More brilliance from the Stupid Party

[HankB]

If the GOP takes the House, the best way to repeal Obamacare is to take a long, LONG bill, and sneak in one short sentence, phrased in proper legalese, that says "Obamacare is entirely repealed." (OK, use the correct technical term for Obamacare.) There's at least a 50% chance nobody will read it and catch it. 

Moving on, I truly DETEST the RINOs in Congress . . . better a declared enemy than a backstabbing "friend," and some GOPers are beyond redemption.

But if we can make a squishy Republican toe the line, we should do so . . . don't let "Perfect" be the enemy of "OK" or even "Tolerable" . . .

[roo_ster]

For the last year ALL Republicans have had the courage to oppose this health care refprm.  The Reps have given you 110% in opposing this mess, from the leaders in Washington all the way down to the grassroots base people like me.  And all you can say afterwards is that we don't have any courage, that we don't care about opposing Obamacare.  

You need to get real.  

And do you really believe that repealing Obamacare is simply a matter of having enough courage, after all that's happened this past year?

You are writing about the past and I am writing about the present & future.  It took two weeks for the national GOP to test the waters for accommodation.  I am doing my best to show the GOP that those waters are nut-sack-shrinkingly chilly.

I don't believe or expect instantaneous repeal will occur.  I expect stout opposition to Obamacare and similar statist proposals until such time as repeal & replacement with market-oriented reform is viable, not accommodationist/RINO noise.  Dereliction of their duty will cause me to support others made of sterner stuff. 

This sort of constituent pressure has worked with Cornyn & The Squish (KBH) in the past.  They need some adult supervision to tread the straight & narrow.

BTW, I am also GOP "grassroots/base people."  At the precinct & district conventions I voted in support of, and made clear my support of, those opposed to RINO decadence.  There is some new blood in my state's GOP apparatus this year, but direct commo to the policritters is also helpful.

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

You are writing about the past and I am writing about the present & future.  It took two weeks for the national GOP to test the waters for accommodation.  I am doing my best to show the GOP that those waters are nut-sack-shrinkingly chilly.

No, you are still working in the past.  The health care bill is law, and there is nothing we can do about except maybe try to chip away at it with defunding (a la MB) or attempt to use trickery (a la Mak).  For now, at least.

Cornyn realizes this, and he's trying to shift the debate away from something that's impossible and a sure loser (full repeal and nothing less), to something a little more realistic (opposition to socialist health care in general and opposition to all of the other socialist garbage related to the Dems).  

Cornyn is playing for the future.  He's looking for a viable way forward.  Folks who are hell bent on repeal and aren't interested in anything else are stuck in the past, they're still fighting a battle that's over and lost.  

Let's focus on the battles we can win and come up with viable strategies for winning them.

I don't believe or expect instantaneous repeal will occur.  I expect stout opposition to Obamacare and similar statist proposals until such time as repeal & replacement with market-oriented reform is viable, not accommodationist/RINO noise.  Dereliction of their duty will cause me to support others made of sterner stuff.  

So now you're agreeing with Cornyn?  No instantaneous repeal, instead focus on broader statism vs free-market issues?  Then why all the harsh words for him?  Have you confused strategy with capitulation?

When politcritters do what you want, the appropriate response is to support them and encourage them to continue doing more of the same, not to give them an earful about how wrong they've got it for doing what you want.  Giving them hell for doing what you ask from them does not encourage them to pay attention to you the next time a big decision comes up.

[longeyes]

When a suicide bombing attack take place, you don't measure the casualties by the one or two babies the shrapnel miraculously missed, you condemn the attack in a plenary way and hammer relentlessly on the flagitious motive.  In the case of ObamaCare the intent is to destroy individual liberty and to control all of us body and soul.  We forget that, and rationalize it, at our mortal peril.

[roo_ster]

HTG:

I question the profitability of debating due to:
1. You didn't bother to read the article before posting. (Certainly your first post was written before mashing the link on through to the article.)
2. Reflexive defense of GOP actions before knowing the facts (see #1)
3. Misunderstanding and/or misconstruction of the base's points when they are critical of the GOP.

Hmm, problems similar to those exhibited by GOP "leadership" at the national & state level, of the sort that got us into this mess.

