Cuba

[Ben]

So, Kerry said the reason that no Cuban dissidents were invited to the flag raising was that there was no room for them.

[Jamisjockey]

Kerry's an ass.

But much like Glastnost, I fully believe the best and fastest way to bring down Cuba is open it up to Western, modern influences.  The Cubans love us, and a quick interjection of some imperialistic capitalist green will only bolster that.

[Ben]

Kerry's an ass.

But much like Glastnost, I fully believe the best and fastest way to bring down Cuba is open it up to Western, modern influences.  The Cubans love us, and a quick interjection of some imperialistic capitalist green will only bolster that.

I dunno. I agree with your statement in principle, but they've already been exposed to many Western influences via Canada, Mexico, and Europe with really no change. I think it's really gonna take an end to the Castros. While there are more commies waiting in the wings, I don't think they have, or can wield, the power that the Castro regime has.

[Jamisjockey]

Meh.  None of those countries wield the imperialistic influence of the great Satan.

[vaskidmark]

Somebody in the State Dept Protocol Office screwed up big time -

The Marines who lowered the flag over the embassy were there to hand a new  flag to the Marine Color Guard raising the flag to symbolize the embassy was open for business.

And speaking of which I must give props to the Cuban people who had the decency to wait until after the ceremony to rush the gates seeking visas. [/sarcasm]  I do expect to see a land office business in folks lining up to sell classic cars.

stay safe.

[Angel Eyes]

I do expect to see a land office business in folks lining up to sell classic cars.

Indeed.  I had to doublecheck the photo to make sure it was recent.

[Jamisjockey]

I don't believe the opening of the Embassy will solve the trade agreement and embargo stuff, Congress has to authorize all that.

[SADShooter]

I'm unsure about the outcome of this with respect to change in Cuba. Regardless, I am sure it is one more example of the dilletante diplomacy that has made the U.S. a laughingstock to our enemies and a risk to our allies. This administration's arrogance and incompetence on the international stage will continue to bear fruit for years, the taste of which we will not enjoy.

[RoadKingLarry]

The stash of classic cars in Cuba are not pristine, well maintained examples. While most look great they have been cobbled together over the years with whatever the local knuckle busters could scrape up to make them run.

I fully expect the Obama admin to find a way to return Gitmo to Cuba and to pay them all the back rent for the property.

The US is the only country in the world to have an embargo on Cuba yet it is still a communist shithole. On the one hand I am all for restoring relations with Cuba if for no other reason to show the world that the US embargo is not the reason it is a communist shithole.
Time will tell.

[TommyGunn]

Kerry's an ass.

But much like Glastnost, I fully believe the best and fastest way to bring down Cuba is open it up to Western, modern influences.  The Cubans love us, and a quick interjection of some imperialistic capitalist green will only bolster that.

Do not hope for change.

Cuba uses a monetary unit called a peso.  But what they use for their trade is what has actual value, and the countries that trade with Cuba use it, but within Cuba its use is exclusively governmental.  The people there are paid in pesos, but it isn't the same peso that the govt. uses.  This .... "peoples' peso", if you will, is almost totally devoid of value, thus keeping the Cubans in poverty and under the thumb of their communist overlords.
Until this situation is rectified, trading with America will not enrich Cuba or help the Cuban people at all.
It will be of some help to the Cuban government .... which has been struggling since the demise of the USSR and its benevolent underwriting of the Cuban economy.
Cuba has been trading with Canada, Great Britain, and many other countries for a long time, and this has not served to enrich the Cuban people.
Now America is a great country, as we all know.  I love America!   But, really, if the rest of the world trading with Cuba doesn't help the Cubans, do you think adding America into the mix will really help anything?
 

All Obama has done is to help shim-up a hurting Commie government ..... nothing else.

[Firethorn]

Will adding the USA to the mix change anything?  Not immediately, no.  However, the Castros are losing a great target to blame 'everything' on.  Also, consider that the USA is a much closer and larger market than Canada, and is richer and produces things that Mexico doesn't.

It's a thin slice, but it's something.

You also have to figure that the Castros are turning into a Dynasty - Blame them for the sins of their father as you will, and their own sins, but they have to be looking at what's happened in Venezuala and want to avoid that. 

Basically, if they turn into plain old robber barons it's probably for the best.  Let them have their wealth and power.  In 3-4 generations they'll be mostly indistinguishable from any other 'old money'.  The ultimate victory of capitalism over communism, if you will.

[French G.]

I've seen Cuban migrant boats at sea and also examples collected at Fort Jefferson in the Dry Tortugas. Mechanically genius stuff going on but with respect to the cars it indicates a distinct lack of Barret-Jackson matching number OEM loving care.

[brimic]

Restoring trade will only make the castro turds richer.

[De Selby]

Calling Cuba a "communist s-hole" seems to miss the mark a bit.  They have better life expectancies, lower infant mortality, and better education than their Latin American neighbours with "free market" systems.  All considered, the Cuban population is a lot better off than much of Latin America.  This makes me skeptical of claims that these rants about reform are really meant to help them.

What is it we're thinking would be achieved by making its economy more like Panama or Guatemala?

[Jamisjockey]

Calling Cuba a "communist s-hole" seems to miss the mark a bit.  They have better life expectancies, lower infant mortality, and better education than their Latin American neighbours with "free market" systems.  All considered, the Cuban population is a lot better off than much of Latin America.  This makes me skeptical of claims that these rants about reform are really meant to help them.

