Author Topic: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask  (Read 8402 times)

Jamisjockey

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #25 on: October 23, 2007, 01:03:24 PM »
Oh, and I'm not begrudging your choice to enter the armed forces and serve your nation.  Good on you.
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Thor

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #26 on: October 23, 2007, 07:46:05 PM »
Marines are just Sailors that have pretty uniforms !!  grin
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Jamisjockey

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #27 on: October 24, 2007, 02:42:00 AM »
Marines are just Sailors that have pretty uniforms !!  grin

Sailors are quite tough until they break a nail.
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Phantom Warrior

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #28 on: October 24, 2007, 08:44:18 AM »
I guess I'll chip in a few things.  For background, I'm an 11B and I've been in the Army for almost two and a half years.  On month 14 of a deployment right now.

While you are in the whole recruiting/MEPS stage I would seriously recommend the About.com website on the military here.  I used it heavily when I was looking at joining the Army.  It will give you a lot of details on the recruiting process, MOSs, basic training, life in the Army, and so on.  Pretty much anything you can think to ask.

I concur with everyone else who has said look at something besides Infantry.  Most of the time it's very, very boring.  If you like to shoot or whatever, the Army isn't the place for it.  Most ranges will consist of you getting up really, really early to draw weapons, being giving a set amount of ammo to go through the range (qualify, familiarization, MOUT range, whatever), and then you are done and you have to sit around and wait for everyone else to finish.  All while wearing an IBA (vest), Kevlar, eye protection, gloves, knees pads, and so on.  And ranges are pretty rare unless you are in the field or something.

Unless you are at a range you are probably doing something silly.  Painting, picking up trash, sweeping the motor pool, organizing a shed, or whatever.  Or just sitting around way after 17:00 because no one will send you home. 

If that doesn't dissuade you, I don't think 11B/11C is up to you.  I chose to go Infantry (silly me) and just got put down as an 11X.  No one asked me.  We just got told at basic, "You all are 11Bs."  It really makes no difference.  We had a couple National Guard 11Cs in our platoon and they did exactly the same training as us, except for a week of learning to set up a mortar tube.  Here in Iraq, our Mortar Platoon is being used as a regular line platoon.  I think the only 11Cs actually shooting mortars are people working for brigade.

Regarding the APFT, I really wouldn't be worried.  We had some extremely overweight and out of shape people in our company and they all passed.  You will become much more fit during basic and it's extremely hard to fail basic.  Trust me.  I think we had one guy (out of 200+) fail.  And that's because he lipped off to a drill sergeant the last week.

When you are working out the numbers you should be thinking about are 40 pushups, 50 situps, and a 16:36 two mile time.  You need 50% during basic, but to graduate and for every APFT after that you need 60%.  You might also be scored on the 18-21 year old scale in basic regardless of age, I can't remember.  That would add a couple pushups and situps and trim 30 seconds from your run. 

The biggest thing to focus on is RUNNING.  Esp if you already are set w/ pushups and situps.  No one really cares about pushups and situps during PT.  I was and still am a noodle arm when it comes to pushups.  If you get smoked and can't do the entire upper body work out it's ok.  As long as you keep trying, the drill sergeants will pretty much leave you alone.  But if you fall out on a run everyone sees you and you will attract a lot more negative attention.  Try to be able to do your two mile in under 16:00 and up to four or five miles at maybe a nine minute pace.  Running in formation is usually pretty slow.


Two tips on the regular Army, one big, one small.  The small one is opt for the G.I. Bill (some people choose not to) and when you get in go talk to your education counselor about the Plus-Up Program.  It allows you to pay an extra $600 in to the G.I. Bill Program.  In return, you get an extra $150 a month from your G.I. Bill.  Which works out to be worth an extra $5400 over the course of you 36 months of benefits.  At a nine-to-one return, it's silly not to take advantage of.

