Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: Fly320s on March 20, 2017, 10:12:19 AM
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http://fox59.com/2017/03/18/idaho-boy-sprayed-by-cyanide-planted-by-us-department-of-agriculture-dog-killed/
What the f*ck? The department of Agriculture plants cyanide traps in public areas without any warning signs? That is criminal negligence in my book.
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"I'm from the Government ... I'm here to help."
Yeah, right. Incomprehensibly stoopid.
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On Friday, US Department of Agriculture Wildlife Services told EastIdahoNews.com this is the first unintentional discharge of an M-44 in Idaho since 2014.
Well, if it was that long ago since the last accident, gee, what's everyone getting worked up about? ;/
I can't believe they didn't put a ridiculous amount of warning signs around the area. Steel signs freakin' cemented into the ground so they can't be easily removed. If a private individual or organization did this, there would already be charges.
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Well, if it was that long ago since the last accident, gee, what's everyone getting worked up about?
"In Idaho" "since 2014" is way too many qualifiers on how often poison gas booby traps go off on people or pets.
ETA: looks like the Wikipedia article shows a couple of incidents in Utah. Hard to believe they're not more common than what's reported there, though. Also shows that the device should include bilingual signage.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8b/M44_cyanide_device.png)
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Aren't booby traps illegal on private property because you don't control when they're set off and you could injure/kill someone unjustifiably?
It seems like that same logic should be applied to public property. I get that 'yote populations can be a real problem, we're having issues with some aggressive Coydogs where I live. It just seems like trapping and/or shooting them might be safer than poison mines.
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What the actual *expletive deleted*ck?!?! Can we PLEASE choke the living *expletive deleted*it out of the US Department of Agriculture Wildlife Services who planted these damned indiscriminate killers?
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I guess I am a bit surprised we haven't heard of more incidents with this. If not people, then livestock.
It does seem like someone screwed up putting the things right on the edge of their property. I imagine that is the main discussion at that agency right now.
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Why is it even in a residential area first of all?
Second of all why isn't this bigger news?
http://www.sacbee.com/news/investigations/wildlife-investigation/article2574606.html
Guess the problem was noticed several years back and an attempt was made to outlaw them.
Look at these numbers. This is as of 2012, who knows how many more since.
Agency records show that more than 3,400 animals have been mistakenly killed by M-44s since 2006, including black bears, bobcats, raccoons, opossums, ravens, ringtails, red fox, gray fox, kit fox, swift fox, turkey vultures and dogs.
At least 18 employees and several members of the public have been exposed to cyanide, too, over the past 25 years. None died, but many were treated for nausea, blurred vision and other symptoms.
Read more here: http://www.sacbee.com/news/investigations/wildlife-investigation/article2574606.html#storylink=cpy
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I can't imagine that happening to my family. I'd think I was in the twilight zone. They've got landmines out there like it's the Balkans, or something. :facepalm:
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Why is it even in a residential area first of all?
My first guess would be that the "residential area" looked like "wilderness" to some city raised tard who works for the ag dept.
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What farking bureaucrat thought that was a good idea ?!?!?!?
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This is absolutely unimaginable. I've got a very low opinion of most government employees, but CONGRATULATIONS DoA (there's a rather foreboding acronym), you failed even my admittedly low expectations for government workers.
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And we thought it was a bad thing that they had submachine guns...
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And we thought it was a bad thing that they had submachine guns...
Just wait until the DOD adds claymores to the 1033 program.....
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From the linked story in the OP:
“I see this little pipe that looked like a sprinkler sticking out of the ground,” Canyon told EastIdahoNews.com. “I go over and touch it. Then it makes a pop sound and it spews orange gas everywhere.”
The orange gas was cyanide, and it sprayed into Canyon’s left eye and on his clothing.
Shouldn't someone be facing TERRORISM charges because they set a dirty bomb / WMD in the USA?
This isn't a tongue-in-cheek comment - I'm serious. It EXPLODED and spewed POISON GAS. How the <expletive> can even a .gov worker get away with this crap? :mad:
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From the linked story in the OP:
Shouldn't someone be facing TERRORISM charges because they set a dirty bomb / WMD in the USA?
