The Justice System in the crosshairs...

[T.O.M.]

I was reading this morning about the prosecutors being murdered down in Texas when the story came in about the break-in at the prosecutor's home in Colorado.  Shortly after lunch, I hear that a sheriff in West Virgina was shot and killed outside the county courthouse.  Time will tell in all of these cases what the motives were, but I found a link to a study done by Glenn McGovern, an investigator with the Santa Clara County Prosecutor's Office.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/133616512/Murdered-Justice-An-Exploratory-Study

This was published on march 1, 2013, before the latest "spree" of prosecutor attacks began.  It is just a factual analysis, without comments as to cause for the targeted attacks against judges, prosecutors, and LEO's.  It does include some study of motive, where the information was available.  Revenge was the biggest motive for the attacks, with attempting to interfere with the court process second.  

A couple of interesting points
- The number of attacks or attempted attacks in the 1950's was 4.  In the 2010's (excluding the latest four), there were 9 actual attacks and 26 attampted attacks.
- Judges are mnost often targeted, followed by prosecutors, then police officers.

Anyone care to speculate as to why the increase in attacks on judical personnell in relation to their profession?  Is it a sign of the political climate, where more and more people are growing dissatisfied with their government?  Or could it be a situation where the taboos against going after the judge or prosecutor no longer exists?

All I know is that as the resident robe-wearer around here, I think I'll be driving a different way home today.  And, I'll put the Karhr 9mm in the safe and dig out the Glock 21 for a while.

(Edited for spelling)

[Perd Hapley]

Why not blame guns? They didn't have guns in 1950.

[brimic]

Why not blame guns? They didn't have guns in 1950.

If they didn't have guns, they must not have had background checks or form 4473s either. Must have been strange times indeed.

[zxcvbob]

Anyone care to speculate as to why the increase in attacks on judical personnel in relation to their profession?

1) Sovereign immunity.  Assassination is seen as the only recourse after real or imagined injustices because judges and prosecutors are insulated from any accountability.  Not saying I agree with it; just an observation.

2) Intimidation.

3) "War on Drugs"  (you think the warriors on the other side aren't going to shoot back?)

[AZRedhawk44]

A couple of interesting points
- The number of attacks or attempted attacks in the 1950's was 4.  In the 2010's (excluding the latest four), there were 9 actual attacks and 26 attampted attacks.
- Judges are mnost often targeted, followed by prosecutors, then police officers.

Take it backwards, to prohibition version one point oh.  125 million or so people.

Suppose it was only 4 attacks on police, DA's and judges then?


I liken our current climate to more a hybridization of the Civil War and Prohibition, than the 1950's.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

not sure how comprehensive the data sources were.

[HankB]

The media are falling all over themselves to blame white separatists, but zxcvbob's first point (sovereign immunity) seems to be equally plausible. For that matter, I think drug cartels are more likely to have the intelligence to pull this off (and escape!) than any bunch of white separatists I've ever heard of.

But some prosecutors are fighting back:  http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/04/02/17575111-intruder-killed-while-breaking-into-colorado-prosecutors-home?lite

The media have been strangely reluctant to dig into the prosecutorial history of the targeted individuals to uncover what kind of cases they may have had in common . . . have to wonder why.

[Tallpine]

Haven't we discussed prosecutorial misconduct ?

Nifong, etc 

[AZRedhawk44]

Very well could be Ranya Bardiwell.

Anyone do a welfare check on Eric Sanderson, yet?

[drewtam]

For all the bad experience and lowered expectations I have for police, I find most judges to be reasonable, based on sitting in court for a few hours listening to them deal patiently with yahoos, and other legal issues.

For example, police gave my wife a ticket at a car accident for "going too fast for conditions". She was stopped at the time of the accident, and was rear ended. Once the judge heard that side of the story, he went off on the prosecutor and officer, dismissed the ticket, etc. So in this case, the officer was a .... (like usual), and the judge supported justice.

Maybe its because judges are elected?

[Scout26]

As the drug war progresses the Drug gangs have become more vicious.  All one has to do is simply look south of the border.  Since we've done a crappy job of securing the border, those elements have moved north (to expand and control their drug trade).  The Mexican and Central American gangs/cartels are among the most vicious.  (MI-13, Los Zetas, Sinalosa, La Familia,- et al).  Most Central and South American judges remain anonymous by wearing hoods and other disguises because if they didn't they'd be killed before the made it to the front door of the court house.
 

Some of this may also be simple revenge for perceived wrongs.  Bad people doing bad things and as society continues to degrade, things that were once beyond the pale will now become common and accepted.

[zxcvbob]

For all the bad experience and lowered expectations I have for police, I find most judges to be reasonable, based on sitting in court for a few hours listening to them deal patiently with yahoos, and other legal issues.

For example, police gave my wife a ticket at a car accident for "going too fast for conditions". She was stopped at the time of the accident, and was rear ended. Once the judge heard that side of the story, he went off on the prosecutor and officer, dismissed the ticket, etc. So in this case, the officer was a .... (like usual), and the judge supported justice.

Maybe its because judges are elected?

Even an otherwise good judge might sign a defective warrant and get someone killed.  Why wouldn't he sign it?  The police want a warrant, and if the address is wrong (etc) it's not his problem.

