Post by: MechAg94 on May 22, 2008, 10:56:59 AM
I am not sure what this lady's angle is. It seems to me she would have better luck being declared the owner (conditionally or not) of the chimp instead.
Quote
His name is Matthew, he is 26 years old, and his supporters hope to take his case to the European Court of Human Rights.
But he won't be able to give evidence on his own behalf - since he is a chimpanzee. Animal rights activists led by British teacher Paula Stibbe are fighting to have Matthew legally declared a 'person' so she can be appointed as his guardian if the bankrupt animal sanctuary where he lives in Vienna is forced to close.
An anonymous businessman has offered a substantial amount to cover his care, but under Austrian law only humans are entitled to have guardians.
The country's supreme court has upheld a lower court ruling which rejected the activists' request to have a trustee appointed for Matthew.
So now 36-year-old Miss Stibbe and the Vienna-based Association Against Animal Factories have filed an appeal with the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg.
The insists that the chimp needs legal standing so a guardian can be appointed to look out for his interests - especially if the sanctuary shuts down.
Miss Stibbe, who is from Brighton but has lived in Vienna for several years, says she is not trying to get the chimp declared a human, just a person.
'Everybody who knows him personally will see him as a person,' she said.
'In his home in the African jungle, he would have been well able to look after himself without a guardian.
But since he was abducted into an alien environment, traumatised and locked up in an enclosure, it did become necessary for me to act on his behalf to secure the donation money for him and to avoid his deportation.
'Since he has no close relatives, I am doing this as the person closest to him.'
The legal wrangle began in February 2007, when the sanctuary where Matthew lives with another chimp, Rosi, plus a crocodile filed for bankruptcy protection.
Activists want to ensure the apes do not wind up homeless. Both were captured as babies in Sierra Leone in 1982 and smuggled to Austria for use in pharmaceutical experiments.
Customs officers intercepted the shipment and turned the chimps over to the shelter. Their upkeep costs £4,000 a month.
Donors have offered to help, but under Austrian law, only a human can receive personal gifts.
Organisers could set up a foundation to collect cash for Matthew, whose life expectancy in captivity is about 60 years.
But they argue that only personhood would ensure he is not sold to someone outside Austria, where he is protected by strict animal cruelty laws.
In dismissing the activists' request to get a guardian for Matthew, a lower court ruled that the chimp was neither mentally impaired nor in danger - the legal grounds required for a guardian to be appointed.
It did not directly address the issue of whether a chimpanzee can be considered a person.
Eberhart Theuer, the animal rights group's chief legal adviser, said there is a legal precedent to appoint a guardian for an individual incapable of expressing himself.
'As long as Matthew is not recognised as a person, he could be sold abroad or killed for economic reasons,' Theuer said.
'His life depends on this decision. This case is about the fundamental question: Who is the bearer of human rights? Who is a person according to the European Human Rights Charter?'
A spokesman for the court in Strasbourg said: 'Any application regarding this chimpanzee will be considered at a primary level by a magistrate and a lawyer before we decide whether it deserves a full-blown hearing.'
But he won't be able to give evidence on his own behalf - since he is a chimpanzee. Animal rights activists led by British teacher Paula Stibbe are fighting to have Matthew legally declared a 'person' so she can be appointed as his guardian if the bankrupt animal sanctuary where he lives in Vienna is forced to close.
An anonymous businessman has offered a substantial amount to cover his care, but under Austrian law only humans are entitled to have guardians.
The country's supreme court has upheld a lower court ruling which rejected the activists' request to have a trustee appointed for Matthew.
So now 36-year-old Miss Stibbe and the Vienna-based Association Against Animal Factories have filed an appeal with the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg.
The insists that the chimp needs legal standing so a guardian can be appointed to look out for his interests - especially if the sanctuary shuts down.
Miss Stibbe, who is from Brighton but has lived in Vienna for several years, says she is not trying to get the chimp declared a human, just a person.