This isn't a tongue-in-cheek comment - I'm serious. It EXPLODED and spewed POISON GAS. How the <expletive> can even a .gov worker get away with this crap? :mad:
A "pop" doesn't mean an explosion. According the Wiki page ("but that's what they want you to know!") for the M44, it's spring-driven.
Also, they apparently aren't designed to kill more than one thing at a time, so they're not exactly a "mass destruction" device.
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A "pop" doesn't mean an explosion. According the Wiki page ("but that's what they want you to know!") for the M44, it's spring-driven.
Also, they apparently aren't designed to kill more than one thing at a time, so they're not exactly a "mass destruction" device.
Anyone in the vicinity would be affected. (along with anyone attempting to render aid, as Cyanide is pretty persistent). In addition, being that it is a Chemical weapon it meets the WMD standard.
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It's OK. It was planted by the government, and they're here to help us.
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Well, if it was that long ago since the last accident, gee, what's everyone getting worked up about? ;/
I can't believe they didn't put a ridiculous amount of warning signs around the area. Steel signs freakin' cemented into the ground so they can't be easily removed. If a private individual or organization did this, there would already be charges.
Given the federal regulations for signage that lawn care companies must comply with when they do lawn applications, you'd think that the Government would...
Oh wait, silly me. The government routinely excuses/exempts itself from just about all regulations that it enacts on the little people...
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A "pop" doesn't mean an explosion. According the Wiki page ("but that's what they want you to know!") for the M44, it's spring-driven.
Also, they apparently aren't designed to kill more than one thing at a time, so they're not exactly a "mass destruction" device.
So if I do something like adapting a mouse trap to spew cyanide over a limited area in front of my house or a public park and some kid and his dog get sprayed with cyanide . . . they WON'T charge me with a terrorist act and put me in a prison cell so deep I'll need a tunnel to see sunlight?
I don't think I'm going to test that premise.
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Doesn't everyone need a bouncing betty style cyanide mine?
Get fun at parties.
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So if I do something like adapting a mouse trap to spew cyanide over a limited area in front of my house or a public park and some kid and his dog get sprayed with cyanide . . . they WON'T charge me with a terrorist act and put me in a prison cell so deep I'll need a tunnel to see sunlight?
I don't think I'm going to test that premise.
I don't disagree with the terrorism part. I'm just not convinced this thing is a WMD.
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Doesn't everyone need a bouncing betty style cyanide mine?
Get fun at parties.
Yeah, tie it in with those cell phone apps that you use to answer your doorbell when you are not home. [ar15]
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I don't disagree with the terrorism part. I'm just not convinced this thing is a WMD.
FedGov and FBI says it is.
In July 2006, the FBI created the Weapons of Mass Destruction (WMD) Directorate to build a cohesive and coordinated approach to incidents involving chemical, biological, radiological, or nuclear (CBRN) material—with an overriding focus on prevention. The WMD Directorate proactively seeks out and relies on intelligence to drive preparedness, countermeasures, and investigations designed to keep WMD threats from becoming reality.
WMD Basics
Definition of WMD
Title 18 U.S.C. §2332a defines weapons of mass destruction (WMD) as:
Any explosive, incendiary, or poison gas, including the following: a bomb; grenade; rocket having an explosive or incendiary charge of more than four ounces; missile having an explosive or incendiary charge of more than one-quarter ounce; mine; or device similar to any of the previously described devices;
Any weapons that is designed or intend to cause death or serious bodily injury through the release, dissemination, or impact of toxic or poisonous chemicals, or their precursors;
Any weapon involving a disease organism; and
Any weapon that is designed to release radiation or radioactivity at a level dangerous to human life.
https://www.fbi.gov/investigate/wmd
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I stands corrected. Obviously, though, the USDA can be trusted with these things. They're the government, after all. They have top men working on this.
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Well, you're supposed to take great care in using pest control methods to avoid affecting non-target species.
