trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask

[KALIFORNIST]

afew questions.I was on the firing line and refered here sorry if this is the wrong place.I am in the process of joining the army but I have afew questions that I am hoping can be answered.I get as much info that I can from my recruiter but I would like a little non biased info .I am 25 and not nearly as fit as I was at 19 so I am alittle worried about not making the minimum APFTscores.from what I understand is if you do not pass you get recycled and start boot all over again.How many actually dont pass that you have seen?Its not that I am that bad but I have had to cut weight drastically to make the min weight requirement.I am 5 10 and the current max is 192. 7 weeks ago when I walked into the recruiters I was at 241,now I am at about 196.I lost about 45 pounds in 7 weeks by counting calories and eating about 1200 a day with many small meals.Unfortunatley I lost alot of muscle as well and I am at a fraction of my strength and work very long hours so I can only work out a little a week.I will be going to san diego in a week or two as soon as I make weight and picking my mos.I was thinking 11b or 11c.What do you guys recomend or should I just go in as a 11x and let them pick.I also have some interest in jump school if possible and would like feedback on that as well.thanks for the info

[ilbob]

I don't know what the military answer is but losing that much weight in such a short period of time is likely to take a while to recover from.

[Sergeant Bob]

Your being able to lose that much weight in that short a time shows that you can definitely commit yourself to goal (a difficult one at that) and be successful.

If you could you would be better off getting yourself back into shape before you go. However, I'm sure there are a lot of guys who started out in worse shape than you and still made it. If you are determined, you can do it.

[Bogie]

First question: WHY are you going in the Army?

Second question: WHAT are you looking to gain from the experience?

Third question: WHAT do you think military life is like?
 

[KALIFORNIST]

First question: WHY are you going in the Army?

Second question: WHAT are you looking to gain from the experience?

Third question: WHAT do you think military life is like?
 

I am joining because I am 25,I have no kids/wife to support.I do not own a home and do not have many financial obligations.My job will be waiting for me when I get out and If it isnt I can get one just like it.I am not doing anything right now that is so important that I cant go into the army and do my part.If we were not at war and not stretched thin then I wouldnt be interested.I make decent money and I enjoy my life.

I am not really trying to gain anything. "Ask not what your country can do for you - ask what you can do for your country"
I am undecided on if this is a just war or not but that is not the point.I would like to think that by doing my part just maybe a fellow american(more then likely a 20 year old kid who has been over there for 15 months)may get to go homefor a while.Hopefully as a after thought I might get some positive things like seeing other parts of the world,making new friends,and improving myself as a person but thats just what they are,after thoughts.

I think military life will probably be alot more structured then my currnet way of living and alot more work but I grew up in some of the most structured and hard living group homes/placements when I was a kid and I survived and flourished so I am confident that I will be fine.


anyone have thoughts on 11x,11b,11c ?

[thebaldguy]

At this time, if you're going into the military, learn something. Welding, mechanical, computers, medical, etc. Learn something you can use when you get out. I wish I would have.

Give your choice of joining the military some serious thought. This is not something to be taken lightly. I'm guessing this mess in the Middle East will be going on for a long time to come. You may find yourself extended way past your exit date.

Talk with some people who have left the military recently. Ask them why they left, think about it before you go.

[Bogie]

Yeah - and think about what you REALLY want to do... You say our job will be there when you get out in several years (or are you talking about a national guard/reserve position? Those guys get activated too...). What do you do for a living? Would you like to do something different? The military can train you in some highly desirable skillsets. 11-bang-bang is NOT a civilian job skill, and while the tacticool folks seem to think it's the bee's knees, you'll understand the true concept of "hurry up and wait" real fast... And you'll also come to understand that some of the folks in the Infantry are there to be the world's best soldiers, but there will also be a sizable percentage who are there because they couldn't figure out anything else.
 
And don't let the enlistment bonus thing throw you. I'd rather have a job skill that's worth an extra $20K/year on top of what you're making now when I'd get out than have a $20K one-time enlistment bonus.
 
Personally, I wish they took back old fat guys with bad knees... I was 71Q, and a darn good one... When I was a kid, I wanted to be Ernie Pyle...
 

[Balog]

11-bang-bang is NOT a civilian job skill

Amen. I was a grunt, albeit in the Marines. Unless you plan on being a mercenary ie contract security, it does nothing for you after you get out. And it will destroy your body. Even 18 y/o's who played sports and are in great shape leave with bad knees, bad backs etc. God didn't intend us to strap 60-80 lbs of gear on and do wind sprints, or take a knee and stay in that position for a couple hours. I did both in Iraq a lot; it sucked.

How dedicated are you to killing bad guys as opposed to just serving? Consider being a tanker. Just as much fun playing with boomy-ness, less getting killed. Still not useful in the real world tho. Comm guys often end up in grunt units and they get clearances. Medics are beloved and no matter what you end up doing you can say you helped save lives. And it's about the most directly relevant to a civilian career. Think about being a medic.