The big tip is be prepared for Iraq.  No matter what MOS you choose, but esp if you choose a combat arms branch (Infantry, Armor, FA, Engineer).  Be prepared to be stuck over here for 15 months, with one two week break, in a country that gets up to the 120s all summer long, wearing 70 pounds of gear, getting blown up by IEDs.  They are bringing in more and more stuff, like AC and Internet, but there are still plenty of creature comforts that you will have to do with out.  Things are much better if you are non-combat arms stationed on one of the big camps like Victory or Balad or in the IZ.  But you still have to deal with occassional mortars and generally being deployed.


I guess I've ranted for long enough.  Shoot me a PM if you have other questions.

Thor

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #29 on: October 24, 2007, 12:37:01 PM »
From what I've heard elsewhere, there is some sort of anti-IED device on it's way to Iraq. I don't know the particulars and I don't WANT to know, but I'm told it works right well.
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Mabs2

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #30 on: October 24, 2007, 01:13:40 PM »
I may have been the person to recommend you this forum.
If not, that's a heck of a coincidence.
I figure that there are a few more retired and active duty Army (and other branch) folks here than at the first forum he asked.
Edit:  Missed the part about TFL, guess you're not him.
Weird.
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Balog

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #31 on: October 24, 2007, 06:56:31 PM »
Seriously tho dude, think about being a medic. You work with the infantry, and overall it's a better gig.

At the end of your tour, would you be more proud of killing bad guys or saving other good guys lives?
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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #32 on: October 24, 2007, 07:16:45 PM »
Yeah, but he already has a skill set around commo.

I _want_ guys who know what they're doing making sure that those 2nd LTs with maps and compasses actually get their coordinates back to someone to run a fire mission.

I _want_ our guys to have e-mails, etc., from home.

I _want_ our guys to have AFRTS (or whatever they call it now) available.
 
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KALIFORNIST

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #33 on: October 24, 2007, 07:24:26 PM »
Yeah, but he already has a skill set around commo.

I _want_ guys who know what they're doing making sure that those 2nd LTs with maps and compasses actually get their coordinates back to someone to run a fire mission.

I _want_ our guys to have e-mails, etc., from home.

I _want_ our guys to have AFRTS (or whatever they call it now) available.
 


You do have a good point on that.I dont think I would have much of a issue working in communications but from what I have read the security
clearence is pretty strict.

Also while I respect medics I know myself well enough that I wouldnt like being one and I am sure there is alot of classroom time involved that I am also terrible at.

Scout26

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #34 on: October 24, 2007, 11:02:38 PM »
If you're looking for adventure, then Combat Arms like (and especially->) Infantry, Armor/Cavalry, Field Artilery, Engineers are what you need to check out. 

If you're looking to gain skills useful in the civilian world for when you get out then Combat Support like MP, MI, Signal, Chemical, and Combat Service Support like Transportation, Quartermaster, Ordinance, Medical, Finance, etc. are what you should check out.  Engineers would tend fall under this category also, although do spend a some/are expected to fight as infantry.  (Aviation, though a Combat Arm, for enlisted falls under the "Get experience for the Civilian World" since it consists of flinging officers at the enemy while the enlisted guys fix the birds and the gizmos in them.)

Do what you want, so that when you get out you don't say "I regret not doing XXXXX."  Ask about the various schools (Jump, Air Assualt, Pathfinder, etc.)  Hell, be all that you can be.

The more running you do now, the easier it will be in Basic/AIT/OSUT. And get all the bennies, GI Bill and whatever other incentives they offer.

Good luck and god speed.

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3. Don't volunteer for anything.

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RevDisk

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #35 on: October 25, 2007, 12:32:43 PM »
Seriously, look at the higher tech stuff first. That may be where you can be best used. You can ALWAYS request a transfer to infantry while you're in basic, but it'd be a lot harder if you were already locked in at 11 bang-bang to get moved to one of the commo fields.
 
We've got a high-tech army now. Your skills can take you far. Or you can put 'em on the shelf, and dig holes and paint rocks. Your choice.

I was a commo geek, 25U.  I happened to be pretty good at it.  You'd need a secret clearance to be anything other than a 25C (radio operator) or a 25L (cable dogs) in the Signal Corps. TS SSBI isn't uncommon, TS SCI isn't extremely common.  It's also pretty much the only MOS that can be assigned to any unit in the entire US Army, up to and including the White House.