I guess they didn't.
The real solution to avoiding non-target species is to use a fairly accurate rifle on coyotes and re-institute bounties for them. But noooooo. Gunses is baddyness, ick, poo, yuck.
At one point in time the State of Colorado offered a rather large bounty (for the time) for coyotes. They seem to have stopped that, but the farm associations then offered the bounties privately. Don't know what the present status is, haven't done any varmint hunting for decades.
Terry
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Aren't booby traps illegal on private property because you don't control when they're set off and you could injure/kill someone unjustifiably?
Different rules for the government of course ;/ ;/ ;/
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At one point in time the State of Colorado offered a rather large bounty (for the time) for coyotes. They seem to have stopped that, but the farm associations then offered the bounties privately. Don't know what the present status is, haven't done any varmint hunting for decades.
I wish my state would put a bounty on coyotes -- or coydogs, or whatever it is we have around here. Coyotes are not native to this corner of the U.S., but they're here and they're becoming more of a nuisance every year.
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We see coyotes trotting through the yard and around the neighborhood about once a week. Two feet high at the shoulder, I estimate.
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Have a ton of 'yotes around here but I am worried about them doing this with hogs.
Landowners can shoot on sight but we can not hunt them. They think if we can hunt them more people will turn them loose in the state.
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Have a ton of 'yotes around here but I am worried about them doing this with hogs.
Landowners can shoot on sight but we can not hunt them. They think if we can hunt them more people will turn them loose in the state.
"Hunting opportunity" is in my opinion a significant contributor to the rise of feral hog problems in much of the US.
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Used in my county for yote control. Just another reason to keep my dog close to home when I lived in a more rural part.
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The controlled burns have multiple aspects. As in Mike's example, you have the "oh well" thing when the gov does it, but then you only have to look at the Malheur Wildlife Refuge occupation, which centered on the gov sending private individuals to jail for a controlled burn, which as I recall, mostly went right.
[snip]
Whether controlled burns or trapping pests or what have you, common sense seems to be all too often lacking in the implementation. The point is that private individuals are generally punished for their carelessness while gov generally is not punished.
The local sheriff in the Idaho case IMHO should arrest some DoA supervisor. Not sure the exact charges but it should be a felony; Reckless endangerment, or something. Handcuffs, perp walk, the whole deal. When they protest and claim immunity, say something like "I'm just trying to keep you from getting lynched" Say it loud enough to telegraph the idea to the locals.
If the boy had died instead of the dog, I think someone swinging from a lamppost would be quite appropriate if no other means of justice was available.
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That is horrific.
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It's OK when the government does it. They know what they're doing.
Like in New Mexico in 2000 when the forest service decided to do a controlled burn in the Los Alamos area.
In the middle of a drought.
And in high *expletive deleted*ing wind conditions.
About a dozen of my coworkers lost property, more than a few lost pretty much everything, including pets, when the "controlled" burn became the uncontrolled, 48,000 acre Cerro Grande fire.
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It's OK when the government does it. They know what they're doing.
Like in New Mexico in 2000 when the forest service decided to do a controlled burn in the Los Alamos area.
In the middle of a drought.
And in high *expletive deleted*ing wind conditions.
About a dozen of my coworkers lost property, more than a few lost pretty much everything, including pets, when the "controlled" burn became the uncontrolled, 48,000 acre Cerro Grande fire.
The controlled burns have multiple aspects. As in Mike's example, you have the "oh well" thing when the gov does it, but then you only have to look at the Malheur Wildlife Refuge occupation, which centered on the gov sending private individuals to jail for a controlled burn, which as I recall, mostly went right.
Then on the other side, NOT doing controlled burns, you end up with California. We've had year long fire seasons for several years not only because of the drought, but because the econazis kept suing to stop controlled burns. Combustible vegetation got so out of hand that natural fires (or even arson) that might have been contained early, become spectacular blazes that can't be stopped.
Whether controlled burns or trapping pests or what have you, common sense seems to be all too often lacking in the implementation. The point is that private individuals are generally punished for their carelessness while gov generally is not punished.