Or a corpsman in the Navy. Not slamming the dog-faces, but you're a lot better off in combat surrounded by Marines. I lost count of how many 'terps we had who refused to work with the Army; they knew they weren't as safe as with us.

[KALIFORNIST]

I am a cable guy.I install high speed internet,dig tv,dig phone,and computer networking.Not a bad paying job that allready is hard on my knees and back.I can get a job anywhere in the country when I get out from working for cable,dish,telco,or even just homenetworking and custom so I will always have a job that pays reasonably well.Unfortuanately I was a knuckle head in my youth and got into some trouble.nothing big but enough that I had to get a waiver for the army and the marines are not interested in me plus I also have a good amount of tattoos on my arms(something the marines dont care for but the army doesnt mind,wierd).I got a 80 on my asvab so I can pretty much do any job I would like but I wont be able to get alot of jobs that require security clearence.I also dont think that I am going to be recieving any sign on bonus at all because I have a GED but do not have 15 college credits that are needed to qualify for enlistment bonuses(I could be wrong on this but If I get one great.if not oh well).Thanks for the advice

[Bogie]

So, dude, this isn't rocket science. Do something that'll move you from being a cable guy to a cable guy manager, where you're telling other folks that they are gonna need to do stuff. You know the hardware part - get Unca Suga to teach you the software part... Where are you? We could probably find someone who is "in the club" to hit the recruiter with you, because, well, recruiters are up there with used car salesmen and emergency room lawyers... And if you think he's your buddy, well, that stops the second after he gets you to sign.
 

[Thor]

Kali, look at body fat percentage. As an alternative, they will measure your neck, waist, and height. Then they will cross it over to a chart. If you're within limits, you're good to go. Your recruiter SHOULD have told you this. In my experience, people that fail a particular part of the PFT in Basic would get remedial training or set back a week, depending on how much work they needed and their motivation. I'm not sure how the Army does things. I was a Navy recruiter. The better place to ask would be over HERE There's an Active duty Army recruiter that frequents there. I would also recommend that you get into the Signal Corps and obtain a four year degree while you're active. That will open a LOT of doors for you during and afterwards.

Bogie, your attitude disappoints me. I've run across people I've recruited  while back in the fleet. None of them wanted to kick my butt or had any ill feelings towards me.

[Chris]

Thor, unfortunately, as in all aspects of life, there are good recruiters and bad ones.  You know what we mean by that.

As to the military question, I'm former Army, a vet of the Cold War, which means I shot a lot of paper, plastic, and lasers at OpFor in war games.  I have to say ditto on the job skills.  No one can play combat soldier forever.  And, when all is said and done, you'll still need a paycheck on the other side...

[Bogie]

And I've known kids who've had recruiters hard-sell 'em on open contract stuff.... All the while telling them that they were gonna really go into the stuff they -really- wanted to do... Junior gets REAL upset when he finds out that instead of going to helicopter mechanic or MP school, he's going to get to dig holes and paint rocks for the duration...
 
Maybe YOU were ethical, but there are a lot out there who aren't...

[KALIFORNIST]

Let me repeat this real quick.I am not doing this for me other then satisfaction of serving.From what I have read and the people I have talked to ground soldiers are one of the most needed jobs.I just did some research and found that for my age the min apft of 50 points is
31 pushups in 2 minutes.43 sit ups in 2 minutes and a 2 mile run under 17:30.even though this is the min to get out of boot camp I can do the pushup and situp min right now.The 2 mile run is the only thing that I couldnt pass right now.So I am not as worried as I was.I am going to be on the battle field in one form or another.I am just not sure of the mos 11b,11c,11x.Field Artillery looks interesting and so does armor.

[Bogie]

Dude. You're smarter than average. Your brains can be better used. Remember that COMMUNICATIONS is how the Army _guides_ the folks on the ground. If that's screwed up, well...

My father credits the Red Ball Express with winning WWII... And I think he's right. The supply chain, or the communications chain, is what is going to win this one. Get your head wrapped around that, and you'll end up as one of the heroes. Maybe not one with dusty boots, but a hero nonetheless. Use your skills. Use your talents.

 
 

[Leatherneck]

Great future in comms in all the services: networking is extremely high priority now and in the future. Even at the tactical level units need network admins and techs, and the Army is paying big bucks to make Future Combat System (FCS) a reality. A guy with your background would be ideal.

That said, I wonder if the past problems you alluded to might inhibit your progress in those high-tech fields. Maybe you should look a little deeper into what clearances you could eventually get.

Congratulations and thank you for wanting to serve.