We had the toys, and we did the same job all the time.  11B does his primary job, killing the enemy, very infrequently.  Even in Iraq.  The overwhelming majority of the time it's hurry up and wait.  Difference between peacetime and war for us was avoiding UXO/IED's and to liason closer with the 11B's assigned to us.  My requirements to the 11B's were always simple, for very good reasons.  "Buy me 5 to 10 seconds to pop the thermites, then evac.  If I get pop'd, call in arty or an airstrike on the equipment.  If convenient, please drag me a bit away from said equipment first."  Ended up doing a lot of cross training and working with tons of different units from different Armies and nationalities.   

Do something interesting.  Doesn't matter if you know anything about it or not, now.  Don't spend x years doing something mundane.



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ilbob

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #36 on: October 25, 2007, 12:53:34 PM »
A guy I used to shoot with and have since totally lost track of used to be some kind of RTO in the Army.

When he got out of basic (back in the 60s) the Army made some kind of deal with him when they learned he knew Morse code. They sent him to a school to relearn Morse and various other things regarding the Army way of using radios.

He spent a while after his school was over waiting for his security clearance to come back (a couple months IIRC) working in some kind of armory checking and rebuilding rifles (M14s I think) that were going to be assigned to new recruits.

After he got his clearance, he said he spent about 10 hours a day, 6 days a week in a small office, with a blanket for a door, transcribing Morse code. The Army tried to get him to re-enlist but he refused since he did not want to spend any more time doing that particular job anymore, and it was clear they had a shortage of that particular specialty, so he was sure he would end up back there in the little office with a blanket for a door.

Another guy I knew was a reserve SF radio operator. He collected spy radios. He had quite a collection in his basement. It was almost as neat as his gun collection. He had about a dozen radios such as those used by OSS agents dropped behind the lines during WWII. The Army used to call him up to active duty pretty regular because they had a shortage of SF radio operators. He liked going to Europe. Did not like Alaska. He used to sit in his basement and send code to another SF buddy using one time pads. He was pretty darn fast.

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KALIFORNIST

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #37 on: October 25, 2007, 01:18:56 PM »
The more I read about 11x with airborne in the contract the more I think that is for me.I just hope its available in my situation and I can get myself in the shape that I need to be.list by choices
1.11x with airborne
2.11b infantry
3.19k armor crewman
4.45b small arms repair
5.13b cannon crewmember

The 45b is the only non combat mos that I have read about that sounds interesting to me.I like working on weapons and I often take them apart just to relax so maybe thats a option(probably what my mom would like.lol)but obviously non of these carry over into the real world which like I have said earlier is fine by me.I will say this much,I am very tired of running before work,then working 10 to 12 hours all on 900 calories a day!!when/if I make it to basic then I will get to eat finally.All the feed back is great.thank you.

Balog

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #38 on: October 25, 2007, 01:53:29 PM »
Being an armorer sounds fun, but it's a crap job. Mostly getting up real early to issue guns to grunts, then waiting all day for the grunts to give em back. Counting is literally your main responsibility. The grunts clean the guns, they take em out, they put em away. If counting the same gear 5 times a day is your thing, go ahead. And I used to enjoy cleaning guns myself; do it 4-5 hours a day because you have nothing better to do, every day for a few weeks.... the fun wears off.
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KALIFORNIST

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #39 on: October 25, 2007, 02:15:08 PM »
Being an armorer sounds fun, but it's a crap job. Mostly getting up real early to issue guns to grunts, then waiting all day for the grunts to give em back. Counting is literally your main responsibility. The grunts clean the guns, they take em out, they put em away. If counting the same gear 5 times a day is your thing, go ahead. And I used to enjoy cleaning guns myself; do it 4-5 hours a day because you have nothing better to do, every day for a few weeks.... the fun wears off.

lol makes sense when you put it that way .noted and removed from list.THis is exactey why I posted this question

Balog

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #40 on: October 25, 2007, 02:19:33 PM »
If you're really set on being in a combat arm (and it sounds like you are) go for armor. Being a tanker is loads less stupid than being a grunt. What do I mean, you ask? When I was a boot, I got sent on a working party to clean the tank drivers building, cause they were out in the field or something. Nobody cleaned our buildings for us. undecided