'Everybody who knows him personally will see him as a person,' she said.
'In his home in the African jungle, he would have been well able to look after himself without a guardian.
But since he was abducted into an alien environment, traumatised and locked up in an enclosure, it did become necessary for me to act on his behalf to secure the donation money for him and to avoid his deportation.
'Since he has no close relatives, I am doing this as the person closest to him.'
The legal wrangle began in February 2007, when the sanctuary where Matthew lives with another chimp, Rosi, plus a crocodile filed for bankruptcy protection.
Activists want to ensure the apes do not wind up homeless. Both were captured as babies in Sierra Leone in 1982 and smuggled to Austria for use in pharmaceutical experiments.
Customs officers intercepted the shipment and turned the chimps over to the shelter. Their upkeep costs £4,000 a month.
Donors have offered to help, but under Austrian law, only a human can receive personal gifts.
Organisers could set up a foundation to collect cash for Matthew, whose life expectancy in captivity is about 60 years.
But they argue that only personhood would ensure he is not sold to someone outside Austria, where he is protected by strict animal cruelty laws.
In dismissing the activists' request to get a guardian for Matthew, a lower court ruled that the chimp was neither mentally impaired nor in danger - the legal grounds required for a guardian to be appointed.
It did not directly address the issue of whether a chimpanzee can be considered a person.
Eberhart Theuer, the animal rights group's chief legal adviser, said there is a legal precedent to appoint a guardian for an individual incapable of expressing himself.
'As long as Matthew is not recognised as a person, he could be sold abroad or killed for economic reasons,' Theuer said.
'His life depends on this decision. This case is about the fundamental question: Who is the bearer of human rights? Who is a person according to the European Human Rights Charter?'
A spokesman for the court in Strasbourg said: 'Any application regarding this chimpanzee will be considered at a primary level by a magistrate and a lawyer before we decide whether it deserves a full-blown hearing.'
Post by: 280plus on May 22, 2008, 11:25:03 AM
Don't they have zoos in Austria? Are they going to turn the chimps and gator loose on the streets, homeless and fending for themselves? Panhandling for bananas and the occasional wildebeest ? Oh the humanity,,, I think...
Post by: Nitrogen on May 22, 2008, 11:45:51 AM
Post by: taurusowner on May 22, 2008, 12:04:59 PM
Post by: Nitrogen on May 22, 2008, 12:17:24 PM
Post by: Scout26 on May 22, 2008, 07:31:37 PM
In that case I want to sue for violation of my Dog rights, my employer doesn't let me go outside to pee or poop on teh grass at work.
Hey, at least he lets you lick yourself.......
Post by: Sindawe on May 22, 2008, 08:20:48 PM
Post by: Manedwolf on May 22, 2008, 08:21:26 PM
Post by: MicroBalrog on May 22, 2008, 08:41:01 PM
Nominate it for president of the EU.
It would be an improvement.
Post by: LAK on May 22, 2008, 10:03:12 PM
Post by: MicroBalrog on May 22, 2008, 10:35:47 PM
By declaring that a chimp is equal to a human, you're also stating that the human is equal to a chimp.
Which can have really nasty long-term consequences if it gets mainstreamed.
Post by: wmenorr67 on May 22, 2008, 10:40:26 PM
Post by: MicroBalrog on May 22, 2008, 10:45:39 PM
Post by: Harold Tuttle on May 23, 2008, 02:52:56 AM
Quote
There is a legend that during the Napoleonic Wars with France (1793-1815), a French ship was wrecked off the coast of Hartlepool. During the Napoleonic Wars there was a fear of a French invasion of Britain and much public concern about the possibility of French infiltrators and spies.
The only survivor of the wreck was a monkey, who managed to get safely to land. It was captured by some local fishermen, who tried to speak to it, and ask it questions. They could not understand its replies and, never having seen a monkey before, thought it was a strangely shaped human, speaking in a foreign language. They decided that it was talking French and was therefore a spy. It was then condemned to death and hanged on the Fish Sands, in front of the Town Wall.