[roo_ster]

I suspect the methods of the cartels south of the border are moving north.

One of the local Aryan Brotherhood experts is of the opinion that the dumbass meth cookers who make up the ABT are not up to pulling off these capers.

[freakazoid]

All I know is that as the resident robe-wearer around here, I think I'll be driving a different way home today.  And, I'll put the Karhr 9mm in the safe and dig out the Glock 21 for a while.

Immediately thought of this. Couldn't find an actual picture from the scene with him, so this will have to do.
 

[zxcvbob]

As the drug war progresses the Drug gangs have become more vicious.  All one has to do is simply look south of the border.  Since we've done a crappy job of securing the border, those elements have moved north (to expand and control their drug trade).  The Mexican and Central American gangs/cartels are among the most vicious.  (MI-13, Los Zetas, Sinalosa, La Familia,- et al).  Most Central and South American judges remain anonymous by wearing hoods and other disguises because if they didn't they'd be killed before the made it to the front door of the court house.

That's what I think is happening too.  (I wonder if there's any way to directly link Eric Holder or Janet N. to this?)

If it was just one or two cases, I would lean towards vengeance killings -- and maybe even justified.  This is playing out more like a turf war.

[T.O.M.]

@Freak...best running joke my bailiff annd I have going is that I'm dressing like the judge from Justified under my robe, but prefer an auto in my shoulder holster.   

[roo_ster]

@Freak...best running joke my bailiff annd I have going is that I'm dressing like the judge from Justified under my robe, but prefer an auto in my shoulder holster.   

Photographic proof emphatically not required.

[T.O.M.]

Even an otherwise good judge might sign a defective warrant and get someone killed.  Why wouldn't he sign it?  The police want a warrant, and if the address is wrong (etc) it's not his problem.

Gotta say that I've been involved with more than a few search warrants in my day, especially when I was working with the drug task force.  Every time I was present for the judicial review and signing, the judge asked if the addess was verified.  See, judges are not allowed to do ANY investigation of facts in a case, and can only make decisions on the evidence presented.  So, when you as a judge have a cop swearing that the address is correct, you have to take that oath seriously, and proceed on what's in the document.  As for other errors in the warrant, I've seen judges reject more than a few for something as simple as a typo.  Don't want to have to explain to voters why you signed a warrant knowing it had mistakes in it.

[T.O.M.]

I hadn't considered the drug cartels hitting judges and prosecutors, especially down on the border.  But, you guys are right, if you look at what they've done down in Mexico, it may just be an extension of the violence to CONUS.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

nother one
http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/west-virginia-county-sheriff-shot-near-courthouse-in-williamson-suspect-in-custody/2013/04/03/e6d466c4-9c84-11e2-9219-51eb8387e8f1_story.html?tid=pm_national_pop

and more on first one

http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/sheriffs-office-2-members-of-white-supremacist-gang-sought-in-death-of-colo-prisons-chief/2013/04/03/0f9aa88c-9ccd-11e2-9219-51eb8387e8f1_story.html

[RevDisk]

Anyone care to speculate as to why the increase in attacks on judicial personnel in relation to their profession?  Is it a sign of the political climate, where more and more people are growing dissatisfied with their government?  Or could it be a situation where the taboos against going after the judge or prosecutor no longer exists?

Are you familiar with the "Kids for cash" scandal back in 2008 over judicial kickbacks at the Luzerne County Court of Common Pleas in Pennsylvania? Two judges were getting paid to destroy kids' lives. 6000 kids' lives. If you knew they were on the take, and couldn't otherwise stop them, would YOU have a moral issue with someone shooting them to stop their actions? What about one of their victims shooting them?

Think criminals will even need that level of justification?


It's the political climate and the cultural climate. Criminals tend to only survive in a community that allows them to exist. If the community does not allow their existence, formally or informally, they tend to move on. This doesn't stop mad dog killers of quasi ordinary folks who snap variety, but it does the career criminal types. If the community doesn't care... Well. *shrug*

[T.O.M.]

Are you familiar with the "Kids for cash" scandal back in 2008 over judicial kickbacks at the Luzerne County Court of Common Pleas in Pennsylvania? Two judges were getting paid to destroy kids' lives. 6000 kids' lives. If you knew they were on the take, and couldn't otherwise stop them, would YOU have a moral issue with someone shooting them to stop their actions? What about one of their victims shooting them?

Think criminals will even need that level of justification?

I know about that.  Frankly, the punishments these two got wasn't what they deserved.  They got off easy.  But, I don't know that they deserved capital punishment, delivered by the system or by other means.

[CNYCacher]

But, I don't know that they deserved capital punishment, delivered by the system or by other means.

Maybe not, but compulsory organ donation would have been ok.  Plenty of good people out there dying for want of a heart, lungs, kidneys, etc.

[RevDisk]

I know about that.  Frankly, the punishments these two got wasn't what they deserved.  They got off easy.  But, I don't know that they deserved capital punishment, delivered by the system or by other means.

They tried to destroy 6000 kids. How many would warrant it, Chris?

[Perd Hapley]

That's what I think is happening too.  (I wonder if there's any way to directly link Eric Holder or Janet N. to this?)

Maybe if a Fast and Furious gun shows up.