Post by: 280plus on September 15, 2008, 11:40:54 AM
Post by: Manedwolf on September 15, 2008, 11:45:57 AM
I'm surprised they didn't bail Lehman, though. It hit the ground and exploded. People are literally cleaning out their desks today. They interviewed an equities salesman who had been there 23 years and has no other skills.
I have mostly some agile mutual funds (like CGM) along with some medical and entertainment. I figured the financials sector was going to be an "Oh, the humanity!" moment eventually.
Who would have thought giving loans to people with no job and no assets, then trading those toxic loans like a game of hot potato with a lit stick of dynamite was a bad idea? Whoever was left holding the dynamite when it went off got splattered. Such as Lehman, here.
I am just REALLY hoping Bernake doesn't do a rate cut tomorrow. Hyperinflation sounds like something not so fun.
Post by: Headless Thompson Gunner on September 15, 2008, 11:52:15 AM
People have known Lehman was going down for months now, so it wasn't a shock. The market is more ready and accepting of this sort of thing now, too, I think.
Bear Stern's collapse came out of nowhere, and at a time when the market was completely freaked out. Back then, everyone knew there were major problems, but nobody knew what they were, where they were, and who was at risk. Everyone thought he was going to get eaten by this bug scary unknown monster. Now people have a good feeling for where the problems are and what the risks are. Investors are much more ready to see a big brokerage collapse. No panic this time.
Post by: Brad Johnson on September 15, 2008, 11:58:47 AM
Brad
Post by: Manedwolf on September 15, 2008, 11:59:50 AM
Yeah. That.
Post by: Perd Hapley on September 15, 2008, 12:03:46 PM
One news-reader said, "we can't say this is the worst we've ever seen, because we've never seen anything like this."
Another one said, it was the worst day since 9-11.
Post by: Werewolf on September 15, 2008, 12:09:17 PM
CAN ANYONE SAY - RIPPLE EFFECT?
Post by: Headless Thompson Gunner on September 15, 2008, 12:20:50 PM
Bear Sterns, Lehman, and Merril are all done. Add AIG and maybe WaMu in the near future. Suddenly we'll find that we've worked our way through most of the list of likely-to-die financial companies out there. It sucks while it's happening, but it's good to get it done and over with.
Post by: Perd Hapley on September 15, 2008, 01:04:16 PM
Post by: doczinn on September 15, 2008, 01:15:33 PM
Post by: The Annoyed Man on September 15, 2008, 01:16:03 PM
The Dow finishes over 500 points down. All you can do is laugh, or jump out a window.
Or vote for someone besides a Democrat or Republican?
Or just ignore the problem?
Or turn on the T.V. to some distraction?
Post by: Headless Thompson Gunner on September 15, 2008, 01:19:37 PM
I've always wondered what happens if the company that owns your mortgage goes under. Do you suddenly own the house free and clear?
Mortgages are essentially bonds, and they can be bought and sold. If your mortgage lender goes under, your mortgage will be sold to another bank or investor. You'll get a letter in the mail telling you that the mortgage has been sold, along with new instructions on where to send your payments. The terms of the mortgage won't change.
Post by: Gewehr98 on September 15, 2008, 01:20:40 PM
As an AIG policy holder, I've already started shopping, and talked to USAA just today.
I would *assume* that the current insurance policies would be sold to the buyer as part of the parceling-out of AIG.
Who wants to buy an insurance company with no policy holders or potential revenue?
But, then again, weirder things have happened...
Can you imagine what would transpire were all those bank-owned vehicles to suddenly go uninsured, and the lienholders got word of it?
Post by: Jamisjockey on September 15, 2008, 01:24:43 PM
Post by: agricola on September 15, 2008, 01:27:26 PM
Post by: Leatherneck on September 15, 2008, 01:44:13 PM
Quote
Who would have thought giving loans to people with no job and no assets, then trading those toxic loans like a game of hot potato with a lit stick of dynamite was a bad idea?
Quoted for excellence. Manedwolf gets the analytical analogy award!TC
Post by: 41magsnub on September 15, 2008, 01:50:05 PM
Post by: K Frame on September 15, 2008, 01:56:48 PM
Actually, I prefer a third course, which I started exercising at the end of the day...
Instead of standing around pissing my pants, crying, and sucking my thumb that my accounts lost in excess of five figures today, I dumped about $3,500 INTO the markets, into stocks which got caught up in the monkey panic, and which are otherwise fine, solid companies with a long track record of performance. If I had any more right now, I'd be putting more in the markets.
I made a lot of money after the last market crash, I figure I'll make a lot this time, too. I just have to wait until everyone stops pissing their pants, sucking their thumbs, and gets their heads out of their asses.
