Author Topic: Save The Earth, Kill A Human  (Read 14638 times)

The Rabbi

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Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« on: October 24, 2006, 12:41:28 PM »
More silliness from enviro-whackos.  I saw this same kind of argument in the 1970s.  Wasnt true then, isnt' true now.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20061024/sc_nm/environment_wwf_planet_dc

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BEIJING (Reuters) - Humans are stripping nature at an unprecedented rate and will need two planets' worth of natural resources every year by 2050 on current trends, the WWF conservation group said on Tuesday.
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Populations of many species, from fish to mammals, had fallen by about a third from 1970 to 2003 largely because of human threats such as pollution, clearing of forests and overfishing, the group also said in a two-yearly report.

"For more than 20 years we have exceeded the earth's ability to support a consumptive lifestyle that is unsustainable and we cannot afford to continue down this path," WWF Director-General James Leape said, launching the WWF's 2006 Living Planet Report.

"If everyone around the world lived as those in America, we would need five planets to support us," Leape, an American, said in Beijing.

People in the United Arab Emirates were placing most stress per capita on the planet ahead of those in the United States, Finland and Canada, the report said.

Australia was also living well beyond its means.

The average Australian used 6.6 "global" hectares to support their developed lifestyle, ranking behind the United States and Canada, but ahead of the United Kingdom, Russia, China and Japan.

"If the rest of the world led the kind of lifestyles we do here in Australia, we would require three-and-a-half planets to provide the resources we use and to absorb the waste," said Greg Bourne, WWF-Australia chief executive officer.

Everyone would have to change lifestyles -- cutting use of fossil fuels and improving management of everything from farming to fisheries.

"As countries work to improve the well-being of their people, they risk bypassing the goal of sustainability," said Leape, speaking in an energy-efficient building at Beijing's prestigous Tsinghua University.

"It is inevitable that this disconnect will eventually limit the abilities of poor countries to develop and rich countries to maintain their prosperity," he added.

The report said humans' "ecological footprint" -- the demand people place on the natural world -- was 25 percent greater than the planet's annual ability to provide everything from food to energy and recycle all human waste in 2003.

In the previous report, the 2001 overshoot was 21 percent.

"On current projections humanity, will be using two planets' worth of natural resources by 2050 -- if those resources have not run out by then," the latest report said.

"People are turning resources into waste faster than nature can turn waste back into resources."

RISING POPULATION

"Humanity's footprint has more than tripled between 1961 and 2003," it said. Consumption has outpaced a surge in the world's population, to 6.5 billion from 3 billion in 1960. U.N. projections show a surge to 9 billion people around 2050.

It said that the footprint from use of fossil fuels, whose heat-trapping emissions are widely blamed for pushing up world temperatures, was the fastest-growing cause of strain.

Leape said China, home to a fifth of the world's population and whose economy is booming, was making the right move in pledging to reduce its energy consumption by 20 percent over the next five years.

"Much will depend on the decisions made by China, India and other rapidly developing countries," he added.

The WWF report also said that an index tracking 1,300 vetebrate species -- birds, fish, amphibians, reptiles and mammals -- showed that populations had fallen for most by about 30 percent because of factors including a loss of habitats to farms.

Among species most under pressure included the swordfish and the South African Cape vulture. Those bucking the trend included rising populations of the Javan rhinoceros and the northern hairy-nosed wombat in Australia.
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Ezekiel

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2006, 12:45:52 PM »
More silliness from enviro-whackos.  I saw this same kind of argument in the 1970s.  Wasnt true then, isnt' true now.

We'll know in 2050.

Personally, I think it makes sense to not be an inherently wasteful human, whenever possible.
Zeke

280plus

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2006, 12:47:45 PM »
I thought the World Wrestling Federation was defunct?

 laugh
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CAnnoneer

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #3 on: October 24, 2006, 12:50:20 PM »
Quote from: The Rabbi
More silliness from enviro-whackos.  I saw this same kind of argument in the 1970s.  Wasnt true then, isnt' true now.

Reading will do you good. Start from "Collapse" by J. Diamond.

Headless Thompson Gunner

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #4 on: October 24, 2006, 01:15:36 PM »
Jared Diamond is full of *expletive deleted*it. 

