Film condemned, again!

[Bigjake]

Or, how SS gets another tasty helping of crow.




http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,343351,00.html

FOXNews.com
Controversial Anti-Muslim Film Sparks Worldwide Condemnation

Sunday , March 30, 2008

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Nations around the world are protesting the release of a Dutch lawmaker's anti-Islamic film.

Australia condemned Geert Wilders' 15-minute film, titled "Fitna," or "Ordeal" in Arabic, Sunday with the foreign minister calling it "highly offensive."

Foreign Minister Stephen Smith rejected the film's premise of equating Islam with acts of terror and violence.

"It is an obvious attempt to generate discord between faith communities," Smith said. "I strongly reject the ideas contained in the film and deplore its release."

"Fitna" was posted online Thursday but removed from the site, LiveLeak.com, a day later. It has since been widely dispersed on other file-sharing sites.

The European Union issued a statement Saturday saying the film --that portrays Islam as a ticking time bomb aimed at the West -- serves no other purpose than to inflame hatred. U.N. Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon also has condemned the film, saying there is no justification for hate speech or the incitement of violence.

Despite their condemnation, the European leaders defended the right to freedom of speech and called on Muslims to react peacefully.

In the Middle East, Iran has summoned the Dutch ambassador to Tehran to discuss the film, Reuters reported. A senior diplomat from Slovenia, which holds the rotating presidency of the European Union, was also called to the ministry in Tehran over Wilder's film.

Jordanian lawmakers are taking more severe diplomatic measures and demanded their government cuts ties with the Netherlands. Forty-eight lawmakers in the 110-seat parliament have also called for the government to dismiss the Dutch envoy.

Pakistan's foreign ministry on Friday summoned the ambassador of the Netherlands in Islamabad and lodged a "strong protest", according to AFP. It has stepped up the security of the Dutch consulate and businesses in Karachi fearing protests over the Internet release of an anti-Islam film by the far-right Dutch MP.

And in Asia, hundreds of Indonesian students took to the streets Sunday in protest, according to AFP, after a minister called for protests. The students carried posters demanding that authorities shut down websites carrying Geert Wilders' film.

The Associated Press contributed to this report.

[Bigjake]

Any takers on how long the ol Fatwa wagon takes to catch up to this dude?

[Manedwolf]

Oh, they already just burned him in effigy in Pakistan and called for his death. You're late.

[Zardozimo Oprah Bannedalas]

Bet the maker loves the free publicity.

[seeker_two]

So...I guess he'll miss the party at Cannes this year, I guess....

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

Bet the maker loves the free publicity.

Right up until it kills him.

[De Selby]

Not sure what the crow is I'm supposed to be eating-it was a poorly made hack job of a film that incites hatred against Muslims everywhere.  That was its purpose-and a kid on youtube has probably already made a higher quality propaganda film against Muslims.

The reality of this situation is that Wilder is much more likely to become a highly paid guest speaker at the numerous yearly anti-Islam events in America, than he is to be killed by some nutcase.

[Sindawe]

Every act of terrorism depicted in the film.

Committed by a Muslim fanatic.

Every hateful word in the film.

Spoken by a Muslim fanatic.

Every call for Jihad.

Shouted by a Muslim fanatic.


Watch, and judge for yourselves.

http://wikileaks.org/wiki/Fitna_anti-islam_movie_by_Geert_Wilders

Not sure what the crow is I'm supposed to be eating-it was a poorly made hack job of a film that incites hatred against Muslims everywhere.

Funny, I've no hatred of Derek who Admins this forum & THR.  Nor of Dr. Aleem Siddiqui who gave me my professional start in the BioSciences, or for any of the other Muslims I've known and worked with over the years.

Muslim fanatics who call for my head and that of my fellows because we don't revere their choice of imaginary invisible friend in the sky?  Hel take them, and right quick.

[De Selby]

Sindawe,

This film is not about "muslim fanatics"-it is about all Muslims, which is why it demands taht Muslims tear up the Qu'ran and cites the numbers of the total Muslim population in Europe.

I don't doubt that you believe what you say-but this film clearly isn't in line with what you're saying.  It is an attack on all Muslims, not an attack on a "select few radicals."  That much is obvious from watching it.

[Sindawe]

It is an attack on all Muslims, not an attack on a "select few radicals."

Yep, and the criticisms of John Wycliffe, Jan Hus & Martin Luther against the excess of the Holy Church of Christ and its agents were attacks against all Christians.

[Iain]

Very different.

The film juxtaposes the crimes of violent radicals (*) with the graphs depicting the rise of the muslim population in Europe. It's a very clear point that Wilders is making, and a vile one.