Post by: Headless Thompson Gunner on September 15, 2008, 01:58:19 PM
Here's to hoping she doesn't just decide to retire.
Post by: Jamisjockey on September 15, 2008, 02:10:35 PM
I just have to wait until everyone stops pissing their pants, sucking their thumbs, and gets their heads out of their asses.
Are you talking about the Stock market, the .gov, or this board?
Post by: 280plus on September 15, 2008, 02:59:58 PM
I just have to wait until everyone stops pissing their pants, sucking their thumbs, and gets their heads out of their asses.
Are you talking about the Stock market, the .gov, or this board?
Post by: 280plus on September 15, 2008, 03:01:39 PM
For anyone who expected this to be about crashing, and was disappointed: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-hgG-yeCdsg
Another nice crash!
Post by: Perd Hapley on September 15, 2008, 03:58:23 PM
Fistful, see the other thread (Lehman, etc.) regarding my same question.
As an AIG policy holder, I've already started shopping, and talked to USAA just today.
As an AIG policy holder, I've already started shopping, and talked to USAA just today.
I've found a better solution. I'm buying lots of gold, and voting for Bob Barr.
Post by: Headless Thompson Gunner on September 15, 2008, 04:24:53 PM
Fistful, see the other thread (Lehman, etc.) regarding my same question.
As an AIG policy holder, I've already started shopping, and talked to USAA just today.
As an AIG policy holder, I've already started shopping, and talked to USAA just today.
I've found a better solution. I'm buying lots of gold, and voting for Bob Barr.
Post by: French G. on September 15, 2008, 04:32:00 PM
Quote
made a lot of money after the last market crash, I figure I'll make a lot this time, too. I just have to wait until everyone stops pissing their pants, sucking their thumbs, and gets their heads out of their asses.
That's right. I have no cash but I still bought a few more shares of a company I already own and expect to see brighter days for. My big move is still waiting in my retirement fund, I have made money with it every quarter this year and last. Since I get to choose where it is invested to a point none of it is in stock funds. I stand to make a killing when I decide to move it back to stocks. Not yet...
Post by: Headless Thompson Gunner on September 15, 2008, 04:46:17 PM
So, my cars are insured through AIG. Should I expect some big corp to buy my policy, or do I need to start shopping IMMEDIATELY?
I don't know if we ever actually answered your question. So for the record, I'd suggest you start shopping for a new insurer. When insurance companies fail, state guaranty agencies step in to make good on any policies the insurance company made. So technically you're protected against the impending failure of AIG. But...
In practice, barely solvent insurers will try to hang on to every penny they have. If you have to make a claim before AIG finally goes under, expect to get the runaround. If you have to make a claim after they go under, you'll have to deal with the marginally competent bureaucrats who run the state guaranty agency. Again, expect a runaround.
You're going to need new insurance provider soon enough anyway. You might as well start working on that right now.
Post by: mfree on September 15, 2008, 06:08:30 PM
No idea where to look and no impetus to do such tonight either
Post by: Manedwolf on September 15, 2008, 07:04:15 PM
Quote
Asia Gets Mauled, HK Sinks 6%, Japan Dives 5%
The hemorrhaging in Asian markets accelerates Tuesday, with Japanese, Hong Kong and South Korean stocks down 5% to 6%, as upheaval on Wall Street fueled investor uncertainty about a spillover into the region.
The hemorrhaging in Asian markets accelerates Tuesday, with Japanese, Hong Kong and South Korean stocks down 5% to 6%, as upheaval on Wall Street fueled investor uncertainty about a spillover into the region.
Good photo, there.
Post by: Leatherneck on September 15, 2008, 11:38:01 PM
My gut tells me the bargain hunters will pop it back up by the end of this week.
TC
Post by: 280plus on September 16, 2008, 12:27:13 AM
Oh my aching Chinese head! I need asplin!
Post by: The Annoyed Man on September 16, 2008, 02:04:40 AM
My gut tells me the bargain hunters will pop it back up by the end of this week.
Pop? Or Prop?
I think something will pop, sure enough.
Post by: The Annoyed Man on September 16, 2008, 02:26:09 AM
"All you can do is laugh, or jump out a window."
Actually, I prefer a third course, which I started exercising at the end of the day...
Instead of standing around pissing my pants, crying, and sucking my thumb that my accounts lost in excess of five figures today, I dumped about $3,500 INTO the markets, into stocks which got caught up in the monkey panic, and which are otherwise fine, solid companies with a long track record of performance. If I had any more right now, I'd be putting more in the markets.
