Author Topic: Bill Gates releases mosquitoes into audience  (Read 4798 times)

roo_ster

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Re: Bill Gates releases mosquitoes into audience
« Reply #25 on: February 06, 2009, 09:33:15 AM »
You know, BGates made a valid point by this.

Yes, if by "valid point" you mean "megalomaniac demonstrating his personality defects in public."
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Iain

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Re: Bill Gates releases mosquitoes into audience
« Reply #26 on: February 07, 2009, 07:22:46 PM »
Almost started a new thread - found an interesting blog.

http://membracid.wordpress.com/2009/02/06/bill-gates-malaria-and-mosquitoes/
Quote
Sadly, it only takes a few comments on the TED page until the “bring back DDT” drivel appears.  Sigh.

If you actually watch the complete talk, you see that Malaria was  NEVER eradicated in the equatorial areas, with or without DDT.  As I have said many, many times, malaria is a complicated problem, and no single chemical will be the solution.


http://membracid.wordpress.com/2007/06/13/ddt-malaria-insecticide-resistance/
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Cross resistance

This isn’t a mechanism of resistance, per se, but an unfortunate consequence. Sure, we can nuke mosquitoes with DDT. But we risk losing our chance to control insects with other pesticides if we overdo it with DDT.

In a recent study (3), malarial mosquitoes selected for DDT resistance also developed very high levels of cross-resistance to other pesticides–including malathion, permethrin, and bendiocarb. (Malathion is commonly sprayed in the US for mosquitoes.)

Unfortunately, the kdr trait confers cross-resistance to both the rapid paralytic and lethal actions of all known pyrethroids, as well as the pyrethrins and DDT(2). Most alarming, in field tests where the kdr resistance to DDT is present, the ability of pyrethroid-impregnated bed nets to prevent biting at night was compromised (”major loss of efficacy”).


http://membracid.wordpress.com/2009/02/05/new-research-on-bedbug-insecticide-resistance/ -
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The conclusion of the paper:

“This evidence suggests that the two mutations are likely the major resistance-causing mutations in the deltamethrin-resistant NY-BB through a knockdown-type nerve insensitivity mechanism.”

AND:

“Because DDT has been used indiscriminately to control many insect pest species including bed bug, the widespread and frequent use of DDT is likely to have predisposed bed bug populations to pyrethroid resistance through the neuronal insensitivity mechanism.“

So, what does this new information tell us?
- DDT will be utterly useless against bed bugs, so people should stop asking for it.
- We’re going to need a lot more research on ways to kill bedbugs other than just poisoning them with the usual pesticide suspects.
- In cities where there are active bed bug populations, insecticide choice for resistance management will be very important in urban entomology.
- Bedbugs are not going to go away, and you should probably be getting a little paranoid.
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MicroBalrog

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Re: Bill Gates releases mosquitoes into audience
« Reply #27 on: February 07, 2009, 08:12:01 PM »
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- Bedbugs are not going to go away, and you should probably be getting a little paranoid.

Why not?

Thousands of species go extinct every year, why can't bedbugs?
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seeker_two

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Re: Bill Gates releases mosquitoes into audience
« Reply #28 on: February 07, 2009, 10:34:21 PM »
Some people are horribly allergic to mosquito bites. Also, "fire in a crowded theater".

Sounds like a case of justifiable use of lethal force, to me.....  =D
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richyoung

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Re: Bill Gates releases mosquitoes into audience
« Reply #29 on: February 08, 2009, 02:53:56 AM »
Dude, I'm sure you know better than that.

DDT propaganda is not a useful source of information. Especially Milloy's nonsense. And this is another 'try to beat environmentalists with a stick' topic that we have been through before.

What he posted is stone cold fact - even Rucklehous, the guy that banned it here ni the US, admitted it was pure politics, no science....
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gunsmith

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Re: Bill Gates releases mosquitoes into audience
« Reply #30 on: February 08, 2009, 06:09:43 AM »
Why not?