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There've been a couple of controlled burns around here which weren't. Some less worse than others.
What bothers me is:
1. Farmers who get an ag burn permit and then figure, "Wul hell, I gots me a burn permit, so nothing can happen if I just burn them weeds under them pine trees. I gotta piece of paper which says it's OK." As if the permit itself prevented forest fires.
2. Citified folks who just toss cigarette butts into the forest litter as if the whole world is surfaced with concrete and asphalt.
3.
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What in the actual *expletive deleted*ing *expletive deleted*ck?
We have to stop asking if they can get more stupid. Because the dumb shits are taking it as a challenge apparently.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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What's number 3?
Stealth controlled burns by UN agents?
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And often private homeowners are prevented from clearing space around their home as a fire break.
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We see coyotes trotting through the yard and around the neighborhood about once a week. Two feet high at the shoulder, I estimate.
Well, now you know who to call to get some help. =D
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Well, now you know who to call to get some help. =D
(https://cdn.meme.am/instances/76183356.jpg)
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(https://cdn.meme.am/instances/76183356.jpg)
It is because of this:
(https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRFQ9QPW0kJy0NxsS1qEqzSVoFvt1A-Q-d3NScS3UsyWK0dxA7QGw)
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It is because of this:
(https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRFQ9QPW0kJy0NxsS1qEqzSVoFvt1A-Q-d3NScS3UsyWK0dxA7QGw)
Nice outfit, I see you opted for neither the tie or bow tie.
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Nice outfit, I see you opted for neither the tie or bow tie.
:laugh:
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I have to ask, because I'm not about to do the requisite search, is that a brony or has Rainbow Brite gotten a deviant following as well?
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I have to ask, because I'm not about to do the requisite search, is that a brony or has Rainbow Brite gotten a deviant following as well?
When I did a Google image search for 'my little pony cosplay male', that was one of the images that came up.
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When I did a Google image search for 'my little pony cosplay male'
... as one does.
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I have to ask, because I'm not about to do the requisite search, is that a brony or has Rainbow Brite gotten a deviant following as well?
As far as I know, Rainbow Brite has been regulated to sexy Halloween costumes for the ladies.
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I think there would be a rash of random deaths at .Gov agency related to the death of my kid or dog.
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When I did a Google image search for 'my little pony cosplay male', that was one of the images that came up.
...he said unconvincingly.
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...he said unconvincingly.
Strange how it only came up with the picture of millcreek and not the one of jamis.
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I think there would be a rash of random deaths at .Gov agency related to the death of my kid or dog.
I couldn't think of a way to say it with that much plausible deniability.
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As far as I know, Rainbow Brite has been regulated to sexy Halloween costumes for the ladies.
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1249.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fhh509%2FOaktree12%2F17191045_777224045762641_5647511731978047002_n_zpsw8rmfmhn.jpg&hash=2b2a432d8b6276add12740376f7fe433e40a9a25)
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https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/canyons-law-ban-wildlife-services-using-m-44-cyanide-devices-cyanide-and-compound-1080-predator-control
Family has an online White House petition to stop the use of these.
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https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/canyons-law-ban-wildlife-services-using-m-44-cyanide-devices-cyanide-and-compound-1080-predator-control
Family has an online White House petition to stop the use of these.
God knows those have worked for everything else, may as well try for this.
Maybe somebody should give them the name of their elected representatives in DC so they can address it as it should be, with the agency for a rule change.
bob
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God knows those have worked for everything else, may as well try for this.
Maybe somebody should give them the name of their elected representatives in DC so they can address it as it should be, with the agency for a rule change.
bob
I believe that has also been done.
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http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/04/11/usda-halts-use-m-44-cyanide-bombs-in-idaho-following-death-family-pet.html
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http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/04/11/usda-halts-use-m-44-cyanide-bombs-in-idaho-following-death-family-pet.html
That is at least a small step in the right direction. Now why not stop using them altogether, not just in Idaho?