Where did my Patriot Act go?

[Perd Hapley]

I know I left it around here somewhere.

I simply do not understand what I've been hearing for the past two weeks.  People are being arrested and arraigned and charged, and so on and so forth, in New York for an Islamic terror plot.  They have these guys buying the chemicals, and admitting to Al-Qaeda training and everything.  Here's a random article, just in case you've been sick with the swine flu for the past several days. 

http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/05/20/4-arrested-in-new-york-terror-plot/?hp

At this point, I assume most of you are asking the same question I have been asking.

I was told that the merest suspicion of terrorism resulted in immediate no-knock, black-bag raids in the dead of night, with the "detainees" being secretly and indefinitely detained with no charges.

I was told that anyone suspected of terrorism would be "rendited" to parts undisclosed, for torture by CIA, or by low-ranking MPs with special orders directly from Dick Cheney and his ZIONIST MASTER!!!!


What is going on here?  Here we have a full-blown terrorist cell, and it's all on the front page and in the public square.  What happened? 

[AZRedhawk44]

That's being reserved for TEA party organizers.

Didn't you get the memo?

[freedom lover]

What is going on here?  Here we have a full-blown terrorist cell, and it's all on the front page and in the public square.  What happened? 

I'd take a guess and say propaganda. "We're winning the war on terror" and all that. I'm sure they thought about it long and hard before they did this. They wouldn't endanger a deep-cover operative who was currently working. It's possible these guys aren't connected to any command structure. They may be lone wolves. I'm sure they wouldn't do anything to harm their chances of capturing terrorists higher up the chain of command if they even suspected it was not an isolated case. That said, I didn't read the whole article.

As for their trial in civilian court, at least 3 are American citizens who are not in the military. The constitution specifically states they have a right to a fair jury trial and the legal protections of any other criminal, no matter how heinous the crime.

As for the raid I'm sure it was no knock and in the dead of night. When it comes to charges they seem to know enough to make a solid case. These guys will be put away for a long time. Prefferably they would be hung from the yard-arm of the Clearwater before a huge crowd at the ferry dock, but that won't happen.

[Seenterman]

Paging Fistful I've found your Patriot Act!!

Its being used to sneak and peak into drug dealers houses.

Only three of the 763 "sneak-and-peek" requests in fiscal year 2008 involved terrorism cases, according to a July 2009 report from the Administrative Office of the U.S. Courts. Sixty-five percent were drug cases.

Quick math =

Out of the 763 sneak and peak requests 496 of them where for drugs. 3!!!!!!! Where for terrorism!!!!!!

I now demand a compensation fee for finding your Patriot Act.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/09/23/watch-doj-official-blows_n_296209.html

[MicroBalrog]

But seenterman, drug dealers are unpersons. Who cares what happens to them?

[Perd Hapley]

Again, I was informed that any slight whiff of terrorism was enough to get me snagged, bagged, and shipped out to Rendition-R-Us. 

So what are these bona fide terrorists (an ironical choice of words, I know) doing in the criminal justice system, and in the press?  Shouldn't they be rotting in some secret prison? 

[drewtam]

Again, I was informed that any slight whiff of terrorism was enough to get me snagged, bagged, and shipped out to Rendition-R-Us. 

So what are these bona fide terrorists (an ironical choice of words, I know) doing in the criminal justice system, and in the press?  Shouldn't they be rotting in some secret prison? 

Listen you've got the old news.
The new news is that Obama renewed the Patriot Act.
Under this new light, the law is a great way to keep America safe. And so it really doesn't need to be brought up in the media again... or at least until a Republican is in office.

[Perd Hapley]

The new news is that Obama renewed the Patriot Act.

Apparently not.  Remember the "last eight years"?  Remember?  We lived in constant fear that we might do or say something that cast aspersions on Bush and his cronies.  Anyone who did was "disappeared."  You don't remember that? 

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

You don't remember that? 

I remember that.

Wait, what?

[Lee]

I think they're back to sniffing out radical Christians in the hills of Idaho and the Texas boonies.  Is Janet R. back...working as a contractor perhaps? You have to remember who the real threats are.  Dontcha remember that McVeigh fella?  Statistical blips like that are the real threat...not 2,000,000 Jihadists. 
What we need is a 'clunkers for bombs' deal or sumpin.