And if you choose to disregard the advice from all the Infantry mos combat vets on here and have to have an 11, go for a Weapons MOS. TOW gunner, Javelin gunner etc. Your life will still suck, but Wpns Co's are better than Line Co's.
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KALIFORNIST

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #41 on: October 25, 2007, 02:28:47 PM »
I think that they lumped all the 11s together and 11b covers 11h and 11m now.
new list then
1.11x with airborne option(which for afew reasons probably wont happen)
2.19k m1 armor crewman(only fear is more time on road= more roadside bombs)
3.11b
distant 4th 13b cannon crewmember.

The more I think about it the more armor sounds pretty cool other then it being cramped and hot but I am not trying to go the easy route.

Balog

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #42 on: October 25, 2007, 02:38:52 PM »
I think that they lumped all the 11s together and 11b covers 11h and 11m now.
new list then
1.11x with airborne option(which for afew reasons probably wont happen)
2.19k m1 armor crewman(only fear is more time on road= more roadside bombs)
3.11b
distant 4th 13b cannon crewmember.

The more I think about it the more armor sounds pretty cool other then it being cramped and hot but I am not trying to go the easy route.

Just plain wrong. Tankers spend way, way less time on the road than grunts, and they have about 10x the armor. I went out almost every day I was over (not counting the weeks spent guarding a bridge) in craptastic up-armor HMMWV's. Tanks left laager a handful of times. And even if your unit has a higher op-tempo than the army tankers I was over with, so what? I stopped counting how many times I got hit with IED's around 7; that was in the first month or two of my tour. Most IED's aren't big / accurate enough to kill someone inside an up-armor, left alone an MFing Abrams. I only know of one tank being disabled by an IED (multiple stack tank mines, very nasty). The worst IED's are ones that either hit foot patrols, ones with secondary charges that hit you after you dismount to cordon the area, or the fuel enhanced ones. The higher tech shaped charges etc are much rarer, and even they prolly won't defeat Chobham in a direct hit.
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KALIFORNIST

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #43 on: October 25, 2007, 02:45:00 PM »
thank you.do you have any more info on 19k and do you think its a better pick then infantry?also is there alot of security clearance involved?

Balog

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #44 on: October 25, 2007, 02:59:19 PM »
thank you.do you have any more info on 19k and do you think its a better pick then infantry?also is there alot of security clearance involved?

I was Marine infantry dude; all I know about the Army is the guys I served with in Iraq. Here's what I believe is true about Army tankers; YMMV IANAL I am not and have never been in the Army or a tanker MOS etc......

First let me be clear I'm talking about TANK mos's. I've never interacted with the other types of armor (Strykers etc) and have no idea what they are like.

I don't think clearance is need for tank jobs; if they were it'd be for the guy operating the radio and maybe the guy using the gun sights (which are amazing btw). I don't think they'd require everyone to have a clearance, but the fed.gov never manages to surprise me with it's stupidity so be sure to check.

The only thing I know for certain about tank MOS's is that they are, in fact, much better than infantry.
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I was always pleasant, friendly and within arm's reach of a gun.

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If government is the answer, it must have been a really, really, really stupid question.

Bogie

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #45 on: October 25, 2007, 04:42:41 PM »
Son, we've told you, several times, that grunt infantry is not a "fun" MOS... What'll likely happen is that you'll see SOME action, and hopefully your fellow soldiers in the fracas won't get you killed. This will occupy a VERY small percentage of your time in the service.
 
In the mean time, you're going to spend a LOT of time doing stuff like painting rocks with people who have to move lips while they talk, and who have a hard time counting to 11 without removing either shoes or pants. The hardest thing that a lot of 'em will face will be guard duty, which isn't a big stretch, because they're used to just standing in one spot while staring into space.
 
Yeah, there's smart guys in the infantry too (they tend to be the frustrated ones), but there's also a buncha the folks who just joined the army because they couldn't figure out what else to do... Kids who say things like "I don't want my mama telling me to get up in the morning," who turn around and wonder why the nice guy in the funny hat won't let them sleep in.
 
