"I lied about WMD to hasten Iraq war"

[MillCreek]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41609536/ns/world_news-mideast/n_africa/

Wonderful. The primary source for allegations of Iraq holding WMD recants. He just wanted the Saddam government to fall.  So in a very real sense, the butcher's bill is in part due to this man.   

[French G.]

This only matters because we thought we needed a pretext to invade the place. Baghdad should have been occupied in 1991, we just lack the will to just say the guy is pure evil and needs to be attached to a rope. 100K killed is probably a drop in the bucket compared to lives lost in the intervening years.

[mtnbkr]

This only matters because we thought we needed a pretext to invade the place. Baghdad should have been occupied in 1991, we just lack the will to just say the guy is pure evil and needs to be attached to a rope. 100K killed is probably a drop in the bucket compared to lives lost in the intervening years.

So?  The world is full of evil dictators and now it's shown this guy was no real threat to us.  Was it worth the loss of American lives and Treasury?

If so, then I can come up with a rather lengthy list of bad guys we need to go after because it seems the only criteria is how evil they are.  Personally, I'd rather keep our soldiers alive and our money in our pockets.

Chris

[Jamisjockey]

This only matters because we thought we needed a pretext to invade the place. Baghdad should have been occupied in 1991, we just lack the will to just say the guy is pure evil and needs to be attached to a rope. 100K killed is probably a drop in the bucket compared to lives lost in the intervening years.

Hussein was only a problem because of us, propping him up for years until he pissed off the UN one too many times.
What really matters is cutting all funding to other countries, especially those run by dictators.  We now run a very real risk of Egypt turning into an islamofacist state.  Our 30 years of dumping funding into Mubarks pockets has gotten us nothing.

[Battle Monkey of Zardoz]

Bush is still at fault. He made the man lie. 

[MechAg94]

So was this guy the ONLY source for that intelligence? 

[lupinus]

Hussein was only a problem because of us, propping him up for years until he pissed off the UN one too many times.
What really matters is cutting all funding to other countries, especially those run by dictators.  We now run a very real risk of Egypt turning into an islamofacist state.  Our 30 years of dumping funding into Mubarks pockets has gotten us nothing.

Sure it has.

It's bought us a percentage of the population who hates us for propping up the guy who abused them for 30 years. One far larger and more rabidly anti-West then it otherwise would have been. And a percentage that is large enough that Egypt becoming the next Iran is a very real possibility.

[roo_ster]

Saddam was shooting at our (& the UK's) planes and was in violation of most of the 1990 Gulf War ceasefire agreements.  We needed no pretext to invade and destroy his regime as he broke the ceasefire agreement many, many times.

The only question that matters was, "Was it in our interests to do so?"

All else is hot air.

If this dude's revelation has any relevance, it is WRT the sorry state our intel orgs were/are in.

[RoadKingLarry]

I concur with Roo-ster. Saddam should have been taken out in '91. Barring that going back was the right thing to do but I think they (we) bollixed up the works by the way they went about the clean up.

[tyme]

Bush is still at fault. He made the man lie. 

Bush is partially at fault because he was ultimately responsible for the CIA, which evidently forgot how to do intel/counterintel properly sometime between the Angleton era and Clinton's liaisons in the Oval Office.

These days presidents seem to be more cheerleaders than anything else, but they're supposed to do things like make sure the directors of important agencies like the CIA know what they're doing.

[kgbsquirrel]

That this particular clown recanted his story about biological agents is neither here nor there in the grand WMD picture and same for the yellow cake issue. Why? Because we actually found chemical weapon artillery shells. It seems very convenient that the "there-was-no-WMD" crowd continues to ignore piddly little things such as Mustard, Sarin and VX which were actually used, and against civilians of a particular ethnic group no less.

[Waitone]

Wonderful. The primary source for allegations of Iraq holding WMD recants. He just wanted the Saddam government to fall.  So in a very real sense, the butcher's bill is in part due to this man.

No, actually the butcher's bill is due in part to US policy makers who used a single data point to drive war policy.  This man's tales were the excuse for war; not the reason.