What is it we're thinking would be achieved by making its economy more like Panama or Guatemala?

Your willingness to accept the statistics put forth by a communist dictatorship has me wondering....you interested in some Arizona ocean-front property I've got for sale?

[TommyGunn]

Calling Cuba a "communist s-hole" seems to miss the mark a bit.  They have better life expectancies, lower infant mortality, and better education than their Latin American neighbours with "free market" systems.  All considered, the Cuban population is a lot better off than much of Latin America.  This makes me skeptical of claims that these rants about reform are really meant to help them.

What is it we're thinking would be achieved by making its economy more like Panama or Guatemala?

They have better life expectancies...

Not if they're arrested and stuck in some hell-hole political prison, they don't.

They have better life expectancies, lower infant mortality, and better education than their Latin American neighbours with "free market" systems.

Says who?  The Cubans?  Of course they're telling the truth  ---- a Communist would NEVER lie, or course. 
Better educated?  You mean better indoctrinated.  Let's get our words right.

They're economy was barely sustainable when they were a mere satellite of the USSR, and since they went belly-up, Cuba has been hurting mightily.
Even their famous cigars are not anything like they used to be...but you're welcome to them if you want 'em.


I've heard enough from Cuban refugeees and what they say about life under Castro to know you're full of it.

[Boomhauer]

What else did you expect out of Comrade De Selby?

[lupinus]

Calling Cuba a "communist s-hole" seems to miss the mark a bit.  They have better life expectancies, lower infant mortality, and better education than their Latin American neighbours with "free market" systems.  All considered, the Cuban population is a lot better off than much of Latin America.  This makes me skeptical of claims that these rants about reform are really meant to help them.

What is it we're thinking would be achieved by making its economy more like Panama or Guatemala?

Sounds like you should move there and verify the statistics.

Let us know how it works out for you.

[Ben]

A problem is that there is the Cuba that tourists see, and there is the other Cuba. Much like many Caribbean countries, there are the white sand beaches on hotel row that are raked clean every morning at 0500, the Hemingwayesque cafes, etc., and there are other parts of the island. I will say that from what I have heard they have a top notch medical industry. Though much of it caters to wealthy foreigners.

When you have people risking their lives on crappy rafts to get out, you have a problem. When the people on the rafts are heading to your country, you're probably doing alright.

[vaskidmark]

Apparently Kerry got away with either a real dig or just put Obama's foot in his (you pick which whom) mouth.

Some Cubans could scarcely believe it: a U.S. secretary of state lecturing their Communist government about democracy and human rights on state television.

As the U.S. flag was raised at America's embassy in Havana for the first time in 54 years, John Kerry called for a "genuine democracy" in Cuba and his comments were broadcast across the country in full, translated accurately into Spanish so everyone could understand.

Cubans should be free to choose their own leaders, Kerry said, telling the government to respect international norms of human rights.

"Cuba's future is for Cubans to take." John Kerry

Cuba's government hit back by criticizing the United States' own record on rights, but it did let its people hear Kerry.

How does that Churchill quote go?  "Democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried."

stay safe.

[Jamisjockey]

Apparently Kerry got away with either a real dig or just put Obama's foot in his (you pick which whom) mouth.

Some Cubans could scarcely believe it: a U.S. secretary of state lecturing their Communist government about democracy and human rights on state television.

As the U.S. flag was raised at America's embassy in Havana for the first time in 54 years, John Kerry called for a "genuine democracy" in Cuba and his comments were broadcast across the country in full, translated accurately into Spanish so everyone could understand.

Cubans should be free to choose their own leaders, Kerry said, telling the government to respect international norms of human rights.

"Cuba's future is for Cubans to take." John Kerry

Cuba's government hit back by criticizing the United States' own record on rights, but it did let its people hear Kerry.

How does that Churchill quote go?  "Democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried."

stay safe.

But...but...we hate Obama and Cuba so this is wrong!!!!1oneelvenety

[De Selby]

Your willingness to accept the statistics put forth by a communist dictatorship has me wondering....you interested in some Arizona ocean-front property I've got for sale?

I drew that conclusion based on what's on the cia world fact book.  I somehow don't think they're putting up numbers to help Castro.

[De Selby]

A problem is that there is the Cuba that tourists see, and there is the other Cuba. Much like many Caribbean countries, there are the white sand beaches on hotel row that are raked clean every morning at 0500, the Hemingwayesque cafes, etc., and there are other parts of the island. I will say that from what I have heard they have a top notch medical industry. Though much of it caters to wealthy foreigners.

When you have people risking their lives on crappy rafts to get out, you have a problem. When the people on the rafts are heading to your country, you're probably doing alright.[\b]

.

True - I was drawing the comparison to other Latin American States, which also send armies of immigrants to the U.S. despite market based economies.

[TommyGunn]

I drew that conclusion based on what's on the cia world fact book.  I somehow don't think they're putting up numbers to help Castro.

I wonder what the CIA said about the WMDs in Iraq ...... 

[Jamisjockey]

.

True - I was drawing the comparison to other Latin American States, which also send armies of immigrants to the U.S. despite market based economies.

Most latin countries are kleptocracies, not market based.