The only survivor of the wreck was a monkey, who managed to get safely to land. It was captured by some local fishermen, who tried to speak to it, and ask it questions. They could not understand its replies and, never having seen a monkey before, thought it was a strangely shaped human, speaking in a foreign language. They decided that it was talking French and was therefore a spy. It was then condemned to death and hanged on the Fish Sands, in front of the Town Wall.
Post by: El Tejon on May 23, 2008, 02:56:42 AM
"Your honor, the witness flung his poo at me."
Post by: Manedwolf on May 23, 2008, 03:48:53 AM
So, who's going to have to cross exam the chimp?
"Your honor, the witness flung his poo at me."
"Your honor, the witness flung his poo at me."
That would be a Congressional hearing.
Post by: wmenorr67 on May 23, 2008, 04:04:12 AM
Post by: vaskidmark on May 23, 2008, 04:14:15 AM
While I am no big fan of the show because of their smarmy attritude of attempting to make the "rescue" of the chimps more important than any of the crap involved in "rescuing" humans (vis: Myanmar, the homeless, African AIDS, etc.) I think this chimp would be better served by Chimp Eden than by having a guardian appointed.
And speaking of appointing guardians - that whack-job Brit is another example of why someone ought to appoint one for the whole bunch of them.
stay safe.
skidmark
Post by: wmenorr67 on May 23, 2008, 04:16:11 AM
Post by: vaskidmark on May 23, 2008, 04:21:22 AM
Remember we fought a couple of wars to end having to look out for them.
The chimps or the Euros?
stay safe.
skidmark
Post by: 280plus on May 23, 2008, 04:22:46 AM
Remember we fought a couple of wars to end having to look out for them.
Dammit, skidmark beat me... 
Post by: wmenorr67 on May 23, 2008, 04:30:36 AM
Post by: MrRezister on May 23, 2008, 06:01:26 AM
Post by: MechAg94 on May 23, 2008, 06:22:23 AM
There is a group highlighted on The Animal Planet show "Return to Chimp Eden" that rescues chmps from long-time pet/exhibit status and seeks to rehabilitate them to the point of being returned to the wild, or in the alternative living out their lives in an extensive wildlife preserve.
While I am no big fan of the show because of their smarmy attritude of attempting to make the "rescue" of the chimps more important than any of the crap involved in "rescuing" humans (vis: Myanmar, the homeless, African AIDS, etc.) I think this chimp would be better served by Chimp Eden than by having a guardian appointed.
And speaking of appointing guardians - that whack-job Brit is another example of why someone ought to appoint one for the whole bunch of them.
stay safe.
skidmark
While I am no big fan of the show because of their smarmy attritude of attempting to make the "rescue" of the chimps more important than any of the crap involved in "rescuing" humans (vis: Myanmar, the homeless, African AIDS, etc.) I think this chimp would be better served by Chimp Eden than by having a guardian appointed.
And speaking of appointing guardians - that whack-job Brit is another example of why someone ought to appoint one for the whole bunch of them.
stay safe.
skidmark
They used to have one called a King. They decided they didn't need one and started that whole Magna Carta thing. Makes you wonder.
Post by: Modifiedbrowning on May 23, 2008, 07:18:53 PM
Quote
Animal rights activists led by British teacher Paula Stibbe are fighting to have Matthew legally declared a 'person' so she can be appointed as his guardian if the bankrupt animal sanctuary where he lives in Vienna is forced to close.
An anonymous businessman has offered a substantial amount to cover his care, but under Austrian law only humans are entitled to have guardians.
An anonymous businessman has offered a substantial amount to cover his care, but under Austrian law only humans are entitled to have guardians.
Why don't they have the businessman buy "Matthew" and then pay a substantial amount to Paula Stibbe to cover his care? Duh.