Why your child graduates high school and still can't perform

[Smith]

I have just had another discussion with my wife who happens to be a middle-school teacher.  Today they had a staff meeting regarding inventive ways on "how not to fail students."

Here is a little background:
My wife sees your little Johnny or Jane once or twice a week, depending on grade and course schedule.  She tries to keep order in your classroom despite your children thinking they are "entitled" to act up as much as possible.  She gives a lesson, assigns homework, gives tests, and quizzes.  At the end of the year, she calculates your child's grades and sends a report card home.

Here is what you don't see, or what you gloat about:

My wife is not allowed to fail your student.  If she does, she must have 7 documented talks with the parents within one quarter.  If she only sees your child once every week, or even twice, then she must speak to you every week which is unreasonable, as your child will not change from a F to an A (or even a C) average within one week's time...and she would have to start having talks with you THE FIRST WEEK to get all seven in before the end of the quarter.  

If she doesn't have at least 7 interactions with you, your child's grade will be curved and my wife will have negative repercussions at school...shorter lunches, inadequate office area, the coldest/moldiest/hottest room, extra duties both before and after school (such as watching your children come into school in the mornings, standing in the pouring rain until school starts or attending soccer, football, and baseball games) every day.  In other words, she will be at school for close to 12 hours every day, and given the worst facilities.  She will be deprived of being with her own three year old and her husband because of this.

She is not allowed to discipline your child with anything more than detention.  I suggested that she give a writing assignment to class clowns today, and weigh the paper as a test, but she IS NOT ALLOWED TO ASSIGN SCHOOL WORK AS A DISCIPLINARY ACTION!  It wouldn't matter anyway, as she MUST pass your child in order to maintain some level of daily sanity without harassment from the administration anyway.  

If your child doesn't turn in any homework or pass a single test all year, he will still pass the class.  She has no choice but to do so because she wants to come home to her family and she wants to enjoy being at her job and teaching the few students who actually care.

PARENTS, it is imperative that you take an active role in your child's education.  Do not blame the teacher, her hands are tied.  Blame yourselves as you have legislated to the point that your own child cannot be failed due to its own poor performance and it has only hurt the child.  My wife and every other teacher will not sacrifice their way of life nor their family's life for your pride.  

IT IS UP TO YOU TO MAKE YOUR CHILD PERFORM, NOT MY WIFE.

[matis]

"IT IS UP TO YOU TO MAKE YOUR CHILD PERFORM, NOT MY WIFE."


I agree with you, Smith.

That's why we home-schooled our daughter for 6 years, until she went to a religous private high-school.

You wife can do nothing to change things.


The teachers' unions, politicians and apathetic parents have created the school system they all deserve.

There is no possiblity of meaningful reform.


How can schools run by a central bureaucracy possibly satisfy the diverse interests of parents from many different religions, traditions, value systems?

In Europe the tuition money follows the child.  So even the public schools must compete for students and this results in far better schools.  They still indoctrinate their kids 'cause all government schools will do this.  But their kids score far higher than do Americans.


I would be very happy for my country and our children to see our public school collapse totally.  Only then can competition work to develop functional schools.


If we don't solve this problem, we will sink to the level of a third-world country.



matis

[Art Eatman]

1.  She taks up a new line of work.

2.  Y'all move somewhere else.  We don't have anything like that problem in Terlingua, which is why we have a lot more applications than are needed to fill the slots.

, Art

[Guest]

No kidding. Here, you don't do the work, you get failed. You screw up and your parents get called. If you really screw up, your parents get called and are told to kick your butt before sending you back to school. And if you need a hug, you get it.

[Felonious Monk/Fignozzle]

matis +1
...which is why we moved to Mayberry, and have to do without all those great cosmopolitan advantages like noise, crime, traffic, your kids being a number in a school.

And, we homeschool (2 out of 3 right now, 1 out of 3 beginning next fall).  Each year, we discuss, seek Wisdom, and decide what will be best for each child. It's worked thus far beyond our expectations-- my oldest is a Sophomore in public H.S. with an A average, and is in band, with plenty of friends, youth group, et cetera; in short: a MUCH better kid than *I* was!

Smith, I feel your pain.  My wife STILL substitutes at the H.S. a couple of days each week, and has an understanding with most of the kids: she's fair, but you'd better respect her and not try to 'get over' on her, because you get ONE chance with her.  After that, here come da consequences.  Principal & Veep back her 100%, too.  Guess that's just one of those things you get when your town is in a time warp, a geographical oddity 2 weeks from everything.

[natedog]

Just wondering where your wife teaches, I've never heard of anything like that. I'm a junior in high school, and if you get below a D in the class at the semester, you don't get the credit, period. If you're in an honor or AP class and get below a B you are dropped to general or college prep.

