Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: Headless Thompson Gunner on January 08, 2010, 09:25:08 PM
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Several folks have started asking me for advice on disaster preparedness. Perhaps I should wonder why they're all pegging me as the expert on Armageddon preparations, but that's besides the point.
Problem is I don't know of any sound, sensible, non-kookish sources of info to direct them to. Googling turns up lots and lots of information, most of it completely worthless. Amazon has several books on the subject, but I've no way of knowing if the info they contain is more helpful than harmful.
So, anyone know of any books or websites that would be good to give to the SHTF noobs to get them started out right in disaster prep?
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ready.gov is a good start, except they are hoplophobic. Still, it focuses on 3 days at least. That's a start.
Neardeathexperiments.com is a pretty decent site. Despite its name, its founder and head admin (NineseveN) is extremely level headed in a multifaceted approach to disaster preparedness. I consider it a religion-free version of Frugal Squirrels.
Frugal Squirrels is then another good site. A bit preachy, but good.
Best general advice I've been given and that I parrot back to folks that ask me, is think of preparations ("preps") as a function of time. What do you need to survive for 3 days? A week? 3 weeks? 3 months? a year? Indefinitely?
10,000 bullets don't do much good for a guy that only has 2 gallons of water, six cans of chili and a bottle of mustard in the cupboard. Gotta layer those preps and intersperse the "buying" of things with the acquisition of skills that help you if you're self sufficient.
My next "prep" skill is some sort of EMT or Wilderness first responder training.
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Anything by FerFAL
http://www.amazon.com/dp/9870563457?tag=surviinargen-20&camp=14573&creative=327641&linkCode=as1&creativeASIN=9870563457&adid=0YS947GSKAMG2T1ARMC6&
http://www.ferfal.blogspot.com/
Primarily because he's living it. He was hit by the Argentine economic implosion.
Edit: For gear review, http://www.equipped.com/
Absolutely best kit reviews I've seen around. Not so much "survialist" oriented, but the real "survival" equipment in daily usage. Site has tons and tons of information, and is my first choice to look for vendors of a particular product I'm looking for.
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I'll second FerFal. He's btdt.
It's mild to middlin' out there, but www.survivalblog.com. A ton of good info going back years.
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A second for NEar Death Experiments, and to a lesser extent, Frugals and Survival Blog. As AZ said, preachy. Frugals also has a high number of armchair warriors, but if you stick to the articles posted by senior folks, you'll do fine. Just keep a low profile and ignore idiots.
Also worth reading through is the public section at Alpha Disaster Contingencies. Lots of great info there.
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I bought and recently finished John Wesley Rawles' (of survivalblog) 'How to Survive TEOTWAWKI" and it is a concise, thought-provoking read.
I also really enjoyed Cody Lundin's "When all Hell Breaks Loose". His approach is very zen-hippie, but also down to earth and not gear-centric. Emphasis on common household products and recycling. He really stresses working within your practical limitations.
SADShooter
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My experience with Frugal Squirrel is that many of these people can't wait for TEOTWAWKI (the end of the world as we know it, for those that don't know). They are looking forward to setting up their own fiefdom. They are very clicky, us 4 and no more. Don't expect an answer to a post till you have 10,000 posts under your belt. I don't know what is meant about religious. Unless it is the religion of TEOTWAWKI. I have seen them as anti-Christian to the extreme.
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NDE is a good forum. I should probably start posting there again, I've been absent a few years.
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The Survival Podcast.
Goes into lifestyle changes that make you less reliant on external systems (even talks about retirement via this method). Not kookish and goes well beyond natural/manmade disasters (how about simple unemployment as a problem to deal with?).
Chris
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http://www.google.com/reader/bundle/user%2F15790189256077409788%2Fbundle%2FPreparedness
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http://www.backwoodshome.com/
Backwoods Home has great info, good articles and the forum is good too.
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http://www.google.com/reader/bundle/user%2F15790189256077409788%2Fbundle%2FPreparedness
That article on using a knife for a defensive weapon is a breath of fresh air and common sense. I get really annoyed with some echo-chamber threads (cough *THR* cough) where claims are made that you need to have 15th degree blackbelts in 4 different secret martial arts to use a knife without having it taken it away from you and being raped with it, while three other threads describe you as good as dead if you let an emaciated street bum get within 10 step of you with a butterknife.
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Eh, it's not that hard to learn a few simple techniques for disarming someone with a knife. As such, I figure it's fairly likely that the badguy you intend to use your knife on knows how to take it away from you.
Anyway...
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BTW, click on my link and click on "Feeds" to see the list, and "subscribe" lets you add them to your reader. Anyone not know about RSS?
