If this video is accurate, it looks like the BATFE has over-reacted once again.

[RocketMan]

Check out the video.  Does it seem to anyone else that the BATFE overstepped their authority on this one?
The BATFE crew wants to "talk" to some kids they observed j-walking across a neighborhood street.  The mother of the kids refuses to let the kids go out of her house to talk to the BATFE agents.  The BATFE then calls out a full crew to deal with the issue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mbF05rOivQ4

[WLJ]

More info

The Lorain police report states the officers were patrolling near West 27th Street and Reid Avenue, where a shooting had occurred last summer near the Hildreths' house, and “the surrounding area is a known hot-spot for shots fired incidents and weapons violation complaints.”

The report states officers saw three juveniles with their hands in their sweatshirt pockets and waistbands while looking around the immediate area, which they say could indicate the person may be armed and checking their surroundings.

Couple file complaint against Lorain Police Patrol Impact Team
https://chroniclet.com/news/343169/couple-file-complaint-against-lorain-police-patrol-impact-team/

[Perd Hapley]

How many dogs did they kill this time?

[MechAg94]

So the BATFE agent was doing a ride along and inserted himself into a local misdemeanor complaint.  IMO, they should have stayed in the car for this. 

I assume the BATFE agent is there partly due to some loophole that allows them to bypass certain restrictions.  Maybe not for this issue, but others certainly.


Since when is walking down the street with hands in your pockets reasonable suspicion?  Seems like officers are always trying to stretch that issue and judges don't push back near enough.  I guess it sounds good to juries for some reason. 

I guess I need to watch the video now.

[MechAg94]

Not sure what the laws are in that state, buy does setting foot on the public street turn an interaction with cops into a traffic stop?  That seems to be what the one officer is saying. 

[ConstitutionCowboy]

The BATFE shouldn't even exist to begin with. This agency and several others having been "given" usurped police powers and weapons indicates to me we are headed for a dictatorial police state of circumstances - powers that only are necessary in a dictatorship.

Woody

[AZRedhawk44]

That's some serious bullscat.  Neighborhood streets are FOR playing in and jaywalking.  Neighbors are supposed to be able to cross the street directly to talk to other neighbors.

The entire premise behind the cops' insertion into the event is fallacious. 

[MechAg94]

Watching the video from the OP, those cops were in full intimidation mode from the start.  Raising their voices, making demands, threatening arrest, etc. 

[HankB]

As I saw them mouthing off and walking back and forth in front of the house, my first thought was "This would be a GREAT time to turn on the sprinkler system!"   

[Ben]

Watching the video from the OP, those cops were in full intimidation mode from the start.  Raising their voices, making demands, threatening arrest, etc.

That first cop would have had me just walk in the house and shut the door and let him stew. What an ass. Maybe there is more to this than the video, but even so, trying to use "jaywalking" as a foot in the door is ridiculous.

If I would have watched this video cold turkey, I would have almost thought it was some youtube fake. I wish the video would have stated the outcome of all this.

[RocketMan]

That first cop would have had me just walk in the house and shut the door and let him stew. What an ass. Maybe there is more to this than the video, but even so, trying to use "jaywalking" as a foot in the door is ridiculous.

If I would have watched this video cold turkey, I would have almost thought it was some youtube fake. I wish the video would have stated the outcome of all this.

The video was listed as being two days old when I posted it.  The creator has said there will be a follow-up later on.

[dogmush]

"Get a Warrant or get the *expletive deleted*ck off my property."

I made it to like yhe 50 sec mark before I would have been done with that dipshit.

"If you have probable cause for a jaywalking arrest, get in your car and get a judge to issue a warrant."

[MechAg94]

That goes for the ATF agent double.  He had no business getting involved at all.

[Ben]

That goes for the ATF agent double.  He had no business getting involved at all.

I gotta say, unless I'm getting cops mixed up, the ATF agent (him being there in the first place aside) was way less confrontational than that first jackass. The ATF guy was more doing a whiny, "Why won't you do what we say?" The first cop could have been a Gestapo trainer. That guy has no business wearing a badge.

[RoadKingLarry]

Gotta wonder how often crap like this happens that isn't caught on camera and never gets any attention.

[Hawkmoon]

Gotta wonder how often crap like this happens that isn't caught on camera and never gets any attention.

Thousands of times a day, every day of the year.

[Lennyjoe]

That’s my home town which has gone downhill over the years.  Tried to see if I recognized any of the LE but wasn’t able to. 

[Kingcreek]

I watched most of it, painful as it is.
Around 11 minutes in they finally hint at what I expected. Kids were possibly(probably) carrying (watch them clutching their gangster pants). Cop and ATF is on some kind of neighborhood gun/drug mission and what they were hoping would be an easy pop (lacking any real pc) deteriorated into a bunch of ghetto mama drama.

[dogmush]

I watched most of it, painful as it is.
Around 11 minutes in they finally hint at what I expected. Kids were possibly(probably) carrying (watch them clutching their gangster pants). Cop and ATF is on some kind of neighborhood gun/drug mission and what they were hoping would be an easy pop (lacking any real pc) deteriorated into a bunch of ghetto mama drama.

Sure,  And while I don't *like* that kind of policing I can at least understand it, and why departments try.  The issue here, and honestly the underlying reason for the plummeting support of Law Enforcement in America, is that once they missed their easy pop, and the mom said, "No, you can't talk to my minor children" they should have realized they lacked PC, and left.  You missed the easy interview, try again another day.

Instead they pushed far beyond their authority, acted like dicks, further damaged any relationship between law enforcement and that community and just generally were bad people.  IMO the lady didn't have any mama drama, shy held her ground against people trespassing on her property and trying to damage her children.  She was calmer than a lot of folks would have been.

[MechAg94]

Doesn't that seem to be a common trait in some of these videos?  The cops can't/won't back off once they start. 

[Kingcreek]

The cop gets high marks for the D***head part, but needs to repeat his de-escalation training.
Sometimes you swing and miss and you just have to walk away and try again some other time. He thought if he just kept swinging she would cave but it was obvious she wasn’t goin to.
I wonder if part of it was young buck in tac gear gets to ride with mr ATF operator guy and we just gotta throw all this weight around, kick some doors, and have some stories to tell at the bar.

[Ben]

I wonder if part of it was young buck in tac gear gets to ride with mr ATF operator guy and we just gotta throw all this weight around, kick some doors, and have some stories to tell at the bar.

Yeah, dude was dressed to be the cover model of Operator Magazine, and I think sometimes that goes hand in hand with attitude. Also I would guess he was in some undercover or "special tactical" unit in his department that gave him a swelled head.

I'm curious if some of those units either don't undergo initial training or don't have to do refresher training on the "how to approach citizens" classes that the uniformed cops go to?

[RoadKingLarry]

Yeah, dude was dressed to be the cover model of Operator Magazine, and I think sometimes that goes hand in hand with attitude. Also I would guess he was in some undercover or "special tactical" unit in his department that gave him a swelled head.

I'm curious if some of those units either don't undergo initial training or don't have to do refresher training on the "how to approach citizens" classes that the uniformed cops go to?

By the number of "comply or die" attitudes we see on an almost daily basis I'd be inclined to believe they are following the training they are getting. Us lowly peons just don't understand how important it is for these poor maligned peace officers to go home safely at the end of their shift.