You can volunteer for it, but there is NO guarantee that you'll end up in one of the "volunteer" units (such as the Airborne outfits), where pretty much everyone is fairly motivated. It's just as likely that you could end up watching a power station in Northern Alaska. Or spending 12 hours a day staring across the Korean DMZ at some guy who would like to eat your brains... If you're an 11-bang-bang, to many of the military leadership, you are simply a warm body that can be assigned to do just about any menial task. Some of them can get interesting, but not all that often, and generally not in ways which one likes.
 
Seriously: If you are good with communications stuff, go after it.
 
Also, we like you. It is better to be in a tank that gets hit by Abduhl while on a virgin quest than to be walking or in a Hummer...
 
Also, keep in mind that commo guys in the rear with the gear RARELY have to hump 60 pound rucks while carrying two full .308 ammo cans, and a rifle, vest and helmet. And they just as rarely have to move 75 pound artillery shells... And they usually get hot food. How many MREs have you eaten in your life? I can tell you that I've got you beat. And that was before they got "good."
 
In addition, there is really "no" rear area anymore. You'll be a qualified soldier regardless. But in the long term, a techie MOS will get you a LOT further in the civilian world than will 11-bang-bang...
 
Answer this now: You are 25. What do you want to be doing when you are 35? When you are 45? When you are 55?
 
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doczinn

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #46 on: October 25, 2007, 04:47:18 PM »
Quote
Being an armorer sounds fun, but it's a crap job. Mostly getting up real early to issue guns to grunts, then waiting all day for the grunts to give em back. Counting is literally your main responsibility. The grunts clean the guns, they take em out, they put em away. If counting the same gear 5 times a day is your thing, go ahead. And I used to enjoy cleaning guns myself; do it 4-5 hours a day because you have nothing better to do, every day for a few weeks.... the fun wears off.

I can't say about the army, but in the Corps armorer and Small Arms Repair are totally different. Armorer is boring as all hell, but Small Arms Repair is actually fixing weapons.
D. R. ZINN

KALIFORNIST

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #47 on: October 25, 2007, 05:09:44 PM »
Son, we've told you, several times, that grunt infantry is not a "fun" MOS... What'll likely happen is that you'll see SOME action, and hopefully your fellow soldiers in the fracas won't get you killed. This will occupy a VERY small percentage of your time in the service.
 
In the mean time, you're going to spend a LOT of time doing stuff like painting rocks with people who have to move lips while they talk, and who have a hard time counting to 11 without removing either shoes or pants. The hardest thing that a lot of 'em will face will be guard duty, which isn't a big stretch, because they're used to just standing in one spot while staring into space.
 
Yeah, there's smart guys in the infantry too (they tend to be the frustrated ones), but there's also a buncha the folks who just joined the army because they couldn't figure out what else to do... Kids who say things like "I don't want my mama telling me to get up in the morning," who turn around and wonder why the nice guy in the funny hat won't let them sleep in.
 
You can volunteer for it, but there is NO guarantee that you'll end up in one of the "volunteer" units (such as the Airborne outfits), where pretty much everyone is fairly motivated. It's just as likely that you could end up watching a power station in Northern Alaska. Or spending 12 hours a day staring across the Korean DMZ at some guy who would like to eat your brains... If you're an 11-bang-bang, to many of the military leadership, you are simply a warm body that can be assigned to do just about any menial task. Some of them can get interesting, but not all that often, and generally not in ways which one likes.
 
Seriously: If you are good with communications stuff, go after it.
 
Also, we like you. It is better to be in a tank that gets hit by Abduhl while on a virgin quest than to be walking or in a Hummer...
 
Also, keep in mind that commo guys in the rear with the gear RARELY have to hump 60 pound rucks while carrying two full .308 ammo cans, and a rifle, vest and helmet. And they just as rarely have to move 75 pound artillery shells... And they usually get hot food. How many MREs have you eaten in your life? I can tell you that I've got you beat. And that was before they got "good."
 
In addition, there is really "no" rear area anymore. You'll be a qualified soldier regardless. But in the long term, a techie MOS will get you a LOT further in the civilian world than will 11-bang-bang...
 