Anyways, I am so very glad I went to the district convention and had a hand in sending so many of the old functionaries home, rather than to the state convention they are used to attending.  Makes me feel all warm inside.

Like I wrote above, the GOP does not need reflexive defense in the face of criticism from the base.  It needs a good slapping around and some spine-stiffening. 

[AZRedhawk44]

flagitious motive

Your loquacious verbiage inspired me to adopt this particularly adroit turn-of-phrase.

You are writing about the past and I am writing about the present & future.  It took two weeks for the national GOP to test the waters for accommodation.  I am doing my best to show the GOP that those waters are nut-sack-shrinkingly chilly.

I don't believe or expect instantaneous repeal will occur.  I expect stout opposition to Obamacare and similar statist proposals until such time as repeal & replacement with market-oriented reform is viable, not accommodationist/RINO noise.  Dereliction of their duty will cause me to support others made of sterner stuff. 

+1.  The Repubs are going to campaign on:
-Hooray, capitalism!
-Boo, socialism!

They will talk about the (luke-warm) evils of socialized health care without demonizing it too much... after all, it's now installed and entrenched in the fabric of the America that they have no problem supporting into the future.

When they get into office, they will use funding for this as a leverage chip to obtain similar funding for pet projects that THEY care about.  Not as a means to decrease Federal funding in the first place... which should the the critical issue that all our critters face together.

As such, they will earn my perspicuous loathing and flagitious enmity.

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

HTG:

I question the profitability of debating due to:
1. You didn't bother to read the article before posting. (Certainly your first post was written before mashing the link on through to the article.)
2. Reflexive defense of GOP actions before knowing the facts (see #1)
3. Misunderstanding and/or misconstruction of the base's points when they are critical of the GOP.

Hmm, problems similar to those exhibited by GOP "leadership" at the national & state level, of the sort that got us into this mess.

Anyways, I am so very glad I went to the district convention and had a hand in sending so many of the old functionaries home, rather than to the state convention they are used to attending.  Makes me feel all warm inside.

Like I wrote above, the GOP does not need reflexive defense in the face of criticism from the base.  It needs a good slapping around and some spine-stiffening.  

 That's the best response you can muster?  So much for your so-called "debate".

I'll close the "debate" portion of our conversation by saying that the GOP needs neither reflexive defense nor reflexive criticism.  They've done exactly the right thing in response to this health care bill, opposed it all down the line with vigor and passion and at considerable expense.  They deserve support for that, not the reflexive criticism I'm seeing here.  For no rational or visible reason at all, some people expect that the Reps are suddenly gonna do a 180 and start supporting health care.  Some are so convinced of their beliefs they're acting as if their beliefs have already become reality.

But no, those beliefs are not reality.  However much you believe them, those beliefs are still groundless supposition, not reality.

The Republicans are not supporting health care, they are still opposing it 100%.  Some may confuse strategizing effective ways to deal with the next election cycle with some sort of "accomodation" or capitulation, but it is nothing of the sort.  When you're in a weak position, you do what you can to regain a position of strength.  You do NOT mount a suicidal frontal assault when you know you have no chance of success.

The original article was written in a style intended to provoke precisely the kind of foolish assumptions and emotional responses some are giving it.  They're playing you, and it seems to be working.  This is not helpful.

Please, stop and think it through.

[longeyes]

Maybe he's just looking at the history of the Republican Party for precedent. We didn't get where we are without a lot of help from the GOP.  So far, at this juncture, the Republican Party appears surprisingly resolute, monolithic; we'll see how long that lasts and IF it lasts past November's elections.

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

True, the Republicans have made some bad moves in the past.  C'est la vie.

But I thought he said he was looking to the present and the future, not the past?

 

You are right, though, about the Republicans being resolute these days.  Satisfying, that.  You're also right about having to wait and see if it lasts.  But so far so good.

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

Wait...

Jfruser, is the reason you think I didn't read the article mak quoted because I said in my first post that was written by the AP?

 

 

<we need a dopeslap smiley>

HTG:

I question the profitability of debating due to:
1. You didn't bother to read the article before posting. (Certainly your first post was written before mashing the link on through to the article.)