[IndianaDean]

20/20 last week profiled public schools. The government has to get out of education. As long as public schools are government-run, the system will fail. Private schools are the way to go. I support the voucher idea so kids can get into private schools.

[Guest]

20/20 last week profiled public schools. The government has to get out of education. As long as public schools are government-run, the system will fail. Private schools are the way to go. I support the voucher idea so kids can get into private schools.

I hope you realize that allowing "the masses" to attend private schools will do a lot to take away the things that make them better.

Yes, they generaly have better teachers and administrators, but they tend to have better kids too; Kids with parents who actually care about their education and have a desire to make their kids do well. One of the singular things that defines private schools is the ability to kick out kids who dont have the aptitude or character to succeed.

It may not seem that vouchers will make this a lot worse, but look at it this way. Most private schools are already turning away kids because they are full. These are all kids who's parents have a real commitment to their education. How many more of those kids should be sent away because of vouchered students? I realize that private schools arent cheap, but you may be suprised by how many poor families find a way to pay for their kids, it isnt easy, but they consider the education of their kids to be of paramount importance. Why should those kids be pushed away from the opportunity by the children of people who want a free ride?

[matis]

Guess that's just one of those things you get when your town is in a time warp, a geographical oddity 2 weeks from everything.

Long live time warps (is that a pun -- or a mixed metaphor??).


I guess in a Mayberry or a Terlingua one can still find pockets of sanity in the school system.

But most kids don't live there.



My lady also does substitute-teaching -- to get out of the house and to make a little extra $$.  She seems to enjoy it.  But the stories she brings home tell me that I couldn't make it through 10 minutes.


No real discipline, kids do assignments -- or they don't -- depends on how they feel.  No real consequences.  Even the better students are way below what should be grade level.  I've seen some of their "work".  Pitiful, pathetic, makes me feel hopeless.


But they get breakfast and lunch and bussed to and from school.

Better than running the streets, I guess.

Schools in better neighborhoods are better, but far from what they should be.



Either parents will take responsibility for their children -- or they'll hand that responsibility off to the state.

Works great for the state.  Until we sink into the third world.



Congrats, Fig.




matis

[Ex-MA Hole]

My sister used to teach.  She made the mistake of failing a kid in her class.  Principal called her to the office.  Seems you don't flunk a kid if Daddy's a local cop.

My sister refused to change the grade, citing that out of 4 tests, he failed 3 (63 on the other one), did 0 out of 10 homework assignments.  He also skipped class 2-3 times out of 15 classes.

Principal said to pass the kid.  My sister gave the principal her grade book and asked the principal to grade the students how she deemed!

The next day, my sister's car was keyed on school property.  No one saw it.  Police couldn't find anyone and was too busy to investigate.  She was also not asked back the following year (this was the 4th term).

This was 2 years ago, a school in Eastern MA.

Was she right?  Hell yeah, but, unfortunately, school is no longer school, but a business, and she wouldn't play the game...

[Felonious Monk/Fignozzle]

20/20 last week profiled public schools. The government has to get out of education. As long as public schools are government-run, the system will fail. Private schools are the way to go. I support the voucher idea so kids can get into private schools.

I hope you realize that allowing "the masses" to attend private schools will do a lot to take away the things that make them better.

Yes, they generaly have better teachers and administrators, but they tend to have better kids too; Kids with parents who actually care about their education and have a desire to make their kids do well. One of the singular things that defines private schools is the ability to kick out kids who dont have the aptitude or character to succeed.

It may not seem that vouchers will make this a lot worse, but look at it this way. Most private schools are already turning away kids because they are full. These are all kids who's parents have a real commitment to their education. How many more of those kids should be sent away because of vouchered students? I realize that private schools arent cheap, but you may be suprised by how many poor families find a way to pay for their kids, it isnt easy, but they consider the education of their kids to be of paramount importance. Why should those kids be pushed away from the opportunity by the children of people who want a free ride?

I am by no means a member of the economic literati; however, I think that what happens in that case is that you open education to a true free market economy; the prestigious expensive private prep schools, the Philips-Exeters of the world, will become ULTRA prestigious and ULTRA expensive, and everything will move into the void from there.  But by forcing the players to compete (teachers, administrators, Spec Ed specialists, Psych specialists, and the rest), the cream of the crop will rise to the top, command supersalaries, perks, and come into the same scale that athletes are currently on.

THEN, we get parity between the mathletes and the athletes.
If ARod makes 60 million for a 6 year contract, so should the standout researchers, or people who can turn a BRILLIANT but underachieving student with HUGE potential into alignment with what they might achieve.
Cancer? Cured.  AIDS? A note in the history books.  Hunger? eliminated. Energy? Free from the sun/global rotation/hydrogen or something...

Others can probably comment far more intelligently than me.