Author Topic: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts  (Read 19678 times)

roo_ster

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #50 on: July 21, 2015, 11:40:53 AM »
Somebody has learned from James O'Keefe:
1. Initial video drop on head of corrupt lefty organization.
2. Vociferous denials by org and claims that even if true, it is an "isolated incident."
3. Second video drop kick in the jimmy, usually even uglier than #1, plus shows they were lying in #2 and shows their defenders to be saps (at best).


From drudge:
DOCTOR HAGGLING PRICE OF BABY SCRAPS
LAMBORGHINI FOR TISSUE



NEW VIDEO SHOWS ANOTHER PLANNED PARENTHOOD DOCTOR HAGGLING PRICE OF BABY BODY PARTS
http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/07/21/new-video-shows-another-planned-parenthood-doctor-haggling-price-of-baby-body-parts/
Quote
In the second video released today by the Center for Medical Progress, yet another senior medical adviser to Planned Parenthood of America appears to negotiate the price of selling baby body parts to actors playing entrepreneurs from a start-up biotech firm.

Quote
What’s more, in the beginning of the video, she talks about an earlier situation where a company called Novogenix used to come to her abortion clinic to buy specimens: “Heather, a Novogenix person would come to the site and our staff would sign the patients up and get consent. And then Heather would look at the tissue and take what she required. So logistically it was very easy for us. We didn’t have to do anything.” (emphasis added)

This statement would seem to contradict the need of a higher and higher price for doing nothing except letting a technician from another company come into the facility and take specimens. While she seems willing to accept higher prices, Gatter does claim Planned Parenthood is “not in it for the money” and they do not want to appear to be selling body parts.

At the end of the video, like Nucatola, Gatter talks about changing the abortion technique to get intact specimens, changing from a rather violent suction method that would destroy tissue to what she calls an IPAS, which is a reference to a nonprofit company that makes and distributes “manual vacuum aspirators” which would be a less harmful way to get at the internal organs. She said there would be protocol issues with the patient but that she saw no problem with it. She calls it a “less crunchy” way to get intact organs.

At the end of the tape provided by CMP, Gatter jokes about wanting “a Lamborghini” for body parts.


Second Planned Parenthood Senior Executive Haggles Over Baby Parts Prices, Changes Abortion Methods
http://www.centerformedicalprogress.org/2015/07/second-planned-parenthood-senior-executive-haggles-over-baby-parts-prices-changes-abortion-methods/
Quote



Sure, you'd let this gal babysit your kids...

...if you wanted them parted out like a 1992 Mustang GT.

Regards,

roo_ster

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----G.K. Chesterton

Ben

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #51 on: July 21, 2015, 11:46:58 AM »
Another video has been released showing one of the PP heads talking price and saying she 'wants a Lamborghini". Additionally she apparently was discussing the preference of second trimester over first trimester due to the increased value. For an organization that's supposedly all about women's health and not about money, one would think they'd be promoting abortion at the earliest possible time instead of dragging it out. Even in a "heavily edited" video, it's all pretty damning.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2015/07/21/new-planned-parenthood-video-shows-top-doc-haggling-over-price-fetal-body-parts/

EDIT: Rooster posted while I was typing.
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vaskidmark

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #52 on: July 21, 2015, 01:08:43 PM »
http://stemexpress.com/statement-of-stemexpress-concerning-recent-media-stories/

Quote
Producing the isolated cells researchers need from donated tissues requires the development of complicated, often unique, research techniques using millions of dollars of scientific equipment. We are hopeful the events of the last few days will not diminish our efforts to support the research community or hinder our partners from continuing their important work.

Just for giggles, let's go beyond the A-word thing and discuss what their partners are doing with the stuff once they get their hands on it.

No, this is not a statement about the A-word itself, or the philosophy behind being for or against it.

The fact of the matter is that folks now have this stuff and are doing/trying to do things  with it.  Is that good or bad?  Is some of it good and some of it bad?  What about the philosophy of doing/trying to do stuff in the first place (disregarding for the sake of the discussion where/how they get the stuff)?

More than anything else I would like to hear from the religiously-focused on why they feel this is bad while genetic manipulation in animal husbandry is good.

stay safe.
If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of a constitutional privilege.

Hey you kids!! Get off my lawn!!!

They keep making this eternal vigilance thing harder and harder.  Protecting the 2nd amendment is like playing PACMAN - there's no pause button so you can go to the bathroom.