(* - In his search for emotive images of Islamic savagery Wilders included images of bloody swords and cut heads. Of course that is a perhaps bizarre religious practice amongst some Shias known as tatbeer. Bloody swords make for a good image though. He also seems to reference female genital mutilation as being part of the Netherlands future and yet it is not called for in the Mein Kampf-like Quran - it is practiced in some Muslim regions, but it predates Islam and is largely condemned.)

[roo_ster]

They are context and a hint at the scope of the problem.

To paraphrase Mao Tse Tung:
The population is the sea in which the insurgent swims.

More population is more sea. 

In other words, the general muslim population is the habitat and the militant muslim is the critter.  More habitat = more critters, just like more old-growth forest = more critters that require old-growth forests to survive.

Given that some proportion of muslims:
1. Act IOW militant Islam
2. Actively support militant Islam ($$$, material, etc.)
3. Provide moral / verbal support to militant Islam
4. Are in favor of, but keep silent WRT militant Islam

The more muslims permitted to enter Western countries means more militant muslims enter.  Not too difficult a concept to understand, unless one makes a deliberate attempt at doing so.

BTW, the estimates of 1+2+3 are ~10% and 1+2+3+4 are ~15%.

[Iain]

A feeble reach, but nice try.

We could have that discussion quite legitimately. There are many issues to be discussed.

However a film that runs as:

1. Terrorist atrocity
2. Butchered Quran quote
3. Terrorist atrocity
4. Butchered Quran quote
5. Bloody swords that have nowt to do with terrorism
6. Radical preacher
7. Numbers of muslims in Europe

is not attempting to have that discussion. It is not making that point intelligently. It is making quite another point, subtly and with venom.

[De Selby]

It is an attack on all Muslims, not an attack on a "select few radicals."

Yep, and the criticisms of John Wycliffe, Jan Hus & Martin Luther against the excess of the Holy Church of Christ and its agents were attacks against all Christians.

Seriously, how can you not get the message when he kindly includes graphs showing the "disturbing increase in the numbers of Muslims" and then calls on "muslims" (no restriction, just all Muslims) to rip up the Quran?

[De Selby]

BTW, the estimates of 1+2+3 are ~10% and 1+2+3+4 are ~15%.

Uh, what estimates are those? Whose?

[JimMarch]

Sigh.

OK.  I'm going to say something controversial here.  Might get me kicked off.  But not if y'all stop and think about what I'm saying.

Let's compare the situation to, say, electing Democrats to the US congress.

There are a lot of good Democrats out there.  Some are very pro-freedom, even pro-RKBA.  I've met a ton of 'em out here in AZ.

But there's a problem with electing them to congress.  Even when the Democrat you elect is 100% good, the party as a whole is dominated by shrill maniacs of the Feinstein, Pelosi, Chucky Schumer, Ted Kennedy, John Kerry variety.  So electing good Democrats can still lead to trouble when you get somebody like Pelosi as speaker of the house setting national policy.

With me so far?

Well...having a huge number of Muslims voting in your country is kinda like that.  Because mixing religion and politics is integral to Islam.  So you get enough of them voting and you get an Islamic political block.

And that leads to trouble because the most violent, crazy, "out there" types tend to take over the political debate because gee, they'll fricken' kill ya if they don't.

Did I mention that "free speech" isn't exactly part of the culture either?  Note how Jordan, which is otherwise fairly moderate as Islamic countries go, wants to cut off diplomatic ties with a whole nation due to free speech on the part of one member of said nation.  They're punishing Denmark for allowing free speech.

There really is a problem here folks.

Islamic converts who started with an American culture versus Arab are far less of a problem.  The Arab culture has "issues" (galore) far above and beyond anything connected to Islam itself...just for starters, look at the level of rape rising in Scandinavian countries where it was at very low levels prior to just moderate middle eastern immigration.  Google anything like:

norway rape islam

...and browse.  Or substitute "australia", or "germany" or...damn near anyplace.

I have a theory regarding the link between rape and Islam.  The fundamentalist mullahs preach that women must be covered head to toe because male impulses are "uncontrollable".

Except it's not true.  I can tell y'all for a certainty that should I ever come across a lady sorely lacking in the clothes department who wants some, the ONLY thing I'd do is find a blanket, or offer my jacket or whatever.  I haven't been told from toddler age that I'm a beast and I know for a certainty I won't act like a beast regardless of the circumstances.

But that's NOT what Islam teaches it's men.  So being told they're animals, all too many believe it and act on that basis.

Let's not even start with the "kill anybody who quits" thing.

In conclusion:

Cultures can go sick.  Prior to WW2 both Germany and Japan managed to go completely insane as entire national cultures go.  Arab culture is sick in a way that is reacting badly to radical Islam.  Worse, the political component of Islam makes it spread, and the radicalism inherent in it's origins hasn't been diluted near enough.  It was founded by a political leader who led armies in war and personally killed to further his faith, which makes it unique among major world religions.