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Ah yes, the infamous ninja bad guys who'll easily take your gun/knife/baton away from you and use it against you. ;/
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If I can learn some simple tricks, just think what a ninja could do...
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Ever tried those simple tricks in FoF training with knives that give tactile feedback? Be interesting to see how well they actually work.
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Anyone not know about RSS?
Me.
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http://reader.google.com
That one's my favorite, but there are tons of 'em. You add an RSS (Really Simple Syndication) feed from a blog and it aggregates the daily posts for you, so you don't have to go from site to site for your daily reading. As you read each post you can mark it read, email it, leave it unread, or do a few other things with it. If there are too many (as usually happens in my news folder) you can mark them all read without reading them. I have mine set to display only unread posts.
Try it out, it will change the way you see the internet.
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Ever tried those simple tricks in FoF training with knives that give tactile feedback? Be interesting to see how well they actually work.
I have. That's why I believe it's entirely feasible to take a knife from someone.
Obviously training ain't the same as the real thing, but it should be indicative of what's possible.
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www.zombiehunters.org
Yea I know . . .
If you can get past the zombie metaphor they have some really good collective knowledge about putting together bug out bags, first aid kits, and other various knowledge for everyday use. Like reviews on tents, sleeping bags and what not. Plus they have a firearm section.
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Ever tried those simple tricks in FoF training with knives that give tactile feedback? Be interesting to see how well they actually work.
FoF? ???
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FoF? ???
Force on Force
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I have. That's why I believe it's entirely feasible to take a knife from someone.
Obviously training ain't the same as the real thing, but it should be indicative of what's possible.
If we presume there are such simple tricks to disarm a person with a knife without getting cut, would there not also be equally simple and easy to learn ways to avoid being disarmed?
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There were a great set of articles written by someone who survived Katrina, but i can't find them, maybe someone else can chime in with them?
EDIT: Found it:
http://www.theplacewithnoname.com/blogs/klessons/
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If we presume there are such simple tricks to disarm a person with a knife without getting cut, would there not also be equally simple and easy to learn ways to avoid being disarmed?
Not in my (admittedly limited) experience. Disarming a knife is a matter of leverage. You use your arm, hand, or body to wrench the blade out of the fingers that are holding on to it. It's a question of strong muscles (arm), amplified by leverage (knife blade and handle), working against weak muscles (fingers).
I didn't mean to misdirect the thread. I simply wanted to point out that there is some truth to the idea that a knife can be taken from you in a fight.
Back to the survival prep guides, s'il vous plait.
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If we presume there are such simple tricks to disarm a person with a knife without getting cut, would there not also be equally simple and easy to learn ways to avoid being disarmed?
Duct-taping the knife to your hand? :angel: :laugh: =D
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Wouldn't that require the person with the knife not, you know, cut the hand and arm reaching to grab the blade? Seems like you'd need to trap the arm holding the knife, secure a hold on the blade (wouldn't that cut your hand?), then apply leverage to wrench it out, all while the person with the knife allowed you to do it. Not picking a fight, I just really have doubts about how easy all that is to accomplish in an actual fight and I'm interested to hear about your experience. In the training you've done, was it full speed full contact with a resisting opponent? Did you use the simu-knives that leave paint marks, or the kind that actually shock you if you contact the edge?
In terms of information, here is a great primer on the pros and cons of the big 5 of backyard meat animals. And it's from Mother Earth News so even liberals shouldn't find it too out there and "survivalist-y." http://www.motherearthnews.com/Sustainable-Farming/1982-11-01/Comparing-the-Five-Best-Backyard-Livestock-Animals.aspx
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Wouldn't that require the person with the knife not, you know, cut the hand and arm reaching to grab the blade? Seems like you'd need to trap the arm holding the knife, secure a hold on the blade (wouldn't that cut your hand?), then apply leverage to wrench it out, all while the person with the knife allowed you to do it. Not picking a fight, I just really have doubts about how easy all that is to accomplish in an actual fight and I'm interested to hear about your experience. In the training you've done, was it full speed full contact with a resisting opponent? Did you use the simu-knives that leave paint marks, or the kind that actually shock you if you contact the edge?
Who said anything about not getting cut in the process?
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Exactly. In my (rather limited) knife disarming training, one thing which was emphasized was to expect to get cut.
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There were a great set of articles written by someone who survived Katrina, but i can't find them, maybe someone else can chime in with them?
EDIT: Found it:
http://www.theplacewithnoname.com/blogs/klessons/
An excellent link! This is just the sort of thing I'm looking for. I will pass it along to the folks tonight.
Thanks!
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Who said anything about not getting cut in the process?
So.... I dunno, seems like a losing proposition. I mean, sure now you're both unarmed, but you're bleeding and have lost functionality. Would you say "Guns are useless cause you can take them away easily. Of course you get shot in the process..."
