Author Topic: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say  (Read 33306 times)

KD5NRH

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #75 on: August 04, 2015, 09:59:24 AM »
I've never had a manual transmission fail but I've had several autos give up the ghost on me, and replacing a clutch is a darn sight easier and cheaper than rebuilding/replacing an automatic transmission.

This; most expensive manual transmission repair I've ever had was $1,300 to rebuild a fairly uncommon one.  I'm not sure I've ever had anything done to an automatic that cheaply.

Besides, with hills, I don't see how an automatic is ever going to be more efficient and/or effective than a manual until it can look out ahead of the car at the terrain, then check inside my skull to see if I'm planning to pass on the climb.

zxcvbob

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #76 on: August 04, 2015, 10:10:26 AM »
I had an automatic transmission rebuilt and heavy-duty clutches installed (or bands or whatever they are called) once.  It cost me about $300, and he did a good job too.  But that was in the 1980's. (I thought it was cheap even back then) 

It was a Turbo 350 in a used Chevy pickup with I dunno how many miles because the odometer didnt work.  That was my first automatic trans, before that I thought they were for wimps; especially in a truck.  I can still drive a stick, but I always buy autos now.  Maybe I have turned into a wimp.  But they are sure nice in stop and go traffic, or creeping up a boat ramp, or...
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Tallpine

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #77 on: August 04, 2015, 11:27:12 AM »

Aren't trucks actually bigger than they were a few decades ago?

Yes, a lot.  Too big.  But they are also much harder to see out of.  The dash looms up in your face and the windshield height is less (though because of the flatter angle there is actually a lot more glass).  Maybe you get used to it eventually, but you really can't see at all where the end of the hood or fenders is.  We have two fairly new VFD trucks and they are a real pain in tight places (where they get used a lot  :facepalm: ).  In contrast, the 73-87 GM trucks were much easier to see out of than the 67-72 vintage: the top of the dashboard was lower and the windows were all bigger.  The 88-98 pickups were okay too.

This; most expensive manual transmission repair I've ever had was $1,300 to rebuild a fairly uncommon one.  I'm not sure I've ever had anything done to an automatic that cheaply.

Besides, with hills, I don't see how an automatic is ever going to be more efficient and/or effective than a manual until it can look out ahead of the car at the terrain, then check inside my skull to see if I'm planning to pass on the climb.
Yeah, that and these damn traction control programs that cut off the power about ten feet short of reaching the top of the hill or a dry spot  :facepalm:

I had an automatic transmission rebuilt and heavy-duty clutches installed (or bands or whatever they are called) once.  It cost me about $300, and he did a good job too.  But that was in the 1980's. (I thought it was cheap even back then) 

It was a Turbo 350 in a used Chevy pickup with I dunno how many miles because the odometer didnt work.  That was my first automatic trans, before that I thought they were for wimps; especially in a truck.  I can still drive a stick, but I always buy autos now.  Maybe I have turned into a wimp.  But they are sure nice in stop and go traffic, or creeping up a boat ramp, or...
I had two TH350 pickups and I thought they were terrible.  Maybe okay in a street pickup but not very reliable in a 4wd in the mountains.  Both of them got terrible gas mileage.  The automatic seemed to suck about a third of your horsepower and they were always having to shift down on even moderate hills, where my four speed pickups would just cruise right up the same hill in high gear without even hardly noticing.

The old wide ratio four speeds had no trouble creeping in low or reverse  ;)

The much maligned 700R4 is a much better automatic than the TH350, IMO.  I've got over 220K with no issues, although I suppose it might have been rebuilt before we got it.  It gets (or did, some years ago) fairly decent mileage on the highway (~15mpg @ 65mph w/ac) compared to rarely even breaking 10mpg with the TH350.  Only gripe I had with trailer towing is that it doesn't shift down soon enough on hills (I'm hard to please  :P ) and would bog down to 30 mph and then speed up to about 50 where  it would upshift and immediately start bogging down again.  I learned to just manually shift it down to L2 at about 45 mph and hold that up the hill without any drama.

I always wished for a pickup with a real truck five speed, with deep low and reverse  ;)  I think only IH ever offered it as an option.
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SADShooter

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #78 on: August 04, 2015, 11:30:12 AM »
Lordy, I love being somewhere a debate over wages morphs into a discussion about truck transmissions. :cool: [popcorn] =D
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Tallpine

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #79 on: August 04, 2015, 11:35:32 AM »
Lordy, I love being somewhere a debate over wages morphs into a discussion about truck transmissions. :cool: [popcorn] =D

Tallpine: waging war on automatics since 1971  =D
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KD5NRH

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #80 on: August 04, 2015, 12:18:58 PM »
Yes, a lot.  Too big.  But they are also much harder to see out of.  The dash looms up in your face and the windshield height is less (though because of the flatter angle there is actually a lot more glass).  Maybe you get used to it eventually, but you really can't see at all where the end of the hood or fenders is.