[MicroBalrog]

There are two million Jihadis? Where?

[Perd Hapley]

There are two million Jihadis? Where?

Right behind you!   

[Tuco]

Why do you hate America?
 

[Balog]

Right, the point of the slippery slope argument is that it always happens immediately and obviously and in all cases.  :rolleyes:

I know you're trying to be funny, but you sound kinda like the Brady's arguing that gun registration is just reasonable and common sense. Thinking it would ever be misused is just paranoia!

[GigaBuist]

I know you're trying to be funny, but you sound kinda like the Brady's arguing that gun registration is just reasonable and common sense. Thinking it would ever be misused is just paranoia!

Let us not forget that it was powers under the PATRIOT Act that undid Elliot Spitzer.  They used it to poke into his bank accounts thinking he was getting bribe money which resulted in the discovery he was paying mad cash for high dollar hookers.  Nobody ever suspected him of anything related to terrorism.

[Tuco]

<Tinfoil on

Terror was the pretext for tyranny

Tinfoil off>

[Balog]

Let us not forget that it was powers under the PATRIOT Act that undid Elliot Spitzer.  They used it to poke into his bank accounts thinking he was getting bribe money which resulted in the discovery he was paying mad cash for high dollar hookers.  Nobody ever suspected him of anything related to terrorism.

Oh, there have been all sorts of abuses already. Meth labs getting busted as weapons of mass destruction etc.

[MicroBalrog]

Oh, there have been all sorts of abuses already. Meth labs getting busted as weapons of mass destruction etc.

Balog, drug dealers are not persons. Why are you upset that something happens to them?

[Balog]

Balog, drug dealers are not persons. Why are you upset that something happens to them?

Well, honestly I'm not all that upset that people running meth labs are going away. Those damn things are pretty dangerous. It's sort of like pedophiles getting raped in prison. On the one hand, it's bad and should be stopped. On the other hand, I really don't care about the person in question.

[Perd Hapley]

Right, the point of the slippery slope argument is that it always happens immediately and obviously and in all cases.  :rolleyes:

I know you're trying to be funny, but you sound kinda like the Brady's arguing that gun registration is just reasonable and common sense. Thinking it would ever be misused is just paranoia!

On the assumption you are addressing me, the fistful-ator:

I'm definitely not trying to be dismissive of reasonable objections to USA PATRIOT. In fact, I only mention the Patriot Act, since it has become a catch-all term for all real and imagined violations of civil liberties that have or have not happened since 11 September. 

I am just poking fun at the hyperbole that goes on.  I don't know about you, but every other day I hear some yahoo saying that OMGZOR!!!1 DON'T JAYWALK, OR YOU'RE GOING TO GET SHIPPED OVERSEAS TO GET THE BAMBOO MANICURE AND THE WATERBOARD WINE TASTING!

You know what I mean.   

[MicroBalrog]

So, where DID it go?

Where are those multitudes of 'Jihadis' caught with it?

Oh, you mean there are not terrorists caught with it? Then what do we need it for?

[Tuco]

Then what do we need it for?

<Tinfoil on

Controlling the minions.

Tinfoil off>

[roo_ster]

<Tinfoil on

Controlling the minions.

Tinfoil off>

Wrong.

Minions already toady to the regime.

It is for non-toadies.

[Tuco]

Wrong.

Minions already toady to the regime.

It is for non-toadies.

I stand corrected.

[Hawkmoon]

Paging Fistful I've found your Patriot Act!!

Its being used to sneak and peak into drug dealers houses.


Quick math =

Out of the 763 sneak and peak requests 496 of them where for drugs. 3!!!!!!! Where for terrorism!!!!!!

I now demand a compensation fee for finding your Patriot Act.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/09/23/watch-doj-official-blows_n_296209.html

Wait! New math alert -- my head hurts.

763 "sneak & peak" requests. 496 (65%) were for drugs. 3 (0.4%) were for terrorist related cases. Something is missing ...

What were the other 264 (34.6%) for? This is what's wrong with what passes for "journalism" today. The twits are handed some numbers, which they dutifully parrot. And nobody notices that a full third of the pile is mysteriously AWOL.

My guess is that the other 34.6% were all requests to toss Joe the Plumber's business and home on a bi-weekly basis.