Thousands of species go extinct every year, why can't bedbugs?

bed bugs are just horrible, I stayed in a hotel once that had them, the only way to not get bitten was to use a fogger or 2 or 3 every other day and to spray the bed every night.
When I moved out, everything got washed twice
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Harold Tuttle

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Re: Bill Gates releases mosquitoes into audience
« Reply #31 on: February 08, 2009, 12:05:58 PM »
heres one of the last projects I created for Natty Geo:

http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2007/07/malaria/malaria-video-interactive
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Iain

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Re: Bill Gates releases mosquitoes into audience
« Reply #32 on: February 08, 2009, 12:45:13 PM »
What he posted is stone cold fact - even Rucklehous, the guy that banned it here ni the US, admitted it was pure politics, no science....

What was 'stone cold fact' - the claim that DDT was banned and that this has led to the deaths of millions? That was the claim I was responding to, and I think I've provided enough to at least call that claim into question.

I'll state it again - DDT is not banned, is still used as Harold's presentation above shows.
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Manedwolf

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Re: Bill Gates releases mosquitoes into audience
« Reply #33 on: February 08, 2009, 12:46:01 PM »
What was 'stone cold fact' - the claim that DDT was banned and that this has led to the deaths of millions? That was the claim I was responding to, and I think I've provided enough to at least call that claim into question.

I'll state it again - DDT is not banned, is still used as Harold's presentation above shows.

It is banned in the US.

Iain

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Re: Bill Gates releases mosquitoes into audience
« Reply #34 on: February 08, 2009, 12:54:15 PM »
It is banned in the US.

There are exceptions to that ban, and ban was enacted to deal with the major impacts large scale DDT use was having. If you still had a malaria problem and its use was banned for indoor spraying, then you'd have a point re: malaria. That's not relevant to the deaths of millions of Africans.

Or apparently the bed bug scourge either.
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MicroBalrog

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Re: Bill Gates releases mosquitoes into audience
« Reply #35 on: February 08, 2009, 01:11:21 PM »
Actually, would'nt large-scale spraying have a powerful impact on mosquito habitat?
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

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Iain

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Re: Bill Gates releases mosquitoes into audience
« Reply #36 on: February 08, 2009, 01:29:08 PM »
Actually, would'nt large-scale spraying have a powerful impact on mosquito habitat?

Only where mosquitoes are still susceptible. What Carson seems to have been warning against really was the unknown impacts of mass pesticide use, DDT being the notable pesticide at the time. She pointed out known impacts such as large scale damage to water life, but also strange cases where certain bugs were more susceptible and died in greater numbers than their prey, meaning that although their prey took a significant hit they ultimately returned in larger numbers. An unknown effect.

Also, as noted above there is the concept of cross resistance. Large scale use of DDT has caused mosquitoes to become resistant to other pesticides too. India has apparently largely abandoned DDT use as malaria vector control because it has ceased to be effective. People try and use Sri Lanka as an example of the DDT 'ban':

Quote
For example, in Sri Lanka, the program reduced cases from about 3 million per year before spraying to just 29 in 1964. Thereafter the program was halted to save money, and malaria rebounded to 600,000 cases in 1968 and the first quarter of 1969. The country resumed DDT spraying, but it was largely ineffective because mosquitoes had acquired resistance to the chemical in the interim, presumably because of its continued use in agriculture. The program was forced to switch to malathion, which though more expensive, proved effective.[17]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DDT (a wiki link, but it has a reference there to a book I have seen referred to before on the Sri Lanka case)

The problem seems to be twofold - one is that DDT is claimed to be a panacea when scientists say that it is not, even its use for indoor spraying is questioned over its effectiveness. Also that Carson is blamed as the originator of the modern enviromentalist movement, and so attacks upon her (and thus DDT 'bans') are often shrill and unscientific (see the claims that she is worse than Hitler).
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