This.  IMO, most of them need a pair of cameras on the front too so you can see the corners.  It's hard to pull up close to anything, and when you're driving a crew cab long bed pulling a trailer, you want to get close in front fairly often to get the trailer as far out of the way as possible.

Tallpine

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #81 on: August 04, 2015, 12:28:20 PM »
This.  IMO, most of them need a pair of cameras on the front too so you can see the corners.  It's hard to pull up close to anything, and when you're driving a crew cab long bed pulling a trailer, you want to get close in front fairly often to get the trailer as far out of the way as possible.

Yeah, might as well just do away with the windshield entirely and have a big flat screen  =D
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

zxcvbob

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #82 on: August 04, 2015, 12:42:04 PM »
I have a 2001 Chevy, and I *think* I can still see the front corners okay (I didn't drive it today, and I usually don't pay attention to stuff like that except when I need to)

It is larger on the outside than my previous 1976 model, but smaller on the inside.  Thicker doors I guess, but they don't look thicker.  Maybe they just lean in more.

I parked next to a newer F150 last week and my Chevy was a lot smaller than the Ford, mostly in height.  The bed capacity didn't look any different.
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Tallpine

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #83 on: August 04, 2015, 01:25:08 PM »
I have a 2001 Chevy, and I *think* I can still see the front corners okay (I didn't drive it today, and I usually don't pay attention to stuff like that except when I need to)

It is larger on the outside than my previous 1976 model, but smaller on the inside.  Thicker doors I guess, but they don't look thicker.  Maybe they just lean in more.

I parked next to a newer F150 last week and my Chevy was a lot smaller than the Ford, mostly in height.  The bed capacity didn't look any different.

I don't think they started to bloat so much until mid-2000s  =|

I know that back in 2008 when I shuttled a couple new pickups for my sister/brother in law down in Texas, that I was absolutely terrified trying to get one of them in and out of a crowded gas station.  The other dealer where we picked it up only left a couple gallons in it and we had 80 miles to get back to my dad's home town.

Our VFD has a ~2001 Suburban and it doesn't seem too bad but then I don't drive it very often.  We looked at a 2011 Traverse last year and that thing was ridiculous; it is actually the size of a Tahoe on the outside but much smaller on the inside, and you can't see the hood or fenders at all.  Ladypine immediately said "No way!"

Yeah, the cabs seem to be getting smaller and the beds are certainly no larger, but the overall size has grown (and you have to remove the cab to work on the engine).  Isn't "progress" wonderful  ;/
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

KD5NRH

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #84 on: August 04, 2015, 02:24:24 PM »
Yeah, might as well just do away with the windshield entirely and have a big flat screen  =D

I'd give that a week before somebody figures out how to hack it for DVDs while driving down the interstate, and if we're lucky, they'll have a PiP of the front view in the corner.

MechAg94

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #85 on: August 04, 2015, 02:39:13 PM »
Yeah, might as well just do away with the windshield entirely and have a big flat screen  =D
I often wonder why they haven't changed the dash into one big LED screen.  People like gauges, but the gauges are just fed electrical signals.  It would be neat to be able to customize your display.

I have a 2011 F-150.  It has bucket seats in the back seat and the tail gate sits kind of high.  I can't see much out the back window.  If not for the backup warning radar and camera, I would have hit several things by now. 
I would like to blind spot cameras myself. 
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MechAg94

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #86 on: August 04, 2015, 02:44:15 PM »
Back on the original discussion.  Below are the consequences I saw:

1.  Lost some customers, but gained a bunch.  The ones gains won't pay off in the short term.  Sounds like he could come okay if he survives. 
2.  Lost some of his better employees who thought they got shafted by getting less raise. 
3.  Gave up salary and profit to give money away. 
4.  Getting sued by minority owner due to #3.

IMO, a lot of this happened because he went public about the change.  He could have raised everyone's pay and even gave big raises to the higher paid people also, not went public about it. 

Also, some companies do some sort of profit sharing or profit based bonus system.  IMO, if you want to reward everyone, that is the better way to do it.
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zxcvbob

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #87 on: August 04, 2015, 03:11:40 PM »
Money is not a very good motivator.  But it's a great demotivator if you don't get it right.
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Balog

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #88 on: August 04, 2015, 03:31:39 PM »
I actually agree about wage stagnation. It's an issue.  Part of it is you are required to buy more expensive things by unseen .gov mandates in all kinds of stuff, not just cars.

But, it's raining here, so let's have some fun.

Google says Average Entry Level salary in the US is $43,000.  It also says that a single, filing alone federal tax* on that is "$4,481.25 + 25% of the amount over $32,550".  So let's round that to $7000 of the top.  That means +/- $3000/month take home.

MSRP (and who pays that?) for a 2016 F-250 is $32,385.  Scrape together a grand down payment, 7% sales tax and dead center of my credit union's intrest rate nets you $599.95/mo for your truck.  Tight, but doable.**

And as was pointed out, you are getting a LOT more stuff on that truck then even a middle of the road 1971 model got you.  So, it might not be the best idea, but I think it's not as far out as you imagine. 