Both "Collapse" and "Guns Germs and Steel" are a complete waste of paper.  If Diamond is concerned about resource depletion he should do the planet a favor and take his books out of print.

The Rabbi

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #5 on: October 24, 2006, 01:19:42 PM »
A very brief look at the reviews on Amazon seems to confirm the Headless one's view.
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SomeKid

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #6 on: October 24, 2006, 01:40:21 PM »
Environmentalists have been harping for decades that in 20 years, we will all be starving because of overconsumption and blah blah blah blah. I know there are quite a few fellow Heinlein readers here, so some of you may have noticed even HE had this bend in his sci-fi for quite some time. The idea of humans suffering mass starvation is a fiction. The only way it will be a reality is if we get a world government like they had in say, the old Soviet Union. Even then it would be directly caused by government idiocy, and not human consumption.

The fact of the matter is this, environmentalists are quite literally, chicken little. The sky is not falling, they are not right.

There is no doubt in my mind that the planet Earth could support 13 billion people all living an Americans lifestyle. Easily. (13 billion is roughly twice the current world population.) The only reason starvation is happening in most of the world is because of government corruption. Zimbabwe USED to be a country that had a surplus of food. Now it has to import it, and that is just one example.

It is infinitely more likely that Christ will return in 2012 than it is the world will come apart because of overconsumption and all the other BS from the lefty kooks.

El Tejon

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #7 on: October 24, 2006, 02:01:02 PM »
As your accepted fearless leader, I will now announce a plan to save us all:  throw all Leftists into the ocean.  We will feed the dolphins and have less waste here on land.

We must do it--for the children. police
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mak

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #8 on: October 24, 2006, 02:09:08 PM »
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Jared Diamond is full of *expletive deleted*it.

Very High class.

Daimond is actually a pretty smart guy. Why dont you try reading it? The world is not ending but there a definitely some things wrong. And that "they are all full of it, I know better than those stupid scientists" kind of attitude is probably the scariest thing to me.

Sindawe

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #9 on: October 24, 2006, 02:44:39 PM »
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As your accepted fearless leader, I will now announce a plan to save us all:  throw all Leftists into the ocean.  We will feed the dolphins...
That is SOOOO CRUEL El Tejon!  What did dolphins ever do to you to warrant such inhumane treatment? grin

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Personally, I think it makes sense to not be an inherently wasteful human, whenever possible.
Concur.  We don't yet know what the actual carrying capacity of the planet is, but since its the only one we got at this point in time, its foolishness to push it until it breaks.
I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.

mak

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #10 on: October 24, 2006, 03:01:04 PM »
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The fact of the matter is this, environmentalists are quite literally, chicken little. The sky is not falling, they are not right.

The fact of the matter is, unless you come out of the closet and reveal your nobel prize in science, you are ridiculous.

Sindawe

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #11 on: October 24, 2006, 03:04:41 PM »
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The fact of the matter is, unless you come out of the closet and reveal your nobel prize in science, you are ridiculous.
So unless one has won a Nobel Prize in one of the sciences, one cannot comment on scientific issue?

OK, lets see YOURS.
I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.

mak

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #12 on: October 24, 2006, 03:08:03 PM »
Dont put words in my mouth. I said he was ridiculous and a nobel prize would make him less so. So what?

Headless Thompson Gunner

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #13 on: October 24, 2006, 03:18:31 PM »
Nobel Prizes, Pulitzers, etc are awarded to the man who best advances the politically correct agenda.  They have long ceased to be a measure of intellect, ability, or accuracy.  These awards have become a way for leftists to pat themselves on the back.

Want an example?  Jimmy Carter has ben awarded a Nobel Peace Prize and Ronald Reagan hasn't.  Yet which one of these men have done more to create tangible worldwide peace?

SomeKid

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2006, 03:23:26 PM »
mak,

So I am ridiculous am I? I guess you won't have any hard time at all refuting my ridiculous post.

After all, I have no Nobel prize, so obviously I know nothing. Would you be so kind as to show me yours while you refute my ridiculous post?

If you can't, it may be ridiculous...

Headless Thompson Gunner

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #15 on: October 24, 2006, 03:25:18 PM »
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Jared Diamond is full of *expletive deleted*it.

Very High class.