I made a lot of money after the last market crash, I figure I'll make a lot this time, too. I just have to wait until everyone stops pissing their pants, sucking their thumbs, and gets their heads out of their asses.
Actually, I prefer a third course, which I started exercising at the end of the day...
Instead of standing around pissing my pants, crying, and sucking my thumb that my accounts lost in excess of five figures today, I dumped about $3,500 INTO the markets, into stocks which got caught up in the monkey panic, and which are otherwise fine, solid companies with a long track record of performance. If I had any more right now, I'd be putting more in the markets.
I made a lot of money after the last market crash, I figure I'll make a lot this time, too. I just have to wait until everyone stops pissing their pants, sucking their thumbs, and gets their heads out of their asses.
I admire your faith in the markets, but, you do realize that is the same
Edit to clarify: The mindset is what we need, right now. But, ultimately, the value of stocks is not decided by you and me, especially not with $3,500. Maybe if you had $35,000,000. The big players are all going to have to step in, or else that won't work, at least not for long.
Post by: K Frame on September 16, 2008, 02:53:40 AM
Did I say it was?
Did I somehow give the illusion that I'm a financial white knight riding in with buckets of money and will, single handedly, stop the financial crisis in its tracks?
I don't recall claiming anything of the sort.
Post by: 280plus on September 16, 2008, 03:19:49 AM
Quote
Did I somehow give the illusion that I'm a financial white knight riding in with buckets of money and will, single handedly, stop the financial crisis in its tracks?
You mean you're NOT!?! 
Now what the hell am I going to do?
Actually, I wish I did have a bit to throw in. Med copays are draining me dry unfortunately.
Post by: Manedwolf on September 16, 2008, 04:17:03 AM
The second mouse gets the cheese.
Post by: K Frame on September 16, 2008, 05:14:43 AM
Post by: Manedwolf on September 16, 2008, 06:37:28 AM
Oh, it also turns out that Lehman's huge rent payments in London were insured by AIG.
Post by: AmbulanceDriver on September 16, 2008, 06:57:53 AM
Nice roller coaster day.
Oh, it also turns out that Lehman's huge rent payments in London were insured by AIG.
Oh, it also turns out that Lehman's huge rent payments in London were insured by AIG.
D'OH!!!!
Post by: French G. on September 16, 2008, 07:18:24 AM
The fact that the markets all fell off by at least 4% yesterday and today they can only hold almost flat is a sign that buyers are too scared. If anyone with serious money thought this was bottom they would be buying.
Post by: Manedwolf on September 16, 2008, 07:54:55 AM
That horn and "Pull Up" voice is going, and the ground is coming up fast...$1.25 this morning!
Post by: Headless Thompson Gunner on September 16, 2008, 08:20:21 AM
Post by: Manedwolf on September 17, 2008, 05:59:16 AM
Post by: 41magsnub on September 17, 2008, 06:17:33 AM
Post by: Manedwolf on September 17, 2008, 06:28:18 AM
Is this just lack of confidence, or are positions being liquidated due to margin calls?
Post by: Racehorse on September 17, 2008, 07:40:17 AM
I am just glad I am 40 years from retirement (unless I am lucky) and I can take the long term view of things. My current investments are getting hammered, but should bounce back over time.
That's where I am, too. I'm getting hammered now, but hopefully I can get some cheap stocks now that will make up for my losses in the future. If I can pick up cheap stocks with my automatic 401(k) contributions for 6 months or so and then regain the money I lost on the stuff I already had over the next few years, I should end up better off.
Post by: K Frame on September 17, 2008, 07:46:35 AM
Actually, it would have to be a lot more severe than 500 points to be considered a crash.
Monday's 500 point drop was what, about 5% of the index total...
Anyone remember October 16, 1987?
The market dropped 508 points.
Only at that time, that was nearly TWENTY THREE percent of the markets total.
Other markets, were hit a lot harder.
Post by: 280plus on September 17, 2008, 08:02:45 AM
Post by: Perd Hapley on September 17, 2008, 08:10:23 AM
Quote from: Senator Barak Obama
As part of my economic plan, I promise to make Mike Irwin invest the $3500 that he needs to invest in order to save the stock market for the American people.
Post by: Brad Johnson on September 17, 2008, 08:26:31 AM
Brad
Post by: Gewehr98 on September 17, 2008, 08:57:29 AM
ZOMGWTF? We're DOOMED, I tell you - DOOMED!
Post by: Headless Thompson Gunner on September 17, 2008, 09:14:48 AM
Post by: 280plus on September 17, 2008, 10:26:45 AM
Post by: The Annoyed Man on September 17, 2008, 11:21:40 AM