources close to the investigation.


http://yournewswire.com/las-vegas-eyewitness-suicide-fbi/

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/news/2017/10/06/john-beilman-nicole-murder-suicide-fbi-search-fairport-rett-syndrome/738874001/

http://www.whec.com/news/man-woman-shot-killed-fairport/4624330/

 ???
"The best argument against democracy is a 5 minute conversation with the average voter...... "

Photos
CBs Hawg Sauce


RoadKingLarry

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 21,841
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #346 on: October 09, 2017, 07:39:15 PM »
I wonder what he had on Hillary?
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

Samuel Adams

Jim147

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 7,601
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #347 on: October 09, 2017, 08:21:07 PM »
New news out tonight, the guard was shot before he started shouting at the concert goers

No link not on my computer.
Sometimes we carry more weight then we owe.
And sometimes goes on and on and on.

BAH-WEEP-GRAAAGHNAH WHEEP NI-NI BONG

Jim147

  • friends
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 7,601
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #348 on: October 09, 2017, 08:25:56 PM »
Did he really shoot himself in the back of the head with a shotgun?
Sometimes we carry more weight then we owe.
And sometimes goes on and on and on.

BAH-WEEP-GRAAAGHNAH WHEEP NI-NI BONG

Scout26

  • I'm a leaf on the wind.
  • friend
  • Senior Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 25,997
  • I spent a week in that town one night....
Re: Vegas strip mass shooting!
« Reply #349 on: October 09, 2017, 08:38:53 PM »

Unless he scrubbed all of that beforehand, or destroyed his computers, or was so paranoid that he didn't keep any incriminating favorites/bookmarks, and had his browser set to scrub all of the cookies, etc, every time he closed it.

If he even had a computer...
Some days even my lucky rocketship underpants won't help.


Bring me my Broadsword and a clear understanding.
Get up to the roundhouse on the cliff-top standing.
Take women and children and bed them down.
Bless with a hard heart those that stand with me.
Bless the women and children who firm our hands.
Put our backs to the north wind.
Hold fast by the river.
Sweet memories to drive us on,
for the motherland.