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Yes, if you try to disarm a knife-wielding dude you'll probably get cut. Probably get cut pretty badly. What of it? Would you rather he kept his knife so that he can keep stabbing and slashing at you indefinitely?
Look, I'm really not sure what you're on about. I think you're reading things into this discussion that aren't there. Nobody said knives were useless, or that you shouldn't carry one, or that you shouldn't use a gun, or whatever else you seem to be imagining.
And you also seem to have some rather romantic notions about knife fighting banging about in your head, about it being an easy and clean and pleasant business. I think you might be wise to work those ideas through, just in case you ever need to fight with a knife or against a guy with a knife. You don't need to be an expert, and I'm certainly not an expert myself, but a little perspective might go a long way.
Now, please, can we get back to the regularly scheduled SHTF-guide-for-noobs thread?
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Simmer down now. On gun forums, many people are vehemently opposed to carrying a knife for self-defense unless you are some fifth degree ninja master, and the reason inevitably given is that "The bad guy will just take it away from you." I was merely pointing out that knives are valid self defense tools even if one has not had extensive training in it, though obviously moar training is always better than less.
I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that I'm romanticizing knife fighting. I've certainly not said anything to indicate that. I've been commenting that one does not need to be some type of highly trained master for a knife to be an effective self defense tool.
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Exactly. In my (rather limited) knife disarming training, one thing which was emphasized was to expect to get cut.
First rule of knife fighting. Most like, one of you is going to the hospital. The second is probably going to the morgue.
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Simmer down now. On gun forums, many people are vehemently opposed to carrying a knife for self-defense unless you are some fifth degree ninja master, and the reason inevitably given is that "The bad guy will just take it away from you." I was merely pointing out that knives are valid self defense tools even if one has not had extensive training in it, though obviously moar training is always better than less.
I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that I'm romanticizing knife fighting. I've certainly not said anything to indicate that. I've been commenting that one does not need to be some type of highly trained master for a knife to be an effective self defense tool.
I can't account for the attitudes seen on other internet gun boards. I can only react to the attitudes I see here.
If those internet gun board people are saying it's possible for an attacker to get your knife out of your hand, then they're right. It's not particularly hard to do, and you should expect any serious street thug to know how to do it. It certainly isn't an idea that you should roll your eyes at.
You also seem surprised or unaware that you'll end up getting cut in a knife fight. This is romantic in the extreme. Knife fighting is messy, nasty business. You'll get cut. Badly. Getting cut isn't a "losing proposition", it's an inevitability. If you plan to use a knife as a defensive tool, then you'd best make peace with that.
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My comments were more geared towards "If someone attacks you with a knife, trying to wrench it out of his hands might be sub-optimal compared to say, evading or shooting him." And I still contend one could do disabling damage to someone trying to disarm you, prior to that happening.
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=|
Ok.
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www.zombiehunters.org
Yea I know . . .
If you can get past the zombie metaphor they have some really good collective knowledge about putting together bug out bags, first aid kits, and other various knowledge for everyday use. Like reviews on tents, sleeping bags and what not. Plus they have a firearm section.
Agreed. I post there as The Business End. The zombie bit is all good fun, to help the general public get past the assumptions of nuttiness. There are a good number of morons there, but no more than any other forum(except - and I truly mean this - APS and a very few others). More importantly, there are some VERY good how-tos from people who, to some degree, "living it". There are frequent discussions on water collection/storage, gardening, etc. Recently a detailed walkthrough for producing dish soap from common stuff. I recommend ZS. Maybe not for everyone, but lots of good fun to be had, if nothing else.
As for the knife bit... look at Headless Thompson Gunner's avatar... that's the rest of us.
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Yeah, sorry about that. I can't take a gun to work so I'm stuck with a knife and get tired of taking crap for it on internet forums, so I'm probably over defensive.
To contribute something useful...
A guide to emergency medicine in the wilderness. Ignore the incredibly ugly website design. http://www.wemsi.org/
This is a pretty interesting site about backyard auquaponics. http://www.backyardaquaponics.com/
A huge collection of .mil medical manuals. http://www.vnh.org/
Here's a couple seed places.
http://www.everlastingseeds.com/
http://www.seedsavers.org/
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Found this and was reminded of this thread. Haven't read a whole lot on it, but seems fairly non-kookish and down to earth.
http://thesurvivalmom.com/
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How about the LDS church? http://www.providentliving.org
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As vehemently as I disagree with their theology, I must say Mormons are at the top of my list of "good neighbors with strongly different religious views to have if tiki-wiki happens." Their only real competition being Sikhs. =D
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or the Wallace (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Wallace) clan :O hey at least you'd be entertained. :angel: i would much rather be fighting than just hiding. [popcorn]