*I'm not even looking up state tax rates.  Move to FL or AK.
**The trucks in the trailer park I pass on the way to work would imply the above scenario is quite a bit more than "doable".  It seems popular to park a $50,000 truck outside a $20,000 trailer.

Uh, no. That's the average of all wages, NOT specifically entry level. Unless I am reading this wrong.

http://www.ssa.gov/oact/cola/AWI.html
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Balog

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #89 on: August 04, 2015, 03:33:48 PM »
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=average+entry+level+wage

[shrug] Dunno where they got it.  I wasn't doing a deep anylasis on it, I was just curious how it worked out.

4x4 adds $2,795 to the price.  So ~35k, still actually less then the "average" entry level annual income.

I believe this was the source.

"The average Entry Level salary is $42,963 . Filter by location to see Entry Level salaries in your area. salary estimates are based on 592 salaries submitted anonymously to Glassdoor by Entry Level employees.Jul 1, 2015"
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MechAg94

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #90 on: August 04, 2015, 03:47:01 PM »
Money is not a very good motivator.  But it's a great demotivator if you don't get it right.
That is a good point.  Our management (or HR) has stated that people don't leave the company due to money, but IMO, people will ignore a lot of negatives if the pay is right or those negatives become magnified if they feel underpaid. 
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KD5NRH

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #91 on: August 04, 2015, 03:59:02 PM »
That is a good point.  Our management (or HR) has stated that people don't leave the company due to money, but IMO, people will ignore a lot of negatives if the pay is right or those negatives become magnified if they feel underpaid.

In general, there are so many factors in figuring take home pay (potentially different tax bracket, health plan, child support expanding to absorb its percentage of the new check, etc.) that it's difficult to tell if you're actually getting a raise unless the difference is pretty substantial.  Combine that with having to change routines, and most likely go through another probationary period with minimal to no benefits, and there is a fair incentive to stay put.

Firethorn

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #92 on: August 04, 2015, 04:23:53 PM »
I'd give that a week before somebody figures out how to hack it for DVDs while driving down the interstate, and if we're lucky, they'll have a PiP of the front view in the corner.

Why wait?

I often wonder why they haven't changed the dash into one big LED screen.  People like gauges, but the gauges are just fed electrical signals.  It would be neat to be able to customize your display.

They have: Tesla Model S has it.
http://fontsinuse.com/uses/3997/2013-tesla-model-s-dashboard-display

Well, it's technically 2 displays.

Tallpine

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #93 on: August 04, 2015, 04:26:02 PM »
It would be great to have everything in one place so that it can all quit working at once  :cool:

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Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

Boomhauer

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #94 on: August 04, 2015, 04:28:05 PM »
Can't you tow a heavier trailer with an automatic transmission than with a manual?  Or is that just on cars?

Depends on the transmission. If you've got a HD automatic like an Allison, then hell yeah you can tow a metric fuckton.

Dodge derates the Cummins in the Ram if you have a manual transmission clutch can't handle the torque.

Also real trucks have an automatic transmission. Planetary automatic FTW!












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Tallpine

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #95 on: August 04, 2015, 04:37:25 PM »
Depends on the transmission. If you've got a HD automatic like an Allison, then hell yeah you can tow a metric fuckton.

Dodge derates the Cummins in the Ram if you have a manual transmission clutch can't handle the torque.

We've got a 5 speed Allison in a 5 ton 6x6 and I have to admit that thing works nice :)

"Dodge" - there is the problem  ;)  Nice engines, but too bad they don't come with a truck  :P
Freedom is a heavy load, a great and strange burden for the spirit to undertake. It is not easy. It is not a gift given, but a choice made, and the choice may be a hard one. The road goes upward toward the light; but the laden traveller may never reach the end of it.  - Ursula Le Guin

MechAg94

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #96 on: August 04, 2015, 05:21:54 PM »
It would be great to have everything in one place so that it can all quit working at once  :cool:

My F-150 has a little LCD screen in the dash.  The speedometer, odometer, and other stuff is still in gauges.  They aren't analog readings though.  Loss of power to the dash drops everything.  They could still put little backup gauges around if someone is concerned.  The LED displayes are bright, have good resolution, and last a long time.  The small ones get pretty cheap also.
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RoadKingLarry

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #97 on: August 04, 2015, 08:19:49 PM »
Tallpine: waging war on automatics since 1971  =D

A manly man's transmission

http://www.4wdhub.com/trans/sm420.html

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #98 on: August 04, 2015, 08:56:08 PM »
A manly man's transmission

http://www.4wdhub.com/trans/sm420.html

My Kaiser has one of those in it.


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RoadKingLarry

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Re: Idiot that decided to pay all employees 70K a year? Reality has its say
« Reply #99 on: August 04, 2015, 10:11:21 PM »
Kind of hard to judge scale in that picture but that chain looks kind of puny, I don't think it would hold up to the grandson's tricycle.
 
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.

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