Answer this now: You are 25. What do you want to be doing when you are 35? When you are 45? When you are 55?
 



I never mentioned anything about fun and these high tech mos's you talk of do me no good because I will be getting in on a criminal waiver so I will not be recieving security clearance.There is nothing I can do about that now so all I can do is be realistic.While in the civilian world my mistakes of my youth arent a big deal and dont hold me up from any jobs other then law enforcement they will hold me back in the military.If I could get into one of the tech style mos's I would consider it but I have spent alot of time researching them and most need clearance.The info I have realy been looking for is the type that Balog has been giving me on what the actual mos is instead of what the description says.The more I think about it the more being a tanker appeals to me if I cant get in as a 11x with airborne in my contract.There is a good chance that wont happen due to my physical shape right now so if that doesnt happen armor will be next on the last before just going in as a regular 11b.I want to have several mos's on a list so that when I go to meps I have some clue of what is going on and I can go down the list of what I like.If they will take me and none of the mos I pick are available to me I will be a cook if it involves serving and doing my part.
   

also real quick on the food mre thing you mention.please keep in mind you are talking to a guy who has lost 45 pounds in 2 months eating pretty much nothing but 3/4 cup of cereal with skim milk for breakfast.lunch is usually a can of tuna(dry)with 8 saltine crackers with the occasional 210 calorie lean cusine for a treat and dinner is chicken breast,beets and pees,or 2 plain hotdogs so I have given up on looking at food as taste and more as fuel.I could probably have a feast with MREs

RevDisk

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #48 on: October 25, 2007, 05:19:46 PM »
I can't say about the army, but in the Corps armorer and Small Arms Repair are totally different. Armorer is boring as all hell, but Small Arms Repair is actually fixing weapons.

Smalls Arms Repair is part of being an armorer in the Army.   But you rarely do it.  These days, even swapping bolts or whatnot is rare.  If the weapon is shot to junk, it's sent to depot for repair.  Letterkenny, Anniston and Tobyhanna (or used to anyways).  Again, that's what I've seen but your mileage will vary depending on division and post.  99% of the time, being an armorer involves counting or cleaning.  Cleaning an MG is fun.  The first couple times.  After the x thousandth time (literally), it is not fun.  Counting rifles and bolts sucks from the first second.

On the other hand, I'd have paid money to be an SF armorer.  They do get to see all kinds of interesting stuff.  Then get to tear it apart, see how it ticks and somehow get it working like a Swiss clock.  Plus they're allowed to actually functionally modify weapons, which is a factor 10 on the no-no list for RA armorers. 


Quote
Also, keep in mind that commo guys in the rear with the gear RARELY have to hump 60 pound rucks while carrying two full .308 ammo cans, and a rifle, vest and helmet. And they just as rarely have to move 75 pound artillery shells... And they usually get hot food. How many MREs have you eaten in your life? I can tell you that I've got you beat. And that was before they got "good."

Yea, we also occassionally have to hump 300 lbs of lead acid batteries up a *##@@$ mountain to swap out the batteries in a 'optimized location'.  But yea, in general, we did not pull worst line duties.  The down side is being a significant target by any enemy with a brain.  First guy any intelligent enemy tries to kill is the radio guy.  While it is (generally) less physically depending than grunt or cannon cocker, it can be just as dangerous. 
"Rev, your picture is in my King James Bible, where Paul talks about "inventors of evil."  Yes, I know you'll take that as a compliment."  - Fistful, possibly highest compliment I've ever received.

Jamisjockey

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Re: trying to go in the army.was told this may be the place to ask
« Reply #49 on: October 25, 2007, 05:46:52 PM »
Quote
I don't think they'd require everyone to have a clearance, but the fed.gov never manages to surprise me with it's stupidity so be sure to check.


When I was in the Corps, I was an ATC.  In the Mobile Radar units there is crypto gear.  Mind you I never touched it, never serviced it, and wasn't even sure which radio bank it was in.  But we had to have Secret (IIRC) clearances to work around that gear.
I recieved a Top Secret when I was being spooled up for a West Pac, but wasn't told why.  Never ended up going on that float, I got out...
JD

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