Tallpine

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #53 on: July 21, 2015, 01:26:17 PM »
You seriously don't see a difference between animals and people ???
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

lupinus

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #54 on: July 21, 2015, 01:41:16 PM »
http://stemexpress.com/statement-of-stemexpress-concerning-recent-media-stories/

Just for giggles, let's go beyond the A-word thing and discuss what their partners are doing with the stuff once they get their hands on it.

No, this is not a statement about the A-word itself, or the philosophy behind being for or against it.

The fact of the matter is that folks now have this stuff and are doing/trying to do things  with it.  Is that good or bad?  Is some of it good and some of it bad?  What about the philosophy of doing/trying to do stuff in the first place (disregarding for the sake of the discussion where/how they get the stuff)?

More than anything else I would like to hear from the religiously-focused on why they feel this is bad while genetic manipulation in animal husbandry is good.

stay safe.
The two can not be separated. "Well they have it, is it so bad that they are at least doing something with it?" Yes, yes it is, it stems from the fact they have it in the first place.
That is all. *expletive deleted*ck you all, eat *expletive deleted*it, and die in a fire. I have considered writing here a long parting section dedicated to each poster, but I have decided, at length, against it. *expletive deleted*ck you all and Hail Satan.

Balog

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #55 on: July 21, 2015, 02:13:42 PM »

More than anything else I would like to hear from the religiously-focused on why they feel this is bad while genetic manipulation in animal husbandry is good.


1. At least one atheist and one pagan in this thread who are opposed to abortion.
2. You can't understand why some of us are against murdering children in order to use parts of their corpses for medical experimentation, but not against genetic manipulation of animals? I refuse to believe you are actually that stupid, this must be a troll question.
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vaskidmark

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #56 on: July 21, 2015, 08:21:26 PM »
You seriously don't see a difference between animals and people ???

For the sake of a polite discussion I can certainly see the difference.  What I don't get is that those that do see a difference seem to feel totally comfortable manipulating animals for optimum performance but have the heebie-jeebies about the possibility that serious, debilitating, and often early-in-life fatal disabilities might be remediated if not actually cured.

For the purpose of stimulating discussion: did $deity make the animals any less perfectly than $deity made the humans?  (Watch out when answering - the issue of humans being made in the image of $deity - regardless of how you interpret that phrase - is not in play.)

The two can not be separated. "Well they have it, is it so bad that they are at least doing something with it?" Yes, yes it is, it stems from the fact they have it in the first place.

Seems some folks are so wrapped around the axle that they cannot even play high school debate team.

1. At least one atheist and one pagan in this thread who are opposed to abortion.
2. You can't understand why some of us are against murdering children in order to use parts of their corpses for medical experimentation, but not against genetic manipulation of animals? I refuse to believe you are actually that stupid, this must be a troll question.

Again, that wrapping around the axle thing.  Maybe it's you, maybe it's me, but this was posed as a discussion, for the purposes of discussion and NOT to try to change or challenge anybody's beliefs, to go past the method/means of collecting the material and into the difference of manipulating one but not the other.

Humor the everloving heck out of me, OK?  Pretend that two sets of protoplamsmic goop that is documented to have come to us from outside this galaxy came into our possession.  Pretend that the first set of this goop could be used to change the way animals look and grow and do or do not produce by-products, and that the second set of this goop could be used to change the way humans look and grow and do or do not produce by-products.  And that regarding humans we are talking about curing or even preventing genitically caused diseases or reducing/eliminating cancers or even preventing them from forming in the first place.  Why is playing with the first set of goop OK while playing with the second set of goop is beyond bad?

Strangely, I learned how to do that separation while studying debate, logic, and philosophy at the feet of the Jesuits, the Loyolaists, and several different flavors of rabbis.  All of those folks make the anti-abortionists here look like pikers.  But in spite of that they could and would take either side of the discussion for the sake of  seeing which side would hold water without resorting to "$deity says it is bad".

In closing - does anybody here know how I feel about abortion?  Does anybody here see how the answer to that question should not stand in the way of the discussion I have proposed?

stay safe.
If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of a constitutional privilege.

Hey you kids!! Get off my lawn!!!

They keep making this eternal vigilance thing harder and harder.  Protecting the 2nd amendment is like playing PACMAN - there's no pause button so you can go to the bathroom.

