Does anyone else think the "bailout" is anything more than theft?

[tokugawa]

My take- This multi Trillion dollar "Bailout" is the biggest theft ever conceived. An enormous expansion of the pork pie gravy train. Something that will bankrupt us with no hope whatsoever of repayment, forcing massive inflation and condemning our children to poverty. 

[Manedwolf]

It was already shown today that billions will be going to "neighborhood stabilization activities" and groups like ACORN.

Of course it's theft, and the same old liberal crap.

[AJ Dual]

My take- This multi Trillion dollar "Bailout" is the biggest theft ever conceived. An enormous expansion of the pork pie gravy train. Something that will bankrupt us with no hope whatsoever of repayment, forcing massive inflation and condemning our children to poverty. 

I don't consider it "theft" since the fiat money does not exist unless the fed.gov and fed reserve decree it be printed.  However, I think your concerns about inflation are valid. You start treading on philosophical arguments about percieved value (fiat money) vs. real value etc.

Also valid are concerns that it short circuits the needed free-market mechanisim of pain and loss which is supposed to teach the various kinds of commercial institutions, and individual borrowers "Don't do that again".

[Nick1911]

The question is:  What can you and I do about it?  The politicians won't listen to what we say; they listen to the voting majority.  That majority wants free stuff, and don't know or care about economics.

Perhaps I should move money into a more stable currency?

[wingnutx]

I would call it an attempt to create a permanent class of state-dependent voters.

[Nitrogen]

There's plenty we can do about it.

Nobody WILL do what is required.  Stating what is required at this point either gets you looks or visits from various governmental agencies that want to ensure their continued existance.

[jamz]

It was already shown today that billions will be going to "neighborhood stabilization activities" and groups like ACORN.

Of course it's theft, and the same old liberal crap.

Does Bush's bailout qualify as the same old conservative crap?

[makattak]

Does Bush's bailout qualify as the same old conservative crap?

That depends:

Did conservative support him in his actions and hold President Bush up as the model of conservative governance?

[AZRedhawk44]

Does Bush's bailout qualify as the same old conservative crap?

No, because no self-respecting conservative would consider bailing out any failing business endeavor.

Bush was not a conservative.  He was a statist, through-and-through.

[El Tejon]

GWB=Herbert Hoover with pointy elf boots and a Texas twang.

[tokugawa]

Inflation is theft.  Theft of savings, theft of investments, theft of our future.   These bailouts are stealing from us, to give money to all and sundry, ESPECIALLY those same stupid bastards who could not afford their payments in the first place, AND  the GREEDY BASTARDS who loaned them the money, AND the dumb ass bastards who ran their business's into the ground.  And WE get to pay for it all- oh, excuse me- my daughter and her kids, as yet unborn, get to pay for it too. 
 
 I really wonder how long it will be before we see mass marches on DC.  Anybody watch what is happening in Iceland?

[Manedwolf]

I really wonder how long it will be before we see mass marches on DC.  Anybody watch what is happening in Iceland?

Not as long as people get credit for their bigscreen and American Idol is on.

[El Tejon]

Marches in DC?

You mean like the Bonus Army?

[Jamisjockey]

You mean like Citigroup trying to use taxpayer bailout money to buy a new corporate jet?
http://www.iht.com/articles/2009/01/27/business/jets.4-417130.php
50 million for a new 12 seat corporate jet.
Lets say a first class ticket is $2,000.  Pretty average for first or business class between major airports.
THAT IS 25,000 FIRST CLASS TICKETS.
That is enough for 12 people to fly first class every day for 5 years.

Theft?  More like armed robbery.

[Manedwolf]

You mean like Citigroup trying to use taxpayer bailout money to buy a new corporate jet?
http://www.iht.com/articles/2009/01/27/business/jets.4-417130.php
50 million for a new 12 seat corporate jet.
Lets say a first class ticket is $2,000.  Pretty average for first or business class between major airports.
THAT IS 25,000 FIRST CLASS TICKETS.
That is enough for 12 people to fly first class every day for 5 years.

Theft?  More like armed robbery.

Dassault Falcon 7X. There's only a handful in the US. Ultra-luxury, three-engine like a mini 727.



Very nice, if you can afford it with your own damn money, not taxpayer funds.
They should have canceled the order a long time ago.

[El Tejon]

I wonder what the poor people are doing now, Buffy?

[roo_ster]

It is a way to steal money from unconnected people and funnel it to people with connections in Wash, DC.

[Monkeyleg]

This is beyond theft. An amount of money that few can even comprehend is being directed to Green industries, constituencies that supported the Dem's, or constituencies the Dem's would like to have in their court (the middle class).

None of this is about turning the economy around quickly. "Investing in education" won't have an economic impact for years, if at all. The money our governor is seeking for education will just go to teachers' benefits, which already are an enormous burden on state taxpayers.

If these clowns were serious about stimulating the economy, they'd give those who pay taxes their money back. Someone who collects a paycheck and finds himself getting 15% to 28% more will spend that surplus. Of course that same person will then realize how much he's been robbed in the past, which is one reason why eliminating taxes isn't on the table.

[Manedwolf]

What gets me is the basic premise the Dems have.

Somehow, spending more than it would cost to give every family a hundred thousand dollars upfront is supposed to stimulate. Spending on crap like museums and statues and neighborhood programs and ACORN. And simply cutting taxes would not.

Cutting taxes would be immediate.

Ah, but that would not allow for backdoor funding of the Social Agenda...

[MechAg94]

GWB=Herbert Hoover with pointy elf boots and a Texas twang.

Herbert Hoover probably had more/greater personal accomplishments prior to his Presidency.

[Viking]

The question is:  What can you and I do about it?  The politicians won't listen to what we say; they listen to the voting majority.  That majority wants free stuff, and don't know or care about economics.

Perhaps I should move money into a more stable currency?

Ammo is stable, provided that you store it properly.

[Nick1911]

Ammo is stable, provided that you store it properly.

And ironically, it has appreciated in value over the last 10 years more then most other investments. 

7.62 x 39 was what?  $79 per 1000 in 1999?

[Declaration Day]

50 million for a new 12 seat corporate jet.....

Lets say a first class ticket is $2,000...... 

THAT IS 25,000 FIRST CLASS TICKETS.

No, it's way more than 25,000 first class tickets when you consider fuel, maintenance and other ongoing costs for the plane.

[HankB]

I don't agree with the spending, but if we're GOING to spend anyway, there are better ways to do so.

In round figures, the US adult population above 18 years of age is approximately 225 million. Obama's initial $850,000,000,000 "stimulus" package is enough to give every one of those adults a tax free check of around $3800. Eliminate checks to convicts and illegal aliens, and you can round it up to $4000. That would do one heck of a lot more to stimulate the economy than the government spending being proposed.

Want a fast return? Instead of checks, send everyone a $4000 Visa gift card, with a 6 month expiration, so the recipients have to buy something before the end of this summer. Believe me, cars, TVs, and airline tickets will start selling.

And you don't end up hiring hundreds of thousands of government employees who will burden the budget in future years.

[Viking]

And ironically, it has appreciated in value over the last 10 years more then most other investments. 

7.62 x 39 was what?  $79 per 1000 in 1999?

I thought the spike in ammo started just 2-3 years ago? Anyhow, whatever it is now, it's still cheap, comparatively. I don't want to know what 7.62 x 39 would cost on the black market if it was banned...