All Muslims living in the US or other civilized nations today need to re-think their commitment to helping shift their faith away from it's violent origins and violent tendencies being displayed today.

[The Annoyed Man]

All Muslims living in the US or other civilized nations today need to re-think their commitment to helping shift their faith away from it's violent origins and violent tendencies being displayed today.

And, of course, the U.S.has no 'violent tendencies', does it?

[Bigjake]

Hey Jim, what rock have you been hiding under?  Excellent, well thought out piece BTW.

But that's NOT what Islam teaches it's men.  So being told they're animals, all too many believe it and act on that basis.

No small wonder why leftists love it so much. 

[Manedwolf]

LONDON, April 1 (Reuters) - The Taliban has said two attacks on Dutch forces in Afghanistan were in retaliation for an anti-Islamic film by a Dutch politician, the SITE Intelligence Group said on Tuesday.

In a communique posted on Web sites used by militants dated April 1, the Taliban said its Shura Council Leadership announced reprisal operations against Dutch forces because "one of the members of the Dutch parliament produced a film that hurts Islam, and he published it with bad intentions".

http://www.reuters.com/article/asiaCrisis/idUSL01662732

"Don't say we're violent, or we'll kill you!"

[vernal45]

Screw them.  The problem with radical islam, is islam. 

So muslims come out of the woodwork like roaches on this, yet on this..[url]http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,344409,00.html/url] we dont even here crickets....sorry folks. 

[De Selby]

Screw them.  The problem with radical islam, is islam. 

So muslims come out of the woodwork like roaches on this, yet on this..[url]http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,344409,00.html/url] we dont even here crickets....sorry folks. 

The problem is not Islam-the problem is people like you, who refuse to think for themselves or to admit of anything other than pre-conceived notions of the guilt of others. 

[Bigjake]

Screw them.  The problem with radical islam, is islam. 

So muslims come out of the woodwork like roaches on this, yet on this..[url]http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,344409,00.html/url] we dont even here crickets....sorry folks. 

The problem is not Islam-the problem is people like you, who refuse to think for themselves or to admit of anything other than pre-conceived notions of the guilt of others. 

All you're missing is the "don't say we're wrong or we'll kill you!", and you'll be there.

[De Selby]

Screw them.  The problem with radical islam, is islam. 

So muslims come out of the woodwork like roaches on this, yet on this..[url]http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,344409,00.html/url] we dont even here crickets....sorry folks. 

The problem is not Islam-the problem is people like you, who refuse to think for themselves or to admit of anything other than pre-conceived notions of the guilt of others. 

All you're missing is the "don't say we're wrong or we'll kill you!", and you'll be there.

If you say so bigjake.  For all your goading, I find it impossible to reacting with anything but a shake of my head when I read such comments.

[vernal45]

Hmm, [url]http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,344409,00.html/url]

Report: Non-Muslims Deserve to Be Punished

Tuesday , April 01, 2008


A report posted on Islam Watch, a site run by Muslims who oppose intolerant teachings and hatred for unbelievers, exposes a prominent Islamic cleric and lawyer who support extreme punishment for non-Muslims  including killing and rape.

A question-and-answer session with Imam Abdul Makin in an East London mosque asks why Allah would tell Muslims to kill and rape innocent non-Muslims, including their wives and daughters, according to Islam Watch.

"Because non-Muslims are never innocent, they are guilty of denying Allah and his prophet," the Imam says, according to the report. "If you don't believe me, here is the legal authority, the top Muslim lawyer of Britain."

The lawyer, Anjem Choudary, backs up the Imam's position, saying that all Muslims are innocent.

Click here to watch the interview with Islamic lawyer Anjem Choudary.

"You are innocent if you are a Muslim," Choudary tells the BBC. "Then you are innocent in the eyes of God. If you are not a Muslim, then you are guilty of not believing in God."

Choudary said he would not condemn a Muslim for any action.

"As a Muslim, I must support my Muslim brothers and sisters," Choudary said. "I must have hatred to everything that is not Muslim."

[Dntsycnt]

Choudary is full of it.  The only thing Muslims like more than Jihad against foreigners is Jihad against each other, simply for "not being muslim enough".  The convenient thing about extremism is that anyone who disagrees with your sect is an infidel and therefore has no rights.

As for Islam's problem being Islam, I'm not too worried about the violent minority of extremists...I'm worried about the nonviolent majority who want global domination under Shariah Law.  I don't care how subjectively noble the goals of peace and freedom are, when the version of "freedom" is "follow our rules, pay a tax if you want to follow another religion, or get out" that's not freedom at all.

I'm not even sure if evil atheists get the pay-the-tax loophole or not...