Perd Hapley

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #57 on: July 21, 2015, 08:28:22 PM »
For the purpose of stimulating discussion: did $deity make the animals any less perfectly than $deity made the humans?  (Watch out when answering - the issue of humans being made in the image of $deity - regardless of how you interpret that phrase - is not in play.)


Actually, it is. The imago dei is pretty much the whole reason why slaughtering humans is bad, and slaughtering non-humans is what we do before we thank God for our food.

I'm not sure why you think God creating animals or humans "perfectly" has anything to do with the question, and in any case, the perfect creation quit being perfect shortly after day 6.
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lupinus

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Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #58 on: July 21, 2015, 08:39:41 PM »
The flaw in your argument is that you are micromanaging it in a way that doesn't fit reality.

Animals are not humans. Humans, biology aside, aren't animals.


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That is all. *expletive deleted*ck you all, eat *expletive deleted*it, and die in a fire. I have considered writing here a long parting section dedicated to each poster, but I have decided, at length, against it. *expletive deleted*ck you all and Hail Satan.

Tallpine

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #59 on: July 21, 2015, 08:42:30 PM »
Example: we have horses and we love them dearly, but we put ropes on them and ride them around.

So is it okay to keep people as pets, too ???
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

lupinus

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #60 on: July 21, 2015, 08:49:35 PM »
Example: we have horses and we love them dearly, but we put ropes on them and ride them around.

So is it okay to keep people as pets, too ???
Sounds kinky.


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That is all. *expletive deleted*ck you all, eat *expletive deleted*it, and die in a fire. I have considered writing here a long parting section dedicated to each poster, but I have decided, at length, against it. *expletive deleted*ck you all and Hail Satan.

Tallpine

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #61 on: July 21, 2015, 08:55:09 PM »
Sounds kinky.

50 Shades of Hay  :laugh:
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

RoadKingLarry

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #62 on: July 21, 2015, 09:55:07 PM »
I base my position on the difference between sentience and sapience. Which blob of protoplasmic goop has the potential to reason and think abstractly and to perceive the world we live in not only objectively but subjectively.
I'm not against research on fetal tissue per se, but I am strongly against the way it is being obtained and marketed as shown in the videos from PP.
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SADShooter

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #63 on: July 21, 2015, 10:05:58 PM »
I base my position on the difference between sentience and sapience. Which blob of protoplasmic goop has the potential to reason and think abstractly and to perceive the world we live in not only objectively but subjectively.
I'm not against research on fetal tissue per se, but I am strongly against the way it is being obtained and marketed as shown in the videos from PP.


This. The ethics associated with  tissue used in research, human and animal, are intended, at least in part, to prevent it from becoming a saleable-for-profit commodity. This seems to clearly illustrate a willful, deliberate, and self-interested crossing of that barrier.
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MechAg94

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #64 on: July 21, 2015, 11:01:46 PM »
Quote
Based on her experience, Ms. Johnson says she saw nothing in the video to indicate that Planned Parenthood is breaking the law. At the same time, she said the video exposes a loophole that gives clinics and processing companies enormous latitude in setting reimbursement charges for fetal hearts, lungs and other organs.

“The law currently states that there can be moneys exchanged as long as they fit under certain categories like preservation, collection, storage, transport, etc.,” Ms. Johnson said. “And the law says there is not a maximum amount that can be charged or a minimum amount but that costs cannot be prohibitive. And that’s very subjective.”



Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jul/19/abby-johnson-planned-parenthood-defector-loophole-/#ixzz3gaMkYBNI
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Saw this link.  That second paragraph explains some of the legality if it wasn't mentioned before.   
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Balog

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #65 on: July 22, 2015, 12:27:44 AM »
For the sake of a polite discussion I can certainly see the difference.  What I don't get is that those that do see a difference seem to feel totally comfortable manipulating animals for optimum performance but have the heebie-jeebies about the possibility that serious, debilitating, and often early-in-life fatal disabilities might be remediated if not actually cured.

For the purpose of stimulating discussion: did $deity make the animals any less perfectly than $deity made the humans?  (Watch out when answering - the issue of humans being made in the image of $deity - regardless of how you interpret that phrase - is not in play.)

Seems some folks are so wrapped around the axle that they cannot even play high school debate team.

Again, that wrapping around the axle thing.  Maybe it's you, maybe it's me, but this was posed as a discussion, for the purposes of discussion and NOT to try to change or challenge anybody's beliefs, to go past the method/means of collecting the material and into the difference of manipulating one but not the other.