Daimond is actually a pretty smart guy. Why dont you try reading it? The world is not ending but there a definitely some things wrong. And that "they are all full of it, I know better than those stupid scientists" kind of attitude is probably the scariest thing to me.
Why do you assume that I haven't read any of his books?

I read Guns Germs and Steel and found Diamond's theories in it to be highly lacking.  I haven't yet read his newer book, because I frankly doubt it will be any better than his first.  But someday, when I have the time, I'll give it a go.

As for the scientists, well...  Do you really want to get into that?  (Hint, run a search for "global warming" - we've been down this road before.)

mak

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #16 on: October 24, 2006, 03:31:33 PM »
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So I am ridiculous am I? I guess you won't have any hard time at all refuting my ridiculous post.



I am ridiculous, you are ridiculous, we are all circus freaks. Our pathetic little brains see a tiny sliver of the universe for less than the blink of an eye. Yet we think of ourselves as gods with all our stupid pride. And scientists are among the most prideful of all in their intellectually arrogant guesses at the nature of existence. They seem to guess better at certain things than I can though. Things like pollution and extinction and....dare I say it? Global warming. OOOOoooh. So when the entire world body of scientists with the exception of a few being paid by the energy industry say there is a problem- I guess I will go with there less ridiculous guess.

SomeKid

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #17 on: October 24, 2006, 03:32:42 PM »
HTG, good point on who gets awarded those prizes. Let us not forget good ole terrorist Arafat got one as well.

Sindawe, isn't it interesting that this guy who demands I have one, doesn't have one, and now the idea of having one is a 'So what?' point.

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I am ridiculous, you are ridiculous

Well, the first part is at least right.

Also, this isn't just about scientists. It is about history. For a hundred years they have been screaming like chicken little the sky was falling. They have always been wrong. In the 70's it was global cooling that would kill us all, now it is global warming. For the past hundred years the world was over-populated, we were all going to starve, the world could not sustain us all, yet, here we are. Yah think maybe, just maybe, the cause of the more than likely mythical global warming is the hot air spewed forth by these guys?

mak

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #18 on: October 24, 2006, 03:35:24 PM »
I did not demand. Such intolerance. I am going to have to report all of you to the ACLU. They will take care of you. And I will be there watching and laughing as you are taken to the gallows. Oh yes!

Iain

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #19 on: October 24, 2006, 03:37:15 PM »
As for the scientists, well...  Do you really want to get into that?  (Hint, run a search for "global warming" - we've been down this road before.)

We have, and it all proved was that one man's scientist is another man's _____________ (insert pejorative here). Works both ways, and turns out very silly.
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Headless Thompson Gunner

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #20 on: October 24, 2006, 03:44:51 PM »
What we established was that there is ample reason to both believe and disbelieve the so-called "consensus" on modern environmentalism.

In other words, we've shown that agnosticism is the most rational viewpoint regarding these issues.

Bottom line: If mak wants to "prove" his view by pointing to science, then I am ready and able to provide ample scientific reason to disbelieve his particular scientists.

Sindawe

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #21 on: October 24, 2006, 03:48:45 PM »
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I did not demand. Such intolerance. I am going to have to report all of you to the ACLU. They will take care of you. And I will be there watching and laughing as you are taken to the gallows. Oh yes!
  *SNIFF SNIFF*  Could that be Troll I smell?

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Sindawe, isn't it interesting that this guy who demands I have one, doesn't have one, and now the idea of having one is a 'So what?' point.
Indeed it is Somekid.  'Prolly some college kid with a Liberal Arts major, minoring in Ethnic Studies.
I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.

mak

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #22 on: October 24, 2006, 03:51:50 PM »
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I am ready and able to provide ample scientific reason to disbelieve his particular scientists.

Well, belief is not what science is about. Go on You Tube and watch Stephen Colbert at the last White House press corps dinner and he explains this quite well. I believe H-bombs work but you dont believe the planet is heating up. Both have to do with science. You figure it out.

Iain

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #23 on: October 24, 2006, 03:52:26 PM »
Which was pretty much exactly what I was saying at the time. That all got kind of lost though.
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mak

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Re: Save The Earth, Kill A Human
« Reply #24 on: October 24, 2006, 03:54:57 PM »
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Could that be Troll I smell?

That would be my cue to say goodbye. Funny how all these little groups scream TROLL!! when someone actually disagrees with their stupidity. Real open minded, real americans.