[De Selby]

Was the war good for US interests is not the only question- Iraqis have rights to life and proprty like everyone else.  We also need to consider whether it was moral to visit that amount of destruction.

The only clear winner in Iraq, in any case, is Iran.  They've had nothing but beneficial change.

[Monkeyleg]

The only clear winner in Iraq, in any case, is Iran.  They've had nothing but beneficial change.

So, the Iraqi's aren't better off now with Saddam gone? Also, when you say that Iran has had nothing but beneficial change, do you mean the Iranian people or the government?

[De Selby]

So, the Iraqi's aren't better off now with Saddam gone? Also, when you say that Iran has had nothing but beneficial change, do you mean the Iranian people or the government?

No, Iraqis are not better off- they are dying in higher numbers, making less money, displaced by the millions, have been ethnically cleansed, and have infrastructure that's amazingly worse than before.  Saddam deserved what he got; that doesn't mean the Iraqis are doing better.

By Iran, I mean the government- it now has it's agents in charge of Iraq.  If Iraq does get stronger, Iran will have a great ally against it's gulf enemies.

[roo_ster]

Bush is partially at fault because he was ultimately responsible for the CIA, which evidently forgot how to do intel/counterintel properly sometime between the Angleton era and Clinton's liaisons in the Oval Office.

These days presidents seem to be more cheerleaders than anything else, but they're supposed to do things like make sure the directors of important agencies like the CIA know what they're doing.

It was called the "Church Committee."

[Monkeyleg]

No, Iraqis are not better off- they are dying in higher numbers...

Iraq death rate for 2010: 4.92 per 1000 population, source CIA World Fact Book:
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/iz.html

Iraq death rate for 2001: 6.01 per 1000 population, source CIA World Fact Book:
http://www.faqs.org/docs/factbook/geos/iz.html

That's all the fact-checking I have time for now. Maybe somebody else can research parts of your post to see how accurate it is.

(Of course, it is the CIA, and we all know how those f*****s lie).

[Tallpine]

It seems very convenient that the "there-was-no-WMD" crowd continues to ignore piddly little things such as Mustard, Sarin and VX which were actually used, and against civilians of a particular ethnic group no less.

Would those be the weapons that the US sold to our old buddy Saddam 

[roo_ster]

Would those be the weapons that the US sold to our old buddy Saddam 

You have earned yourself a  .  Enjoy!

[Monkeyleg]

The CIA World Factbook has more on Iraq.

2001 GDP (purchasing power parity): $59 billion
http://www.faqs.org/docs/factbook/geos/iz.html

2010 GDP (purchasing power parity): $117.7 billion
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/iz.html

The same report shows the per capita GDP at $2500 for 2001 and $3600 for 2010.

[TommyGunn]

Would those be the weapons that the US sold to our old buddy Saddam 

According to  SIPRI (Stockholm International Peace/Research Institute) America provided 1% of the arms sold to Iraq from the years 1973-2002.
Brazil sold them 2%, or twice as much.
Czechoslovakia sold them 7%
France 13%
And the former U.S.S.R. sold them 57%
So I think this bit of "blame America first" can be put to bed.
Unless you wanna send Brazil a nasty letter.
And maybe Russia a few.

[Perd Hapley]

Unless you wanna send Brazil a nasty letter.
And maybe Russia a few.

Are we going to put Anthrax in them?

[Nick1911]

Are we going to put Anthrax in them?

Mailing anthrax to the Russian government - a clever and convoluted way to commit suicide.

[Balog]

No, Iraqis are not better off- they are dying in higher numbers, making less money, displaced by the millions, have been ethnically cleansed, and have infrastructure that's amazingly worse than before.  Saddam deserved what he got; that doesn't mean the Iraqis are doing better.

By Iran, I mean the government- it now has it's agents in charge of Iraq.  If Iraq does get stronger, Iran will have a great ally against it's gulf enemies.

This is pure unadulterated blocks. Provide a scrap of evidence for any of these claims.

[Tallpine]

So I think this bit of "blame America first" can be put to bed.

Of course we've never meddled in ME affairs...