Humor the everloving heck out of me, OK?  Pretend that two sets of protoplamsmic goop that is documented to have come to us from outside this galaxy came into our possession.  Pretend that the first set of this goop could be used to change the way animals look and grow and do or do not produce by-products, and that the second set of this goop could be used to change the way humans look and grow and do or do not produce by-products.  And that regarding humans we are talking about curing or even preventing genitically caused diseases or reducing/eliminating cancers or even preventing them from forming in the first place.  Why is playing with the first set of goop OK while playing with the second set of goop is beyond bad?

Strangely, I learned how to do that separation while studying debate, logic, and philosophy at the feet of the Jesuits, the Loyolaists, and several different flavors of rabbis.  All of those folks make the anti-abortionists here look like pikers.  But in spite of that they could and would take either side of the discussion for the sake of  seeing which side would hold water without resorting to "$deity says it is bad".

In closing - does anybody here know how I feel about abortion?  Does anybody here see how the answer to that question should not stand in the way of the discussion I have proposed?

stay safe.

You cannot separate the use of a substance from the manner it is collected. It's beyond asinine to attempt to do so. "So Mrs Lincoln, aside from that, how was the play?" "So, let's pretend humans and animals have the same intrinsic rights and that there is no need to commit murder in order to obtain this substance..." No, I don't think I will thanks.
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Northwoods

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #66 on: July 22, 2015, 01:14:55 AM »
For the sake of a polite discussion I can certainly see the difference.  What I don't get is that those that do see a difference seem to feel totally comfortable manipulating animals for optimum performance but have the heebie-jeebies about the possibility that serious, debilitating, and often early-in-life fatal disabilities might be remediated if not actually cured.



If I had the choice between some horrible progressively degenerative disease that would eventually kill me without a treatment based on aborted human babies, and a long healthy life if I took that treatment I'd take the former.  Every day of the week.  And twice on Sunday.  This is not an entirely (mostly, but not entirely) academic question.
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zxcvbob

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #67 on: July 22, 2015, 01:44:24 AM »
Selling aborted baby parts for whatever "noble" purpose commoditizes abortions, and gives them a false legitimacy.  That's why I decided not to get a shingles vaccine (look it up). 
"It's good, though..."

Perd Hapley

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #68 on: July 22, 2015, 09:04:15 AM »
vaskidmark,

I just wondered if I had answered your question. As I said, the big difference between animals and humans, from a Christian "religious focus," is that one of these groups is made in the image of God. Depending on one's theological perspective, humans may or may not also have the "breath of life" breathed into them by God. Animals and plants, at least since Noah docked the ark, were specifically given to us as a source of food. This may, or may not, have some bearing on whether or not it is OK to genetically alter them.

Does that help?
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vaskidmark

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #69 on: July 22, 2015, 10:19:35 AM »
Thank you all for your responses.  Without declaring who "won" and who "lost" I am withdrawing from this and other conversations like it.

ipse
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They keep making this eternal vigilance thing harder and harder.  Protecting the 2nd amendment is like playing PACMAN - there's no pause button so you can go to the bathroom.

KD5NRH

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #70 on: July 22, 2015, 12:12:25 PM »
So is it okay to keep people as pets, too ???

No.  Canadians aren't real people though.  There's not enough evidence either way regarding Democrats yet, so I'd propose just storing them in zoos.

Tallpine

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #71 on: July 22, 2015, 12:51:50 PM »
No.  Canadians aren't real people though. 

Mmmm ... Jewel Staite   :cool:
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

KD5NRH

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #72 on: July 22, 2015, 01:57:43 PM »
Mmmm ... Jewel Staite 

Proof you don't need a soul to be hot.

Perd Hapley

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #73 on: July 22, 2015, 04:38:53 PM »
Proof you don't need a soul to be hot.

"She's cute, too. Except I don't think she's all there, you know? 'Course, not all of her has to be."
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Tallpine

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Re: Fresh Baby Livers for Sale!: Planned Parenthood Hawks Baby Body Parts
« Reply #74 on: July 22, 2015, 05:35:39 PM »
"She's cute, too. Except I don't think she's all there, you know? 'Course, not all of her has to be."

Wrong girl.  She's from Texas IIRC.

The Vancouver girl: engines make her hot  :cool:
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin