Fake news from Denmark

[Hawkmoon]

https://metro.co.uk/2022/07/03/denmark-several-people-killed-at-shopping-centre-in-copenhagen-16934991/

Mass shooting in a shopping mall? IMPOSSIBLE! Everyone knows that only happens in the U.S.A.

[dogmush]

Ah yes, that wonderful habit of attempting to use every tragedy in the world to make a political point.  I see you've assimilated the best habits of the leftists.

[WLJ]

Ah yes, that wonderful habit of attempting to use every tragedy in the world to make a political point.  I see you've assimilated the best habits of the leftists.

So pointing out hypocrisy is hypocrisy.....or something

[HankB]

How many times have the leftists insisted that "Mass shootings ONLY happen in the USA" or something of the sort? Clearly not true.

In civilized discourse, bringing contrary evidence to the fore is a reasonable response to untruthful assertions.

[dogmush]

Indeed, pointing out hypocrisy is useful, although doing it in an echo chamber limits that usefulness.  Had he done so with a modicum of respect for the fact that people died he wouldn't have been an ahole.

However what he did was pull a tragedy from the news, zero in on the one aspect that he could use against his political foes, and regurgitate it as if the fact the leftists are wrong about where mass shootings occur is the most important aspect of that story.

That's the ahole move. It's an ahole movie when David Hogg and Everytown do it, and it's an ahole move when Hawkmoon does it. It's capitalizing on deaths to score cheap political points.  Cheap in this case, because he only did it on here, where everyone agrees with him on gun control's lack of effectiveness.

[Perd Hapley]

Unless Hawkmoon is talking to the Danes (and I don't think we have any here), there's nothing cheap about what he said. Our side also needs reminders that mass murders are not something that only happen in America, with our crazy, American gun laws. Anyway, it's not as if APS has right-wing and left-wing subforums, and he only posted to the right-wing subforum.

If anything, the echo chamber-ness of APS makes it a better place for this thread. It's not Twitter or Facebook, or some other, high-profile site that "everyone" reads. Hawkmoon isn't going to make any money from this thread, or sell anymore books, or get an interview on FOX. He's just talking to like-minded people. So what's the harm?

I think we're allowed to have political discussions here, and that's what Hawkmoon started - probably should have gone in Politics, of course. Someone else could start a thread on the shooting, itself, if they like.

[dogmush]

I didn't say he was wrong, I said he was an ahole about it, and in the same specific way the gun control advocates are aholes.

You're correct that it's unlikely that any Danes or relatives of the dead will see it, and so it's unlikely that anyone involved got to see APS be callous and crass, but we still were callous and crass.

[HankB]

Hawkmoon was entirely straightforward - his comment was directed with pinpoint precision at people in the USA who insist that mass shootings only happen HERE. He didn't lampoon the victims, he didn't mock their families, he directed his comment against those who insist - wrongly - that other countries don't have mass shootings at all. It was clearly sarcasm and was in no way actual denial (as in the Alex Jones Sandy Hook sense) that the incident actually happened.

Ahole? Callous? Crass? Cheap?

Balderdash.

[Perd Hapley]

I didn't say he was wrong, I said he was an ahole about it, and in the same specific way the gun control advocates are aholes.

You're correct that it's unlikely that any Danes or relatives of the dead will see it, and so it's unlikely that anyone involved got to see APS be callous and crass, but we still were callous and crass.

Should we have sent flowers, instead?

[MillCreek]

Should we have sent flowers, instead?

No, no, no! Thoughts and prayers!

[dogmush]

You really don't see the difference between:

Mass Hooting at a Mall in Denmark:
Several people died in a mall in Copenhagen when a guy went crazy with a gun.  Just goes to show that even pretty strict gun control doesn't 100% prevent crazy aholes with guns.  Too bad that's something the anti-gunners will never acknowledge.

and

Mass shooting in a shopping mall? IMPOSSIBLE! Everyone knows that only happens in the U.S.A.

He could make his point and start a conversation while acknowledging that actual people died. People that probably don't give a *expletive deleted*it about US gun laws, and were worth more than political commentary.  But he didn't. 

You guys are free to continue patting yourself on the back that he pointed out a hypocrisy well known to all on APS.  I've said my piece as well as I can.

[cordex]

Hawkmoon could certainly have phrased it more considerately, although the emotional distance between myself and the victims is sufficient that I confess not having had the same visceral reaction as dogmush.

I've known a lot of people who have served in every branch of the military except Space Force, but dogmush may well be the first I've known to go white knight over dark humor and insufficient sensitivity.

[bedlamite]

Being nice to the political left in this country has gotten us nowhere.

[WLJ]

Being nice to the political left in this country has gotten us nowhere.

What? It's gotten us Drag Queen Story Hour at our local libraries.

[Nick1911]

I find these threads citing examples of "bad things happening in places where there are strict gun laws" very tiring myself, to the point of usually avoiding them entirely.  The dripping sarcasm is grating.

Further, it's disingenuous to point at specific instances to attempt to prove a point about the efficacy of policies.  There's statistical outliers in everything.  If you're cherry picking them, you're not being honest.

[Perd Hapley]

You really don't see the difference between:

Only that Hawkmoon was more succinct, and he had no illusions he was being more respectful to the victims. Your version really said nothing Hawkmoon didn't say.

[Perd Hapley]

I find these threads citing examples of "bad things happening in places where there are strict gun laws" very tiring myself, to the point of usually avoiding them entirely.  The dripping sarcasm is grating.

Further, it's disingenuous to point at specific instances to attempt to prove a point about the efficacy of policies.  There's statistical outliers in everything.  If you're cherry picking them, you're not being honest.

As long as there are headlines like this:

https://en.as.com/latest_news/gun-laws-in-other-countries-why-dont-mass-shootings-happen-outside-of-the-us-n/

then the OP is useful, and probably necessary.

[MillCreek]

I've known a lot of people who have served in every branch of the military except Space Force,

Well, what do you have against the Space Force? :)

[Nick1911]

As long as there are headlines like this:

https://en.as.com/latest_news/gun-laws-in-other-countries-why-dont-mass-shootings-happen-outside-of-the-us-n/

then the OP is useful, and probably necessary.

Did you find it useful and necessary?

[cordex]

Well, what do you have against the Space Force? :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_x6vkwXkKM

[Perd Hapley]

Did you find it useful and necessary?

I found it useful, as I was unaware of that story. Personally, I would have had the same thought that Hawkmoon did, but it's quite possible not everyone connects the same dots.

Just going by memory, but I think most of these threads are in the politics forum. We treat them like political events right off the bat. That's because every one of them is used to try to restrict our rights. It would be nice if we didn't have to deal with that.

[Hawkmoon]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_x6vkwXkKM

Was that the Space Force, or the Space Farce?

[WLJ]

I found it useful, as I was unaware of that story. Personally, I would have had the same thought that Hawkmoon did, but it's quite possible not everyone connects the same dots.

Just going by memory, but I think most of these threads are in the politics forum. We treat them like political events right off the bat. That's because every one of them is used to try to restrict our rights. It would be nice if we didn't have to deal with that.

Yep I already had this story in another thread in the politics section for that reason. Shootings very nearly always get politicize in one form or another.

[Perd Hapley]

Yep I already had this story in another thread in the politics section for that reason. Shootings very nearly always get politicize in one form or another.

And mass shootings are politicized as soon as they are reported.

[WLJ]

And mass shootings are politicized as soon as they are reported.

And they're sometimes political to begin with