TC

[KALIFORNIST]

      I went to the recruiters office today to measure my progress and mentioned the body fat %.I was measured and at 197 at a hieght of 5 10 my body fat % is at 29%.I must admit that I am a little embarressed to let myself go that far.The max for my age and height is 26% so they mentioned that I can also do something called the box or step test.I tried it out right there and passed it easily.To pass you have to step up on to a box about chair seat height and back down to a beat for 5 minutes straight.If you pass then they make a slight exception on weight.I was huffing a little but I could have done another minute if I had to then pass out.I am set to go to either LA or San Diego on monday night for a tuesday morning physical.If I am able to make 192 then I dont have to take the step test but atleast I have a back up If i dont make weight.After that I come back and they push my waiver in that looks pretty good then I go back to get my job.
       As far as the job I understand what you guys are saying and I am putting it to thought.I say this to be honest and I truely do not want to come of cocky but I am a smart guy.The only reason I only scored a 80 on my asvab is because I havent studied or used any type of math at all in the last 9 years and there was a good amount of math in the asvab.I am kind of kicking myself for not spending afew hours go over math before hand like basic algebra and percentage conversions.I maxed out afew other subjects which helped me out alot.lol.The wierd thing is I tested at college level for almost everything when I was like 15 but My spelling was at a 8th grade level and probably still is.Go figure at how the mind works.I will have to look into security clearences and how they work in a little more depth.

[Sergeant Bob]

He's 25 and he knows what he wants.

Good for you Kali, it sounds like you have your head on straight and boot camp should not be a problem for you. It should be an experience you won't regret and will benefit you in ways beyond whatever your particular training provides.

[Bogie]

Seriously, look at the higher tech stuff first. That may be where you can be best used. You can ALWAYS request a transfer to infantry while you're in basic, but it'd be a lot harder if you were already locked in at 11 bang-bang to get moved to one of the commo fields.
 
We've got a high-tech army now. Your skills can take you far. Or you can put 'em on the shelf, and dig holes and paint rocks. Your choice.
 

[Jamisjockey]

First question: WHY are you going in the Army?


 

No kidding. Why do that to yourself?  Go into the service with a true warrior culture, from the ground up.
Be successful.  Then in life, when you tell people what you did, they suddenly are more impressed by you.  They will introduce you to people and tell them what you did.  I've never met people and had them introduced "This is Joe, he was in the Army"
http://www.marines.com/page/usmc.jsp?flashRedirect=true
You can thank me later.
As far as your weight, you have to continue to exercise while you diet, otherwise you will just get skinny. 

[The Viking]

First question: WHY are you going in the Army?


 

No kidding. Why do that to yourself?  Go into the service with a true warrior culture, from the ground up.
Be successful.  Then in life, when you tell people what you did, they suddenly are more impressed by you.  They will introduce you to people and tell them what you did.  I've never met people and had them introduced "This is Joe, he was in the Army"
http://www.marines.com/page/usmc.jsp?flashRedirect=true
You can thank me later.
As far as your weight, you have to continue to exercise while you diet, otherwise you will just get skinny. 

He couldn't join the Marine Corps, because of some previous run-ins with the law, plus some tattoos on his lower arms.

[Thor]

Kali, one thing to bear in mind is that when people cut weight, they often test positive for protein in the urine. This is a temporary disqualification. I forget the time frame, but it's either one or two weeks. Don't be surprised if that does happen. Hopefully, it won't. You really need to trust your recruiter when it comes to MEPS and their processes. The Army will put you in a job where they think they can use you best. That all boils down to your test scores, the results of the physical, and any "moral" problems that might interfere with specific jobs. (I've had people turn up with color perception problems and they never knew it, eliminating some jobs for them. - just an example.) Good luck with the whole process!!!

[KALIFORNIST]

First question: WHY are you going in the Army?


 

No kidding. Why do that to yourself?  Go into the service with a true warrior culture, from the ground up.
Be successful.  Then in life, when you tell people what you did, they suddenly are more impressed by you.  They will introduce you to people and tell them what you did.  I've never met people and had them introduced "This is Joe, he was in the Army"
http://www.marines.com/page/usmc.jsp?flashRedirect=true
You can thank me later.
As far as your weight, you have to continue to exercise while you diet, otherwise you will just get skinny. 

He couldn't join the Marine Corps, because of some previous run-ins with the law, plus some tattoos on his lower arms.

     Do I need to repeat the part where I say that I am serving to serve not have every one tell me how cool I am for being a marine or in the service.I would have liked to join the marines but its not in the cards and I dont feel all that bad about being a soldier instead.In fact so far I like the attitudes of the army vets I talk to more then the marines.If anything the fact that the army has been deploying for 15 months at a time as compared to what? 7 months for the marines?shows that the army does its part as well.


How can I prevent the protein from showing?drink alot of water?slow the weight cut down towards the end?

[Jamisjockey]

I won't get too deep into it when it comes to duty rotation.  The Army has been doing a great job in country.  Marines tend to have a higher operational tempo.  The Army also has a much larger commitment in theatre.
Interservice rivalry is much like who went to the best college.  Each service has its pros and cons.  I just like pushing my alma mater...
 

[wooderson]

old but funny

If you told Navy personnel to "secure a building," they would turn off the lights and lock the doors.

Army personnel would occupy the building and post sentries so no one could enter.

Marines would assault the building, capture it, and defend it with suppressive fire and close combat.

Air Force personnel would take out a three-year lease with an option to buy.